HOI4 Dev Diary - Bag of Tricks #1

[bitmode]

I thought this might be a fun way to talk about player expectations & why just because HoI 3 had something does not mean automatically HOI IV has it or should be added for Free.

And while I am at it I will post this again:

Repeatedly just self-promoting your own youtube videos in the same thread is not a fun way to talk in a forum. If you want to contribute something to the discussion, just write it. People can still click the link in your signature if they are so inclined.

 

[Axe99]

I've just grown used to not having a mini-map. Weird, huh?

Given you're supposed to be old and stuck in your ways, I'd say it is . .

That said, while I've grown used to not having a mini-map (for example, I alternate which finger I use on the scroll-wheel to reduce RSI-issues), it doesn't mean I'm not happy it's coming back .

As always, there is a great deal of good sense in this post. But there are two reasons why I'd disagree with the portion quoted.

Firstly, I bought HoI 4 on the understanding that PDX's business model includes free content patches and it's likely that many of the players did. Maybe it's not a contractual obligation, but it's clearly now part of the offer to provide some improvements with patches. My views on this assume that PDX, as they are run by smart businesspeople, are allowing for that in the business plan for the base game. Certainly, if you look at their profit data, their 2016 game launches seems to have brought in revenue far, far above their 2016 costs (though we'll never know such commercially sensitive information for sure). We know that some of that revenue will be needed to cover the investment in developing HoI in 2013-15, but it's not unreasonable to assume that some of it's set aside for the future too.

Secondly, even if you disagree with the reasoning above, we know for a fact that PDX releases free stuff with patches. And therefore the "Minimaps should be free" camp can reasonably debate what should be free without implying that everything, always should be free.

You make a very good point here - PDS did sell HoI4 as "we're releasing it now but it will continue to improve", and with the "free/paid" mix for future improvements, and in that context it's perfectly reasonable to debate which elements should and shouldn't be in the free/paid parts (although I'd still argue we should respect Paradox's decision at the end of the day). Thanks for setting me straight, and presenting a good point clearly - I did go a bit far with that part of my argument (because, wonderfully ironically in an embarrasing way given my use of the idea in my argument, I wasn't as mindful of the context as I could have been!)

I'm definitely not anti-discussing whether the mini-map should be paid or free (and I definitely wasn't trying to shut down discussion, just present another point of view) - I just don't think it would be appropriate we could dictate this to Paradox, or assume Paradox are being greedy, or deliberately left things out to monetise them later (at the very least without some evidence to this effect, and particularly when with the amount of free post-launch content provided the evidence as to greed would be against it, I'd think - although I'm no expert on the topic ).

I wouldn't read too much into a single year's revenue though (particularly as it had two high-profile releases in it) - again I'm no expert, but revenues for software companies tend to be highly variable, based on when and what releases and how it's received - so 2016 should have been a substantially-better-than-average year in any event. How much it would need to be, to be a 'good' 'big revenue' year, or a 'bad' one though, is something I'd need to spend a lot of time looking at their financial reports to have any idea.

 

[beewyka819]

Of course consolidating divisions would be a DLC "feature" because HOI4

 

[REDDQ]

deliberately left things out to monetise them later (at the very least without some evidence to this effect

Without mission impossibling into PDX HQ you are asking for unobtainable (safe for few 3d models) over here

 

[Jamey]

Suffice to say that the people on the team who argued for the Chain of Command feature to be free (which it really shouldn't, given the development time it took) instead of the damn minimap have a lot of egg on their face now.

I'd have been OK with Chain of Command being paid (whereas I think it's unfortunate the minimap paid, for reasons I said above), but I'm not sure that going that route would have avoided grumpy people who'd compare it with OOB in HOI3.

 

[CrazyZombie]

I'd have been OK with Chain of Command being paid (whereas I think it's unfortunate the minimap paid, for reasons I said above), but I'm not sure that going that route would have avoided grumpy people who'd compare it with OOB in HOI3.

If someone wants to start every game with reorganizing his army for an hour or smth close to - he can simply play HOI3.

 

[Jamey]

If someone wants to start every game with reorganizing his army for an hour or smth close to - he can simply play HOI3.

Which is why I don't play HOI3 any more.

 

[CrazyZombie]

Which is why I don't play HOI3 any more.

My HOI3 experience when waiting for HOI4 was pretty short: I launched the game, chose scenario and state, looked into all that mess, said something like "Mmmm, okay...", exit the game, deleted it and never touched again.

 

[Hauptmann Ernst Werner]

I'm actually excited for this one. Mostly with the GUI, and Enhancements to organization. It bothered me too much to have 10 theaters. I may suck at HOI4 but I got it when it came out, the day it did and I have 715 hours on it. Too many god damn theaters

 

[toastylewis]

I want to buy the DLC, but I don't want any of this "miniature map" rubbish. Hopefully there'll be a deluxe version of the DLC that's just like the regular one but with no disgusting mini-maps, not even hide-able ones. I'd pay double for that.

