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HoI 4 - Dev Diary: America Rework

Hello, and welcome back to another dev diary! Today we are going to talk about Freedom. Freedom from Fear. Freedom from Want. Freedom from having to vote for a presidential candidate every four years.


The vanilla US focus tree offered some interesting alternate-history scenarios, but if you wanted to play historical, you pretty much sat around doing very little until the war started. Part of this is the fundamental design problem of the US in a historical grand-strategy game: if we allow the US to freely enter the war when it has even a fraction of its historical economy, the Axis never makes it into Paris and the war ends in 1940. If we restrict the US from entering the war freely until its historical date, the US player sits around until late 1941 doing very little (there is a reason why my usual go-to scenario in HoI2 and HoI3 was “Play France until you lose, then switch to the US”).


usa_focus_devdiary.jpg



So one of the goals we had for this rework was to give the player a bit more stuff to actually do during the lead-up to the war. Making the path out of the depression a little more involved was an obvious place to start. Instead of a single national spirit, it is now three levels that give a smoother curve out of the depression. But instead of just taking three focuses in a row to do what could previously be done in one, we wanted the player to have to work a lot more to get out of the depression.


Enter the script-based Congress Mechanic. The Congress mechanic is - for now - unique to the US and simulates the shifting majorities in both houses of Congress. It ties into a lot of things that we will get into in a bit. But on a fundamental level, taking the focuses that reduce the penalties from the great depression will require you to have a majority in both houses, but will also reduce your support once you have taken it to simulate members of Congress who voted for the proposal being unwilling to support you further without getting something in return.


picture_us_congress.JPG



You can gain and lose support from random events as well as midterm and presidential elections. Generally speaking, going with the incumbent means you are more likely to lose support in Congress in the election, and if the situation is particularly dire, going with the challenger will flip support and opposition. Beyond this, a number of decisions allow you to gain support in congress, from simple lobbying to bribing members of Congress by investing in their constituencies to just regularly bribing them.


picture_us_build_factory.JPG



Besides getting out of the depression, you’ll also need to get Congress to sign off on the Selective Service Act, which is the gatekeeper focus of the army modernization branch, and the Two Ocean Navy Act, which is the gatekeeper focus for the naval branch. The amount of support you need depends on your war support (in general, you can assume that every focus with “Act” somewhere in its title ties into the Congress mechanic).


Another aspect we wanted to add was to give the US player a choice to become more active in the world earlier. As I said above, that comes with host of issues. We want it to be a viable option, but not a no-brainer. This means that there will be a number of restrictions in the “Limited Intervention” branch. First, you’ll have to have enough support in Congress to take the focus (and a lack of war support means that quite a few member of Congress will break ranks over it). Afterwards, you will have to choose between focusing your efforts on preparing to intervene in Europe or in Asia. Taking either of these focuses unlocks a number of decisions to try and build public support for an intervention. Many of these decisions are tied to events around the world - here the US is protesting the Anschluss.


picture_us_anschluss.JPG



However, there is only a small window to utilize these events. Each decision adds something that is internally called an “intervention strike” as in “three strikes and you’re out”, except in this case it’s “three strikes and we start bombing”. A generic decision allows to build support against a target if they do not have specific decisions associated with them. Finally, once a country has two strikes against them, you can petition congress to sanction an intervention, which will again require significant support (it is easier to gain a wargoal against a country that is at war, and easier still if they are in an aggressive war).


This will likely make it harder for you to pursue your other goals - so if you want to intervene in Europe on behalf of the Allies, you will most likely have to forego economic reforms, at least for a while.


The intervention mandates are also used to allow the US to intervene in the Americas if someone violates the Monroe doctrine.


Intervention in general is something you can prepare a lot better now by using war plans. Completing the focuses unlocks a decision to execute the corresponding war plan and gain a temporary bonus against a country, along with some other temporary bonuses.


