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EU4 - Development Diary - 4th of June 2019

Hello again! In previous weeks we’ve shown you revamped maps of Italy and German and the revitalized political setups in these regions. Today will be no different as we delve into the land of cheese, wine, and élan!

dd_france.png


The most striking thing you’ll notice about this new setup is the return of the French “vassal swarm”. The Duchies of Orleans, Bourbonnais, Auvergne, Armagnac, and Foix will be returning to the game alongside their glorious but rarely-seen Hundred Years War unit models. But how will you balance this, I preemptively hear you asking? Won’t France need extra diplomatic relations to cope with this? Won’t France be horrendously overpowered in the early game? Fear not, for we have answers and solutions - which I am not going to reveal today.

So, what's up with balkanized France? The reality is that in 1444, the Kingdom of France was quite decentralized. The Hundred Years War had forced the King to enact new taxes to finance his troops which led to several revolts and conspiracies from its nobility. That conflict continued for most of the second half of the 15th century. Historically the crown prevailed and managed to bring France toward centralization and absolutism, but in EU4 it won't be a given. Hence we decided to make that part of the French gameplay by representing the strongest Dukes and Counts as vassals in 1444.
  • Orléans was the strongest of them and often the leader of the resistance against the Crown. The head of the House of Orléans in 1444 was Charles the First, a cousin of the King who spent 25 years in English captivity. His son Louis would historically become King of France later on following the extinction of the main Valois branch.
  • The Duchy of Bourbon (or Bourbonnais) is held by Jean II, an up and coming noble that illustrated himself in combat the same year our game starts. Historically, he sided with the King's party, but changed side later on after losing a prestigious office.
  • Armagnac is in a tight spot. The result of CK2-style border gore, his possessions are spread across central and southern France. Its leader, Jean IV, recently took part in a failed revolt against the King and is kept on a tight leash.
  • Foix is held by Count Gaston IV, also General Lieutenant of the French Armies of Gascony and Guyenne.

You’ll also notice that France and its subjects (nominal and otherwise) have a handful of additional provinces. I mentioned in a previous dev diary a desire to include Foix, Carcassonne, Toulon, and La Marche. All of these have made it in to this iteration of the map. Toulon felt especially valuable due to its status as a major base of naval operations for France later in the timeframe, and as you’ll see in an upcoming dev diary the establishment of this great arsenal is an important part of more than one new mission tree. We also found room for Forez, which allows us to represent the divide between the crown and Bourbon territories. Blois beefs up the Duchy of Orleans, the most powerful of the French vassal states and often a thorn in the side of the French kings.

To better represent the divide between western (Ducal Burgundy) and eastern (Free HRE Country Burgundy), we added the province of Salins and its large salt mine. This lead us to split Burgundy in two, but instead of following the Imperial divide we elected instead to make two balanced states with one holding land on both sides, making any division an imperfect choice that is sure to spark more conflict in the future.

dd_geneva.png


Another addition to the political setup is the city-state of Geneva, here represented in 1444 as a vassal of Savoy. Geneva was subject to Savoy until 1524, and up to that point had a troubled relationship with its overlord. The House of Savoy repeatedly attempted to increase their control over the city to little avail except to alienate its citizens and foster a desire for independence. Local authorities sought to ally with the Swiss cantons, and the city would eventually join the Swiss Confederacy. In addition, the old province of Savoy has been split between Anessi and Ciamber.

dd_ned.png


Moving further away from France, we’ve also made some changes to the Low Countries. I’ve spoken before regarding our concerns about adding provinces to this region. We want it to retain the feeling of being a highly developed and densely populated region, and adding new provinces would force us to split development to the point that it might lose that feeling. We have however managed to squeeze in two additional provinces: ‘s-Hertogenbosch has been cut off from Breda, and Rysel adds a province to Flanders. We’ve also revised the Utrecht-Frisia border to reflect historical divisions of the Dutch provinces. Speaking of Frisia, we have at long last added Frisian culture to the game. You’ll find Frisians inhabiting the provinces of Friesland, Groningen, and Ostfriesland. We’ve also redrawn the area map, doing away with the “Netherlands” area and adding a distinction between North and South Brabant.

