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Dev Diary #99 - Ground Combat & Army Rework

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris dev diary. Today's dev diary is about some changes coming to ground combat and armies in the 2.0 'Cherryh' update. This will be the last dev diary before we take a break for the holidays, so there will be no diaries in the next week or the week after that. Stellaris dev diaries return on Thursday January 11th, 2018.

Defense Armies and Fortresses
Constructing Defense Armies have always been largely a meaningless exercise in Stellaris. While they are useful for reducing Unrest and occasionally might be able to beat off an unprepared attacker, the fact that a planet is capped on how many armies can be defending it while the attacker is *not* capped on how many armies are attacking, coupled with the general weakness of defense armies, means that defending a planet against a ground invasion is generally an exercise in futility and will at most delay an attacker by a few weeks. However, if we solved this by just making defense armies a lot stronger or capping the number of attacking units, the result would turn every invasion of a backwater colony into a big affair - something that is not particularly desirable when a war can involve several different actors with hundreds of planets between them.

For this reason, we have decided to rework Defense Armies into something that is actually useful, but requires a significant investment of resources to muster more than a token defense. Instead of being directly buildable by the empire, defense armies are created from certain buildings. The capital building will produce defense armies depending on its level, as will some other planetary uniques like Military Academy. If you want a planet to be well defended, however, you will need to construct Fortress building on its tiles. Fortresses require a pop to work them, do not produce any other resources than a small amount of Unity, but provide a significant amount of defense armies to protect the planet. Armies spawned by Fortresses are also impervious to orbital bombardment, and will not be able to be killed without first ruining the building itself. The armies generated by a building have their species and type set by the pop working it, so a Very Strong Battle Thrall will produce several powerful defense armies if placed on a Fortress, and special pops like Droids will produce their own variants like Robotic Defense Armies rather than the normal ones. Fortified worlds will also be able to be fit with an FTL inhibitor (the exact way they get them is not yet determined) that prevents enemy fleets from leaving the system unless the world is captured, which allows for the creation of Fortress Worlds to protect strategically important systems.
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(Building icon is a placeholder)

One more important change related to Defense Armies is a change to Unrest: Armies on planets no longer reduce Unrest directly. Instead, to handle a planet with high Unrest, you will need to construct Fortress-style buildings or take other measures (such as using Edicts) to reduce the planetary Unrest. This means you cannot simply capture a planet and then spam a dozen defense armies to immediately zero out the Unrest. As part of this, we will be balancing certain events and effect to ensure newly captured worlds do not instantly defect back to their former owner.

Finally, as part of all these changes Defense Armies have received a general buff and there are several new technologies that unlock additional tiers of forts and various improvements to Defense Armies' combat ability, meaning that they will grow stronger alongside the invention of new, more powerful assault armies.

Assault Army Management
A major aim of our changes to armies is to reduce the amount of unnecessary micromanagement of armies. For this reason, and to make Assault Armies' role more explicit, we have decided to change Assault Armies to always be based in space. Whenever not directly engaged in an invasion, Assault Armies will now always automatically embark onto their transports, ready to be used to invade another world. We also aim to fix the minor but immersion-breaking bug where transport fleets are giving endlessly increasing sequential names whenever they land and embark again.

Combat Width, Retreating and Collateral Damage
Another change to ground combat is the introduction of new mechanics in the form of Combat Width. Combat Width is determined by the size of the planet, and decides how many armies can be taking and receiving damage at the same time: For example, if 20 assault armies invade a world held by 10 defense armies with a combat width of 10, all 10 defense armies will be immediately engaged in battle while only half the assault armies will be able to deal and receive damage, with additional assault armies joining the fray as the armies in front of them are destroyed. This means that it is no longer possible to take a well defended world without losses by simply throwing a hundred clone armies at it: If you wish to minimize losses (and thus War Exhaustion), you will need to invest in expensive, high-maintenance elite armies.
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(Interface not final)

We've also added the concept of Collateral Damage: As armies fight on the planet, civilians and civilian infrastructure is caught in the fighting. Each time an army deals damage in battle, it will inflict a random amount of Collateral Damage, which increases Planetary Damage similar to Orbital Bombardment (see below) and can lead to the death of Pops and the destruction of buildings and tiles. Some armies will deal more Collateral Damage than others: For example, Xenomorph armies are highly destructive and cost-efficient, but will wreak immense havoc on the planet, potentially leaving it in ruins in the process of capturing it for your empire.