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Of course, by this point a statistical majority of you might wonder why you even bother with all this busy-work, bribing senators, cutting deals with representatives, when there is a world to be won. As promised, we also wanted to add proper alternate ideology branches for the US. As we said many months ago in the Dev Diary about South Africa, we also look to try and open up new areas of the map for warfare, to allow you to fight in different areas than trudging across the same old parts of Europe.


So we wanted to have a nice big Civil War in the US. We want tank battles south of Chicago. Naval landings in Florida. A brutal slog across the Rocky Mountains. So we decided to not just put in one civil war but two! That’s a whole 100% MORE CIVIL WAR!


You’ll have to fight a civil war in either of the alternate ideology branches. For the curious: the branches straight down from the WPA and Adjusted Compensation Act are democratic ideology branches and will be part of the free update, the branches starting with Suspend the Prosecution and America First will be part of the DLC.


In the left branch, appropriately enough, you soften up your stance towards the communists. You can do this even if you don’t intend to go fully communist, as it opens up new ways of gaining support in Congress. If you do decide to be more radical, you can desegregate the American society, which will trigger protests from the usual suspects. The protests by themselves don’t do anything, but if you decide to push harder towards communism, the protests will intensify and eventually spill over. The Unions Representation Act is another such trigger that will cause protests.


Picture_us_communists_protests.JPG



Before the civil war breaks out, there is a “Point of No Return” after which it is merely a question of time until hostilities start. In the time between the Point of No Return and the actual start of the war, you’ll get a number of events telling you how the situation develops. These events have actual effects on how your position is like at the start of the war.


For example, if an event tells you that a state has mobilized the national guard, the revolter gets a fully-equipped and quite capable division when the war starts. These events aren’t intended to make the difference between winning and losing but to give the war a bit more flavor.


Once the war starts in the communist branch, it is not quite like a regular civil war. Instead of the country and the military splitting in half, it spawns a new tag (CSA). This allows us to do a few things, like removing CSA territories as cores for the US (which means that they, for example, create resistance when conquered into). Depending on how far down you’ve gone in the communist branch, a part of the country might also declare its neutrality during the war. You can still interact with this part through decisions, but so can the other side.


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Where in other countries, a civil war is something we must be very careful with to ensure that the country is not completely crippled by the time the real war starts, here, we want ACWII to be “the war” the US gets into and which merges into the greater World War. So there are limited objectives for you after you have won the American Theater of World War II, but you can push decolonization in Asia and intervene in the Chinese Civil War, while also working to reintegrate the breakaway states.


The Civil War in the fascist branch works along similar lines. You also get a branch leading down from America First that you can use even if you don’t want to go full fascist - a sort of flirting with fascism, allowing you, for example, to investigate the opposition through the House Committee of Un-American Activities. The Voter Registration Act ensures a comfortable majority in every election, but triggers a wave of protests.


If you decide to push even further and publicly ally with the Silver Legion, you will trigger additional protests that put the country on the road to civil war. Like in the communist branch, a number of events determine what the starting position is, but the roles are reversed. Where in the communist branch, a part of the country tries to break away, in the fascist branch the country revolts against your leadership and tries to oust you from power, forcing you to fall back into a powerbase you set up in advance (you set up a powerbase in advance, right?). Parts of the country will declare in support or in opposition, leading to different front lines.


With much of the professional military on the other side, you’ll have to rely on hastily-raised militias to hold the line until you can get back on your feet. You might have to cut some deals and appeal to the locals to get them to accept that you are on their side.


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Once you have won that war, you are left with a US that is now safely fascist, which means that you are ideally poised to conquer the rest of the world. So we decided we might as well give you the focus tree to do just that. The War Powers Act lessens the stability impact of being in a war, and you can take your first steps abroad as you politely ask Canada to give you the territory between you and the Alaskan border (the event may or may not be called “Vancouver Or War!”) and politely ask Cuba to please stop being independent.