Last week I promised a look at the Balkans alongside France, but we’ve decided instead to dedicate an entire dev diary to this topic. Expect to see that in a couple of weeks, as our next dev diary will cover some of the new mission trees in the French and Dutch region. Until then, let us know what you think of the new map setup as well as which mission trees you want to see next week.
 
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Also, on the topic of Savoy, it may interest you to know that the Duchy starts Italian, but Annecy and Chambéry start as French, and there will be an easy way for the Savoyards to become French if they so please (more on that later ;) ).

Changing the savoy provinces from Italian to French is wonderful news. And thank you for all the dynamic names you made for the new provinces, it is much appreciated :)

Since Savoy and Geneva are both of French culture, can we perhaps expect a new Arpitan culture as part of the more that comes later? ;)
 
I wouldn't say France has weak ideas, its one of the best sets in the game, i would argue instead that maybe Poland is a bit too militarily strong.
I would agree. I cant really understand how Poland can have best military ideas than France. And arguably than Sweden. The quasi century of peace and prosperity, making the PLC one of the most developped (culture Wise) country, is almost forgotten.



Maybe, depends on what you mean by "big".
+20fort defense and -20 siege ability // +20% fort maintenance. That is Indeed huge, but Vauban spent décades reworking the borders of France, and its fort were still in use 3 centuries after he was dead. He also wrote book on "how to siege", and changed the way French Royal Army would conquer places. He also struggled a lot against attritions during sieges and even said that the French were of such a kind, that the would take useless risks just to prove their bravery. Leading to avoidable death during sieges.

Moreover, in MP or RP that would lead the player not to blob but to carefully choose the province it conquers so he can stick a fort on it. And the bonus//malus would be a specific of France. The fort maintenance increase would be fair to depict the heavy engineering involved by Vauban

You are right, however i doubt Paradox would bother giving new Republican idea sets for revolutionary nations, but if they did France would gain a lot of flavour potential.
I think that would be the least some nations could hope for. At least Russia, France, and PLC. Maybe adding a decision making it possible to go revolutionnary for those country when some conditions are met?

Fantastic idea! The French corsairs were the scourge of the Atlantic.
I slightlydisagree.
Corsairs were a thing mainly during the 7YW... Which lasted 7 years. Historically speaking, it was used because the Brit litteraly pre captured, before the war, thousands of French sailors, and that Louis XV was too much of a Pacifist to react soundly. It is really anecdotical and im not sure National ideas are supposed to support such things. What's more, it is not a good depiction of what was the French navy, at the time, and privateering bonus is so situationnal that its almost useless.
I can propose something else that not only illustrate the French navy, and give a boost that will be usable against the traditionnal French rivals (NL, Spain, Portugal and UK).

"74 canons" A 1740 design that lasted almost until 1820. It was adopted by all the principal nations of the game, and it changed naval warfare.
The bonus could be " Heavy ship ability +15% / Heavy ship maintenance -10%".
"Finally the dream of Colbert and Richelieu came true. Those ships, agile as a fregate, armed as a third rate, are now produced in great Numbers. France has now the Tools to prevail on seas."

@neondt can we hope to have a change in French (and other majors) ideas?

Changing the savoy provinces from Italian to French is wonderful news. And thank you for all the dynamic names you made for the new provinces, it is much appreciated :)

Since Savoy and Geneva are both of French culture, can we perhaps expect a new Arpitan culture as part of the more that comes later? ;)
Hope so !!!
 
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Changing the savoy provinces from Italian to French is wonderful news. And thank you for all the dynamic names you made for the new provinces, it is much appreciated :)

Since Savoy and Geneva are both of French culture, can we perhaps expect a new Arpitan culture as part of the more that comes later? ;)
Changing the culture in the provinces is a good first step, but the real accurate change would be to also change the primary culture of Savoy, and add an event/decision to move the capital to Turin and become Piedmontese as primary culture in the XVIth century.