While working on combat mechanics we also took the time to change the way Morale Damage works, making it something that is suffered by both sides (instead of just the loser) and making the effects of it more gradual, so that armies suffer a drop in combat efficiency once they are <50% morale, and then another, sharper drop when they are broken (0% morale). This should make certain armies, such as Psi Armies, highly effective against low-morale opponents like Slave Armies, but less effective against an unfeeling army of Droids. Finally, we've also tweaked the damage-dealing algorithm so that damage is less evenly spread among combatants, making it so that even an outnumbered force can destroy regiments and inflict war exhaustion on the enemy.
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Finally, we have made some changes to retreats. When an attacker retreats from a ground combat, there is now a significant chance that each retreating regiment is destroyed while attempting to return to space, making retreat a risky endeavour and eliminating the tactic of simply send in the same army again and again in wave attacks, instead making retreats something you do in order to preserve at least some of your army in a poorly chosen engagement.

Orbital Bombardment Changes
Finally, again in the interest of reducing the micromanagement needed during war, we've changed the way orbital bombardment works. Fortifications have been entirely cut from planets, so that there is no need to bombard lightly defended worlds before going in with the ground troops. Instead, we have added a requirement that planets cannot be invaded if there is a hostile Starbase in the system, so that transports cannot snipe worlds that are protected by defensive installations present in the same system. Orbital Bombardment, instead of being something you have to manage and wait for in every single planetary engagement, is now something you do to soften up a particularly well defended target, or simply to wreak havoc on the enemy's planet and drive up their War Exhaustion.

As a planet is bombarded, the fleet will deal Planetary Damage, ruining buildings and killing Pops. Bombarding fleets will also do damage to armies present on the planet (unless those armies are protected by a Fortress), and over a long enough time can decimate a defending force, though doing so will likely cause heavy damage to the planet and may delay the attacker long enough that the owner of the planet has time to build up their forces or inflict enough war exhaustion to force a peace. The rate at which the planet is damaged can also be slowed with the construction of buildings such as Planetary Defense Shield, further dragging out the process.

As part of these changes, we've consolidated the Bombardment Stances into the following:
  • Selective: Deals normal damage to armies/buildings and light damage to pops. Cannot kill the last 10 pops.
  • Indiscriminate: Deals heavy damage to armies, buildings and pops. Cannot kill the last 5 pops.
  • Armageddon: Deals massive damage to armies, buildings and pops. Can turn planets into depopulated Tomb Worlds with enough bombardment. Only available to certain empires such as Purifiers.

Attachments
Finally, on the topic of attachments, we have decided to cut them entirely from the game. We discussed a variety of ways to improve the way you assign them, but ultimately decided that we already have so many types of armies and not nearly enough combat mechanics to justify a significant investment of UI time that could go towards something like the Fleet Manager instead. The technologies that previously unlocked attachments will be changed to give other effects, such as direct buffs to certain army types.

That's all for today! As I said, we're now going on hiatus, so I'll see you again on January 11th with a dev diary about... well, that's a secret, actually. You'll just have to wait and see!
 
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There's nothing eventually about warp and wormholes. They are immediate invalidation of chokepoints from early game on. Jump drives are eventually. They're late game and they have drawbacks forcing them to only be used in some tactical situations.

Slowing down a warp will not force that empire to ever consider fighting at the chokepoint.
Seconded.

Making something that stops 3 options that are so separate and distinct on the fundamental and mechanical level can never not be a mess.
 
I'm pretty okay with the elimination of attachments. I liked them but I'd forget about buying them when I made troops and then have to tediously go one by one to make sure they all had it. Turning them into a buff to armies? Sounds good to me. I will miss robots riding around on xenomorphs though.

I personally enjoyed putting Psi Warriors on my Titanic Beasts.
 
Yes. We realize this is a bit odd, but compare the amount of times you would actually use an assault army to defend a planet compared to the amount of times you have to click 'embark' after invading one...

I don't mind the change, but it would be nice to be able to move ground reinforcements around... Will you still be able to have your assault armies join a defensive ground battle, or would you have to wait until the colony was occupied?
 
Cheers for the DD Wiz, some more great changes, should make the planetary conquest side of things a bit more interesting/strategic :cool:. Here's wishing you and the rest of the Stellaris team a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year :D.
 