You continue in this fashion until at last you demand global hegemony and give all other majors an ultimatum to either become puppets or go to war. Along the way, you will most likely have gobbled up all the small countries that otherwise make conquering the world such a pain.


That is all for today. Next week we will be back with another look into the naval side of things.



Rejected Titles:

You will want fries with this focus tree

Making the world safe for fascism

Josh Lyman Simulator 2018

All focus trees are bigger in Texas

Communism is the right of all sentient beings

While writing this dev diary a bald eagle sat down outside the window and cried. True story.

My favourite state borders are Colorado’s

My google search history now makes me unemployable in most of the US

Fight them over here so we don’t have to fight them over there

This dev diary may contain trace amounts of political commentary

There was supposed to be a monarchist path but the Americans in the office rebelled and threw away all the tea

Team America saves the day

“Three strikes and we start bombing” would dramatically improve Baseball as a sport

https://twitter.com/alflandonlover gets the love he deserves

Actually rejected title: Make America <literally anything> Again

“Five score and two days ago our game director brought forth, upon this world, a new DLC announcement, conceived in liberty, and dedicated to the proposition that all gamers like American Civil Wars.”
 
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@podcat
@Archangel85

I saw the focus about Manhattan project... And I was thinking... Will you ever revamp nuclear weapons? Will you add the Gas or another tipe of unconventional weapons?
Just for rebalance and add more flavour to the game!

(Also not in this update... I want to know only if it's planned, and... maybe... some spoilers?;);))
 
I'm not an expert in how this works, but as far as I can tell, this really had no tangible benefit.
I hope they go back to usual next week.

Completely agree. There is a lot of aspects still to correct/implement in HOI4 to make it a true World War II game. Inaccurate OOB's, non historical or oversimplified air and naval techs, weird peace conferences mechanics, naval warfare very very bugged, etc...

Don't get me wrong, sometimes to relax i like to go alt-history, Kaiserreich for example, but lets first get a fully functional and more realistic WW2 game. For example, there's other contents that could be included, like the old campaign scenarios, present in previous versions of the game.
(North Africa, Overlord, Rising Sun, etc...).

I heard this was a naval expansion, and we've seen some good new ideas (mines, naval access, naval terrain, etc...) but please show us also what improvements can we expect on the already known problems (carrier bug, ineffective submarines, limited naval techs and OOB's, etc...).

And also, the ship designer, lets see that beauty, shall we? :)

Best Regards, guys.
 
@podcat
@Archangel85

I saw the focus about Manhattan project... And I was thinking... Will you ever revamp nuclear weapons? Will you add the Gas or another tipe of unconventional weapons?
Just for rebalance and add more flavour to the game!

(Also not in this update... I want to know only if it's planned, and... maybe... some spoilers?;);))
Don't bring up gas, its a topic that is agaisnt forum rules. As for nuclear weapons, I feel like with enough territory lost and a nuke dropped on a capitol should really cause surrender. Say the United Kingdom has lost a lot of its colonies in Africa and Asia, then London is nuked.
 
As suspected when I found out the CSA would be in this, it is incredibly forced and makes absolutely zero sense given the actual history of the period and how the Lost Cause bullshit worked at the time (at this point in time the Lose Cause venerated Lincoln as a tragic hero and downplayed the nature of the CSA with the goal of white reconciliation at the expense of African-Americans - see Birth of a Nation for what this kind of racist nonsense looks like). Why shove them in here like this?

The Silver Shirts declare the rebirth of the literal CSA with the same flag and capital because communists? In the 1930s/40s? Seriously? Pelley (their leader) wasn't even a Lost Causer of any kind in any event; he had a fucked up idea that the CSA was a Jewish conspiracy to destroy the US and sell Texas to the French (no really, there have been all kinds of books written on him and the SS - the dude was nuts). There is no way his party would "Honour the Confederacy" let alone decide to revive it wholesale from the dead.