The way I suggested is also to tie a country formation to this decision:
- If Savoy stays French (Arpitan/Occitan/Burgundian), then she gets the ability to form the Kingdom of Arelat/Arles (Savoy+Lyonnais+Provence+Dauphiné).
- If Savoys switches to Italian (Piedmontese), then she gets the ability to form Sardinia-Piedmont.3
-> In my opinion it would be a nice choice to present to the player. :)

I'm also down for Arpitan culture. Even though I would prefer as name "Francoprovençal" as this applies better to Dauphiné and Lyonnais as well of Savoy, because Arpitan technically refers to the Alps (and no Alps in Lyon). But this is a small detail really.
 
Hi, I'm new to the forum so I don't really know the etiquette, but I was wondering when the new patch/map changes were due. I have been playing EUIV for quite some time now and I'm curious to know when I will be finally able to play a good game with Milan with spicy new missions and events (being a Milanese myself) or a nice brand new vassal swarm France with OP influence ideas. Keep up the good job! (and please also get Savoy some unification missions, it would be nice to have a pseudo-hystorical Risorgimento Italy even if the game ends in 1821);)
 
As far as I've seen they have said Quarter 4 in 2019. And generally in practical terms for most companies that means hitting the Christmas Rush so end of November/first weeks of December, typically.
 
Have you thought of adding multiple country specific mission trees per country? As in, if they choose to change their government type?
I toyed with the idea of having something even simpler, like an idea set for Revolutionary France that differs from the original. But then I realized a lot of things can go another direction. As you mentioned you can become a Republic or even a Theocracy.
In the end sure it's technically possible, but the amount of content required for every route for every country is probably not worth it in my opinion.
 
Hello developers, thanks for the great update and all the hard work! Only I noticed one small thing, it is in the base game and also in the update. The flag used to represent Friesland is not correct. The colours are mixed up. If you switch around the white and blue it is correct. You can just Google "Flag of Friesland" and the wikipedia page shows you can example. Would you be so kind to change it to the correct colours? Thanks in advance!
 
mah.. nice changes, but i still wonder why Ancona was not added, i see the new province of Geneva and i wonder why i was not given even one motivation of why Ancona was not added when i asked...:(
 
This is really cool, bit I better get BBB before this drops.
 
Hello developers, thanks for the great update and all the hard work! Only I noticed one small thing, it is in the base game and also in the update. The flag used to represent Friesland is not correct. The colours are mixed up. If you switch around the white and blue it is correct. You can just Google "Flag of Friesland" and the wikipedia page shows you can example. Would you be so kind to change it to the correct colours? Thanks in advance!
Though the Crusader Kings Flag might be nice as well as that is what it was for most of the time.
 
I toyed with the idea of having something even simpler, like an idea set for Revolutionary France that differs from the original. But then I realized a lot of things can go another direction. As you mentioned you can become a Republic or even a Theocracy.
In the end sure it's technically possible, but the amount of content required for every route for every country is probably not worth it in my opinion.

Just a suggestion but if a mad modder created a mod with this insane diversity of mission trees and ideas based on government types and such, you could always integrate them later into the game. Might save you guys some work and time to avoid delaying a release too much in the future. Didn't EU4 integrated some of the mods or at least the elements of them at some point? Or would it still take too much time? *thinking emoji*
 
This may be a little off topic but i have some critic regarding the religious wars: It is a bit unhistoric for countries like the Ottomans or Russia to join the conflict directly.
Both of them were too concerned with their own affairs at the time (especially Ottomans had big troubles on their Iranian border and with the Janissairies rebelling), and only supported the protestant union financially.
 
I would agree. I cant really understand how Poland can have best military ideas than France. And arguably than Sweden. The quasi century of peace and prosperity, making the PLC one of the most developed (culture Wise) country, is almost forgotten.
Yeah, I think Poland needs to have most of its military ideas (except for the cavalry ones) replaced by something else.
 