Yes. We realize this is a bit odd, but compare the amount of times you would actually use an assault army to defend a planet compared to the amount of times you have to click 'embark' after invading one...

much better Idea, from reddit:

"I'm with you there. I'd much prefer that armies be incorporated into ships as part of fleet design, perhaps as an aux item slot. This means that on your battleship you can fit a shield capacitor and a regenerative hull module but no troops. Or you can instead drop either a shield capacitor or regenerative hull module in exchange for a detachment of marines. It forces tradeoffs. Do you want ships that can invade, or do you want those afterburners or shield capacitors?
It also minimizes micromanagement, because your troops are within the fleet itself."

and also:
"And adds justification for the whole "cant defend planets anymore" as theyre attached to the fleet, not independently moving armies"

https://www.reddit.com/r/Stellaris/comments/7la4z2/dev_diary_99_ground_combat_army_rework/drl06el/
 
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@Wiz Considering the idea that you'll have to have multiple fleets and high probability that any invading force will consist of a few frontline fleets and a few "bombing" fleets, I would like to suggest forsaking "transport" vessel class all-together and instead make "drop capsule" weapon type for normal ships. It might be a nice thing to also add weapons for actual planetary bombing, removing or significantly crippling fleets bombardment capability without those specialized weapons.

Rationale: from what I've got it's pointless to attack a planet unless all of it's fortresses are destroyed. So basically you'll send a fleet to hover over the planet and will be forced to check once in a while if they've got fortresses or not. Considering that it will take a while and that fleet will be nailed to the planed to the time being - that will hardly be one of your main force fleets. As we already have an algorithm that can tell if your land victory is probable or not for "land armies" order, why not merge the fleet and the transports so you can issue the "invade" order and just wait until it's done and get a nice notification once the invasion is complete. It would obviously require some way to setup an invasion casualty stance, similar to bombardment stance - how much of remaining resistance is considered "ok" to start the land phase.

As a bonus it will also make army fleets less fragile and possibly actually armed and will result in less stupid AI situations when one 500 points station can basically lock a 1k+ points transport fleet (unarmed otherwise) for a few hours of real time. This way it will be a fight and usual fight resolution rules will apply and AI will either win or retreat.

That might be a lot of work on adding new components/visuals though, so maybe consider that as an idea for future work :)
 
Yes. We realize this is a bit odd, but compare the amount of times you would actually use an assault army to defend a planet compared to the amount of times you have to click 'embark' after invading one...

I would prefer if they could defend your own planets at least, even if they refuse to stay on invaded ones.. but that's mostly because I don't want them sniped from the sky or catching fire in the earlier stages of the war. They are difficult enough to escort to the target as is.
 
There's nothing eventually about warp and wormholes. They are immediate invalidation of chokepoints from early game on. Jump drives are eventually. They're late game and they have drawbacks forcing them to only be used in some tactical situations.

Slowing down a warp will not force that empire to ever consider fighting at the chokepoint.

Eventually is in time of arrival to the target system.
If you have to make 2 to 5 warp-jumps to get in range of that system you are being slowed down quite well. If your warp jump is a month (or even months in the worst case scenarios) long you are slowed decently well. The choking in this case is done via the slowdown effect deployed by FTL-inhibitors, while actual fortifying is done at important planets with your fleets ready to respomd as the welcome commettee to the invaders.
Very similar flavor to what we'll get, but allows slightly more freedom of movement and escapes the trouble of having to go through each system en route to our destination. Has some troubles to figure out, like balancing how much to slow down and if its possible to overwelm/disable the inhibitor field from range, but i still see it as a more interesting system. One reason, i think the Devs didn't go for it, is because the game slowed down the most, doing calculations while ships were in Warp transit.

Anyway, with hyperdrives there is a different problem. First, it's very similar to Sins of Solar Empire. It's not a bad thing to copy it, but there is the problem of chokepoints
it is very clear in SoaSE:
The enemy is detected well before his arrival, each frontier system is easily reinforced from its neighbours, giving your fleets time to arrive and mop up the enemy. Or usually it's you, the player, who kills everything in the invaded system before reinforcements arrive and then you murder enemy's second wave and then it's clean up of each and every system until the enemy surrenders. And everything is slow, because traveling between distant systems(planets in SoaSE) is only moderately fast and same with FTL. So i am worrying that any fight with bigger empires will be like SoaSE. They won't be able to rebuild enough of a fleet to threaten the player's deathball or go on offensive and once their initial fleet is destroyed it will be just clean up.
 