Respectfully, you guys should really read up on actual history inbetween you happening upon a 'fun' idea for alt-history and throwing it into the game. I don't mind alt-history in HOI4, it can be cool and fun, but you should at least make it remotely plausible and base it on ideas and demands actually historically expressed in the time period by actual organizations of note.
 
Suspend the Prosecution

This appears to me to be a spelling error. According to the Oxford Advanced Learners' Dictionary:

prosecution
the process of trying to prove in court that somebody is guilty of a crime (=of prosecuting them); the process of being officially charged with a crime in court

That can be a good or a bad thing. I think you intended to use a similar word with negative connotations:

persecution
the act of treating somebody in a cruel and unfair way, especially because of their race, religion or political beliefs

Communists couldn't be prosecuted just for being Communists until the Communist Control Act of 1954, so there were no prosecutions to suspend in 1936. But they most certainly were persecuted in the 1930s and suspending such cruel and unfair treatment would be a necessary step towards a Marxist regime.

There is no focus to embargo Japan, is this a decision now? It should be simulated somehow with fuel being added to the game !
And how pearl harbor is simulated? Decision too?

Yes, providing a way to simulate the oil embargo is really important: that is the key geostrategic reason that Japan declared war in December 1941 rather than earlier or later. I hope this will be clarified when we get to the dev diaries about fuel that have been promised nearer the time of release.

The thing about that focus is that, really, it should be an Allied thing rather than a general thing. It was a joint project between the US, UK and Canada, and largely funded by the US Government. However, a lot of the science and specialism required to bring the project to fruition was British.

Even if you don't make being a member of the Allies a requirement for the focus, I think it would make sense if you only got 1 nuclear bonus by default, but got 2 if you're in a faction with Britain. That would be a balanced way of doing it I think.

@podcat

Since The Tizard Mission will remain a focus for the UK in vanilla 1.6, it seems right that that focus should be a requirement for the US to get the Manhattan Project bonus focus. The US can still use its industrial might to develop nuclear weapons, but if it wants a head start, then (as IRL) they should need to build on the Commonwealth's progress.

Is this name place holder? It just seems, weird.

unknown.png

Makes sense to me. It refers to those states that have not taken sides in the civil war. They'd surely continue to regard themselves as part of the USA, even if they weren't willing to permit Washington to (for example) conscript their boys for internal security operations that they considered illegal. So the press might well dub them the 'Unaligned States of America', and the name might stick for the duration of its existence (like Vichy France, the Weimar Republic or West Germany, which were never official names but were widely used).
 
This appears to me to be a spelling error. According to the Oxford Advanced Learners' Dictionary:



That can be a good or a bad thing. I think you intended to use a similar word with negative connotations:



Communists couldn't be prosecuted just for being Communists until the Communist Control Act of 1954, so there were no prosecutions to suspend in 1936. But they most certainly were persecuted in the 1930s and suspending such cruel and unfair treatment would be a necessary step towards a Marxist regime.

Its certainly possible, but 'suspension of prosecution' is a legal term. What really matters here is what is being prosecuted.
 
I love it.

Also: France, PLEASE. I'd hope for a democratic Italy path but, oh well, guess I'll have to wait.

Imo we don't only need that in a future expansion, but also monarchist/communist path for both Italy and France. I can't wait to be the new Napoleon who takes over the world.
Their focus tree is small and has no ahistorical paths, not only I think it should be expanded for historical path but ahistorical can be really cool if made well.
 
Letting america have limited volunteering options earlier then they do now, would also give them something to do that can take up a lot of attention while they wait. Have the devs mentioned anything about this?
 
Are we getting a Puerto Rico tag? It would be great for purposes of dismembering the USA in a peace conference.

Maybe they were still testy about the stunt the Germans pulled with the Zimmerman Telegram back in WW1? An attempt to bribe them into joining the war with the promise of Reconquista territories, that would only end with Mexico getting smacked down by the United States, wouldn't exactly endear Mexico to the Germans who're trying to go for Round 2.