Hello again! In previous weeks we’ve shown you revamped maps of Italy and German and the revitalized political setups in these regions. Today will be no different as we delve into the land of cheese, wine, and élan!

View attachment 486637

The most striking thing you’ll notice about this new setup is the return of the French “vassal swarm”. The Duchies of Orleans, Bourbonnais, Auvergne, Armagnac, and Foix will be returning to the game alongside their glorious but rarely-seen Hundred Years War unit models. But how will you balance this, I preemptively hear you asking? Won’t France need extra diplomatic relations to cope with this? Won’t France be horrendously overpowered in the early game? Fear not, for we have answers and solutions - which I am not going to reveal today.

So, what's up with balkanized France? The reality is that in 1444, the Kingdom of France was quite decentralized. The Hundred Years War had forced the King to enact new taxes to finance his troops which led to several revolts and conspiracies from its nobility. That conflict continued for most of the second half of the 15th century. Historically the crown prevailed and managed to bring France toward centralization and absolutism, but in EU4 it won't be a given. Hence we decided to make that part of the French gameplay by representing the strongest Dukes and Counts as vassals in 1444.
  • Orléans was the strongest of them and often the leader of the resistance against the Crown. The head of the House of Orléans in 1444 was Charles the First, a cousin of the King who spent 25 years in English captivity. His son Louis would historically become King of France later on following the extinction of the main Valois branch.
  • The Duchy of Bourbon (or Bourbonnais) is held by Jean II, an up and coming noble that illustrated himself in combat the same year our game starts. Historically, he sided with the King's party, but changed side later on after losing a prestigious office.
  • Armagnac is in a tight spot. The result of CK2-style border gore, his possessions are spread across central and southern France. Its leader, Jean IV, recently took part in a failed revolt against the King and is kept on a tight leash.
  • Foix is held by Count Gaston IV, also General Lieutenant of the French Armies of Gascony and Guyenne.

You’ll also notice that France and its subjects (nominal and otherwise) have a handful of additional provinces. I mentioned in a previous dev diary a desire to include Foix, Carcassonne, Toulon, and La Marche. All of these have made it in to this iteration of the map. Toulon felt especially valuable due to its status as a major base of naval operations for France later in the timeframe, and as you’ll see in an upcoming dev diary the establishment of this great arsenal is an important part of more than one new mission tree. We also found room for Forez, which allows us to represent the divide between the crown and Bourbon territories. Blois beefs up the Duchy of Orleans, the most powerful of the French vassal states and often a thorn in the side of the French kings.

To better represent the divide between western (Ducal Burgundy) and eastern (Free HRE Country Burgundy), we added the province of Salins and its large salt mine. This lead us to split Burgundy in two, but instead of following the Imperial divide we elected instead to make two balanced states with one holding land on both sides, making any division an imperfect choice that is sure to spark more conflict in the future.

View attachment 486638

Another addition to the political setup is the city-state of Geneva, here represented in 1444 as a vassal of Savoy. Geneva was subject to Savoy until 1524, and up to that point had a troubled relationship with its overlord. The House of Savoy repeatedly attempted to increase their control over the city to little avail except to alienate its citizens and foster a desire for independence. Local authorities sought to ally with the Swiss cantons, and the city would eventually join the Swiss Confederacy. In addition, the old province of Savoy has been split between Anessi and Ciamber.

View attachment 486636

Moving further away from France, we’ve also made some changes to the Low Countries. I’ve spoken before regarding our concerns about adding provinces to this region. We want it to retain the feeling of being a highly developed and densely populated region, and adding new provinces would force us to split development to the point that it might lose that feeling. We have however managed to squeeze in two additional provinces: ‘s-Hertogenbosch has been cut off from Breda, and Rysel adds a province to Flanders. We’ve also revised the Utrecht-Frisia border to reflect historical divisions of the Dutch provinces. Speaking of Frisia, we have at long last added Frisian culture to the game. You’ll find Frisians inhabiting the provinces of Friesland, Groningen, and Ostfriesland. We’ve also redrawn the area map, doing away with the “Netherlands” area and adding a distinction between North and South Brabant.