Love these changes, especially the idea of fortress worlds and the tomb world creating Armageddon bombing. However I wonder about the bombardment stances, honestly I think that non of them should be limited by ethics or governing traits, after-all even democratic or non militaristic societies have engaged in widespread civilian bombing (i.e nearly every power in WW2) it would make sense that if faced with a horrible enemy that even the nicest society would engage in Armageddon bombing.
 
Since many people are afraid of army transports being vulnerable... why can't we arm the transports? Perhaps have a researchable "armed transport" hull that has 4 small turrets and one PD, and more room for shields and armor. Perhaps even another level to this with an even better-defended and more capable armed transport that's an effective combat ship in its own right, so it could travel as part of your combat fleet.
 
If assault armies can defend planets the entire change with the fort system is pointless as everyone will simply build assault armies instead of using a tile for a fort.

Since many people are afraid of army transports being vulnerable... why can't we arm the transports? Perhaps have a researchable "armed transport" hull that has 4 small turrets and one PD, and more room for shields and armor. Perhaps even another level to this with an even better-defended and more capable armed transport that's an effective combat ship in its own right, so it could travel as part of your combat fleet.
Because transport ships are free and can be "build" without starports/shipyards. Thus they should not be effective combat ships.
 
I always like development of games. What i less like it seems a lot copy of past of the same game mechanics of CKII EuIV Hoi4 so for me i am a bit disappointed that stellaris is going the way that it would be more a reskin of other games. For example combat with. Be more creative pls.
 
Seeing as the current Fortress icon is a placeholder, maybe go for something that looks like a massive bunker.
Or something like the anti-air towers from WWII Germany, maybe with the base looking a bit more like an Albanian bunker (but obviously upsized). I think both of those buildings are pretty good historical examples of what these strongholds are meant to accomplish.

Regarding the developer diary I am really, really looking forward to turtling up and playing tall this update. Defend all my choke points with ring worlds/full habitat systems with fortress worlds and military fortresses, build ring worlds and habitats in every other system and have at least one in each system be a dedicated fortress/FTL inhibitor world, all paid for at least in part by my Dyson Sphere and protecting my science Nexus and sentry array at the core of my empire. It's going to be really hard saving up for all those megastructures and fortresses and habitats with not a large mineral base because not many systems, but I'll be damned if any aggressor will take one inch of my territory without paying for it in oceans of blood. You can have the rest of the galaxy, I just want this bit.
 
Love these changes, especially the idea of fortress worlds and the tomb world creating Armageddon bombing. However I wonder about the bombardment stances, honestly I think that non of them should be limited by ethics or governing traits, after-all even democratic or non militaristic societies have engaged in widespread civilian bombing (i.e nearly every power in WW2) it would make sense that if faced with a horrible enemy that even the nicest society would engage in Armageddon bombing.

Fanatic Purifiers can apparently be conquered without claims, just as they can do to others. Maybe the normal bombardment rules wont apply to FPs/devouring swarms/determined exterminators.

Or maybe you'll just have to wear your white hat and like it. Who knows? Personally I'd be cool with either way
 
If assault armies can defend planets the entire change with the fort system is pointless as everyone will simply build assault armies instead of using a tile for a fort.
First, since forts also provide unity, some may build them just for that reason.

Second, if assault army upkeep actually becomes substantial, while forts provide similar strength with far less upkeep, they could still be the better choice.

For example... Say a tier 3 fort provides 3 unity, takes 2 energy, and provides 6 strong defense armies. And say those defense armies (which now scale with tech) are as strong as 3 gene warriors, or 18 regular assault armies. And say 3 gene warrors or 18 assault armies have an upkeep of 12 energy. Bam, you're getting more out of that fort than replacing it with a power plant + assault armies. Now you can use assault armies as a fast way to shore up defenses, while forts still make more sense.
 
The only problem i see here is that planetary defence does not matter. As in a status quo peace the planet would get transferred if you own the star base....
 
If assault armies are not gonna be able to stay on owned planets, what about making defense armies able to move (yet not to attack).
But what I didn't anderstand tho is will the new defense armies only be generated from buildings or will it be a building + flat-number-manualy-built armies? (If it's only from buildings, i'm taking back what I said about mooving them).


On an other subject it looks like non-loosing armies will now suffer loses, that could make it worth it to have an "easy rebuilt" mechanic, just like fleets are gonna have. Could wait a few patch tho.
 
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