No, it most likely had to do with internal politics, i.e., a way for the government to push back against domestic reactionary forces. Also, remember that in March '38 Mexico and Germany were both supporting opposing sides in the Spanish Civil War; Mexico being the only country to openly oppose the nationalist side, so it makes sense to flip the Germans the bird for that move. Some more info about Mexico during this time period here.
 
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@podcat @Archangel85 You know, with the way this thread looks, I'm curious if it feels to you guys like you teacher is handing you back your paper that you worked for three months on, telling you that it's great but one or two things need to be changed, and then handing you back a document dripping with so much red ink that it looks like evidence from a murder scene. We've all had those moments, so no shame if that's the case.
Have they actually made revisions to proposed focus trees like this in the past? I don't think they really have. The devs even stuck with the goofy Japanese communist path. I noticed you had decisions to honor the legacy of the CSA. The one to move the capitol to Richmond doesn't really make sense.
 
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Its certainly possible, but 'suspension of prosecution' is a legal term. What really matters here is what is being prosecuted.

So, if Communists were no longer being prosecuted in front of a judge, but were being 'blacklisted' by all industries so they couldn't work, were being forced to send their children away to special residential schools, and had all their funds confiscated, they'd have been happy with the outcome?! No, what matters here is that they were being persecuted: treated unfairly. That is what a government leaning towards Marxism would want to stop. And 'suspension of prosecution', in its technical legal sense, always involves the alleged offender accepting certain conditions (e.g. entering a drug rehabilitation clinic), which would not be an acceptable outcome in this situation.

With apologies for getting technical, there are also two linguistic points that support my case. Firstly, the words 'persecution' and 'prosecution' are easily confused. I've taught academic writing to people taking law degrees (both to people who've grown up in an English-speaking country, and as a foreign language), and seen this mistake many times.

Secondly, I think the grammar of the focus title supports my suggestion that the intended meaning is persecution (unfairness), not prosecution (bringing crimes to a judge). The definite article is usually used with countable nouns when the writer and reader both know the thing to which reference is being made. So, on your reading, the readers should know which prosecution is being suspended. But we do not know which prosecution is being suspended here and (in this context) a prosecution, singular, must of a specific legal person or persons. You can't bring all of 'the Communists', generically, into one particular courtroom. If carefully bringing all the Communists into different courtrooms had been the intended meaning, then you would have to write 'Suspend the Prosecutions', plural. You can prosecute the Communist Party USA or Earl Browder, but I can't think of a particular case in the 1930s that all the readers of this dev diary would be expected to know. But I think that all readers of this dev diary would be expected to know that 'the Communists' were treated unfairly in the USA of the 1930s, so 'Suspend the Persecution' makes more sense.
 
When will there be a Turkish National focus tree?
 
As suspected when I found out the CSA would be in this, it is incredibly forced and makes absolutely zero sense given the actual history of the period and how the Lost Cause bullshit worked at the time (at this point in time the Lose Cause venerated Lincoln as a tragic hero and downplayed the nature of the CSA with the goal of white reconciliation at the expense of African-Americans - see Birth of a Nation for what this kind of racist nonsense looks like). Why shove them in here like this?

The Silver Shirts declare the rebirth of the literal CSA with the same flag and capital because communists? In the 1930s/40s? Seriously? Pelley (their leader) wasn't even a Lost Causer of any kind in any event; he had a fucked up idea that the CSA was a Jewish conspiracy to destroy the US and sell Texas to the French (no really, there have been all kinds of books written on him and the SS - the dude was nuts). There is no way his party would "Honour the Confederacy" let alone decide to revive it wholesale from the dead.

Respectfully, you guys should really read up on actual history inbetween you happening upon a 'fun' idea for alt-history and throwing it into the game. I don't mind alt-history in HOI4, it can be cool and fun, but you should at least make it remotely plausible and base it on ideas and demands actually historically expressed in the time period by actual organizations of note.