Last week I promised a look at the Balkans alongside France, but we’ve decided instead to dedicate an entire dev diary to this topic. Expect to see that in a couple of weeks, as our next dev diary will cover some of the new mission trees in the French and Dutch region. Until then, let us know what you think of the new map setup as well as which mission trees you want to see next week.
Will you add Bosnian culture and their religion Crkva Bosanska ?
 
Like a lot of people have suggested already, Annecy might not be the best choice for the name of the province, not only in terms of location but to fit the historical evolution of Savoy as well. The territory east of the Rhône remained part of Savoy but the territory west of the Rhône (which makes up the vast majority of the province) became part of France in 1601. This splitting of Savoyard territory isn't possible with the current naming of the province since Annecy remained part of Savoy. These western regions were called Bugey and Bresse (Bressa in Italian). I think either of these names would work better than Annecy for representing the split these territories would eventually have with Savoy.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bresse
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bugey

1007px-Karte-Entwicklung-Savoyen-bis-1789.png
 
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Stronger in terms of numbers presuming that all states are aligned.

He hinted at the beginning of the post that vassal relations may be a tad more complicated going forward.

What I'd want to see is some kind of slider for vessels as to how integrated they are. At 0% they are essentially free states with an obligation to join wars, they are particularly susceptible to rebellion and pay very little or no taxes. At 99% they are essentially provinces with a lot of local autonomy, producing a lot of taxes and adding manpower and regiment limit, but field very little of their own troops.

Actually it would be cool if the autonomy mechanic was overhauled so that provinces that have a lot of autonomy slides into vassal status after a while and vassals with very little of the independence slider I mentioned above eventually auto integrated into provinces.


Yeah, I'd definitely like to see something of this sort. I'm not sure how I feel about splitting France into separate states. I think Paradox is getting Vassals mixed up with "Vassal states". Didn't most - if not all - of Europe have vassals?

CK2 does a great job of abstracting the concept of decentralization - you have your state, and within the state, every province is represented by a vassal with varying degrees of autonomy. We already have the provincial autonomy mechanic in EU4. I'd rather see that expanded upon, and see the vassal game mechanic done away with.
 
I would suggest something more like this:

dd_ned.png


Just to help you:

1. Add Drenthe
2. Give Wieringermeer back to the sea, it wasn't a thing until 1930.
3. Give Brabant back to, well Brabant I guess, maybe compensate Zeeland with the northern part of Gent.
4. Redraw some borders of the provinces.

About Drenthe: the capital city is Coevorden from the start of the game till 1814, after 1814 it changed to Assen.
Coevorden was an important city on the road from Münster to Groningen because the surrounding areas mainly consisted of swamp.
The majority of the province was not well developed compared to the rest of the Netherlands and there were relatively few inhabitants.

Historically it was a vassal of Utrecht, however it changed hands often.

A short timeline:
Start - 1522: Utrecht
1522 - 1536: Gelre (Yes, Drenthe stayed with Gelre 8 years longer than Oversticht.)
1536 - 1579: Habsburg Netherlands (don't know how it's presented in the game, probably Spain)
1579 - 1581: It became Dutch after Drenthe joined on 23 january 1579 (Union of Utrecht)
1581 - 1592: Spain capture Coevorden after an eleven day siege on 20 september 1581
1592 - 1672: The Dutch recapture Coevorden after an eighteen day siege on 2 september 1592. The Spaniards besiege Coevorden for 31 weeks without success in the period from october 1593 until may 1594
1672: Münster occupies Coevorden from 11 july 1672 until 29 december 1672.
1672-1795: Dutch

After 1795 it goes with the Napoleonic flow, most information about Drenthe in this time period can be found easily.