I agree a lot with your sentiments.

The main problem I have with the CSA being portrayed as the Fascist faction is that while Southern nationalist fascism makes a lot of sense, American fascism being based off Southern nationalism makes no sense. Southerners are deeply attached to the Confederacy because it was the only time the Southern peoples were united into their own independent state. White Northerners shouldn't care about it in the slightest, and your average Yankee would probably view the Confederacy with antipathy.

There's also the fact that the Confederate ideology, and its modern descendants, have as much distance from Fascism as Communism does. A lot of the same sort of social thinking and philosophy is there, but the Confederate ideology is much more reactionary and decentralized. I think it goes to show some of the weaknesses of the four-ideology system in HOI4.

Personally, I'd see the Fascist US as being very friendly to the Confederate legacy, but Hell would freeze over before they'd rename their state or slander the Union generals. I think they'd probably play down the emancipation of the Blacks and play up the idea of a "Brother's War." That's honestly what happened up until pretty recently. I do think that the Confederacy breaking off is a nice idea for a response to Communists/desegregation, but they shouldn't be interested in conquering the US; just in secession.

It's also entirely possible that a Fascist US would actually discriminate against Southerners. The tendency in Fascist states (like Francoist Spain) has been to trample all over the regions in the name of some bullshit "national identity" (for America, that would be Generic Midwestern Reporter Accent) that only exists in the minds of intellectuals. Confederate stuff could actually be perceived as a threat to the Glorious State in the same way that Catalan nationalism was a threat to Franco.

I'm not familiar with Pelley, but I can sort of see where he would have been coming from with the Jewish conspiracy angle. Prior to the Civil War, the South was the core of American Jewry (mostly Sephardim, many descended from Iberian slave traders) and Jews had a surprising amount of sway in the Confederate government. There's even the infamous pogrom US Grant conducted against them in Tennessee. Of course, after the war, the Southern Jews ended up being outweighed by the influx of Ashkenazim to the North, and American Jewish culture as a whole became a lot more North-centric. Of course, whatever he was talking about was probably a lot more loony.
 
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So, if Communists were no longer being prosecuted in front of a judge, but were being 'blacklisted' by all industries so they couldn't work, were being forced to send their children away to special residential schools, and had all their funds confiscated, they'd have been happy with the outcome?! No, what matters here is that they were being persecuted: treated unfairly. That is what a government leaning towards Marxism would want to stop. And 'suspension of prosecution', in its technical legal sense, always involves the alleged offender accepting certain conditions (e.g. entering a drug rehabilitation clinic), which would not be an acceptable outcome in this situation.

With apologies for getting technical, there are also two linguistic points that support my case. Firstly, the words 'persecution' and 'prosecution' are easily confused. I've taught academic writing to people taking law degrees (both to people who've grown up in an English-speaking country, and as a foreign language), and seen this mistake many times.

Secondly, I think the grammar of the focus title supports my suggestion that the intended meaning is persecution (unfairness), not prosecution (bringing crimes to a judge). The definite article is usually used with countable nouns when the writer and reader both know the thing to which reference is being made. So, on your reading, the readers should know which prosecution is being suspended. But we do not know which prosecution is being suspended here and (in this context) a prosecution, singular, must of a specific legal person or persons. You can't bring all of 'the Communists', generically, into one particular courtroom. If carefully bringing all the Communists into different courtrooms had been the intended meaning, then you would have to write 'Suspend the Prosecutions', plural. You can prosecute the Communist Party USA or Earl Browder, but I can't think of a particular case in the 1930s that all the readers of this dev diary would be expected to know. But I think that all readers of this dev diary would be expected to know that 'the Communists' were treated unfairly in the USA of the 1930s, so 'Suspend the Persecution' makes more sense.

But you’re basing the assumption that it even is discussing something that could be described as persecution. We need to know more. The thing is, suspension indicates temporariness, which doesn’t reallu flow well with the idea of persecution.