 

[calebman]

Hello, hopefully you can tear yourself away from rewatching the Star Wars trailer for just one more glimpse of the Porg creature... because it's Wednesday! Time for another dev diary for 1.5 “Cornflakes” update and the as-yet unannounced DLC. We have been covering several big features in the diaries leading up here, so now it's time to also look at some smaller features from our "bag of tricks"

Control Groups
This might actually be one of my favourites Was reminded about this in a forum thread about UI improvements people wanted and realized I had totally forgotten how nice it was. You can now hit Ctrl+number to save any selection, and then hit the number key again to bring that up. It works with any selection, not just divisions, so you can mark areas, air wings etc and jump between them quickly. Double tapping the number key moves camera to the selection.
View attachment 305585


Consolidate Divisions
Sometimes after hard battles, or when cut off from reinforcement and supply you can end up with a lot of divisions a low strength. Sometimes you need them at full strength right away and can’t wait for them to fill up normally. The DLC will come with a new feature that lets you consolidate divisions together into fewer, full strength (or as close as you can get ones). Units will move towards the strongest division and transfer over their manpower and equipment when they get there. The system also handles doing it with many divisions in which case it will try to form as many full strength divisions as it can.
View attachment 305581


Minimap & Pinging
A minimap is something HOI4 was designed to live without, but there is clearly a part of the community that really miss it, so you can now get it as part of the DLC if you want. It also comes with some new functionality for multiplayer. You can ping the map to illustrate to allies of things you are discussing, like where you want them to defend or push, or as a quick reminder like “watch out here the russians are about to encircle you!”
View attachment 305578

Minimap can be toggled to a closed state if you like, and you can still use pings through keyboard shortcuts.
View attachment 305579


Kick From Faction
With Cornflakes it will now be possible to kick nations from your faction in the form of a new diplo action.
View attachment 305580


Since this stuff tended to lead to some exploiting in the past (players picking off members one by one etc), we have been working on how AI sees this stuff to make it handle a few things… Kicking is possible in war time also and we have been putting a lot of time into dealing with how HOI4 handles wars in code. Basically the underlying system has been completely remade to stop war merging and the like from ruining your wars, or getting nations dropped or included in ways you wouldn't expect. Its one of those non-sexy things that you can't really show but that is going to make things feel a lot better and avoid edge case bugs messing up your day. This also allows us much more flexibility with how we may want to handle wars in the future.


That's it for today, see you all again next week for more updates!

****************************
Guys / Gals

This thread is to discuss the dev diary, not Pdx DLC policy, which has been debated ad nauseam. Stay on topic of the thread. - Had a dad

I LOVE THIS UPDATE - Great job guys and thanks so much for fixing and improving some of the features in the game. I have a BIG recommendation that I would love. I recommend that you should add a system that allows you to capture enemy fleets and ships when they capitulate if the ships are docked in harbor. I would love it if you did this, it would add such a new dynamic to nations that typically don't have navies or wouldn't normally think of building one themselves. I think this would put a cherry on top for this update or maybe a future one. Thanks and keep up the hard work!

 

[Axe99]

I want to buy the DLC, but I don't want any of this "miniature map" rubbish. Hopefully there'll be a deluxe version of the DLC that's just like the regular one but with no disgusting mini-maps, not even hide-able ones. I'd pay double for that.

Haha - well I'm sure it'd be possible to mod out the mini-map (possibly in a way that wouldn't mess with ironman/achievements/etc.,) if you really, really didn't want one .

 

[Had a dad]

I want to buy the DLC, but I don't want any of this "miniature map" rubbish. Hopefully there'll be a deluxe version of the DLC that's just like the regular one but with no disgusting mini-maps, not even hide-able ones. I'd pay double for that.

I know in hoi3 modders could remove buttons, I'm sure it's still true with hoi4's gui... and or you can pick your favorite dev, sign them up for the beer of the hour club, and tell them their continued membership depends on the addition of said option to the game

 

[Meglok]

Suffice to say that the people on the team who argued for the Chain of Command feature to be free (which it really shouldn't, given the development time it took) instead of the damn minimap have a lot of egg on their face now.

Rather surprising that such a common game enhancement as a minimap is being placed behind a pay wall and the revision of the chain of command isn't. Unless the changes required by the new CoC are so fundamental they have to be available to all?

And sorry @podcat , but quick scrolling is NOT prefered by many compared to clicking on a minimap, especially when you are used to that availability in other games. And scrolling all over the place is just so suboptimal when playing the UK or Japan.

 

[Rusiak]

A world-wide strategy game without a minimap was a terrible idea in the first place. Unless the possibility to lure people into buying a DLC was thought of well in advance, in which case it is almost genius. I have been with the DLC train for now but dear Paradox: you now have lost a customer for further HOI4 DLCs.

 

[CrazyZombie]

or you can pick your favorite dev, sign them up for the beer of the hour club, and tell them their continued membership depends on the addition of said option to the game

Will invitation to cold Russia considered to be a threat in such context? There are couple of things, people here want to see fixed or added.
P.S. Also not sure, devs will like our beer.

 

[Axe99]

Will invitation to cold Russia considered to be a threat in such context? There are couple of things, people here want to see fixed or added.
P.S. Also not sure, devs will like our beer.

Aye, I don't mean this in a bad way - when I was over there (last decade of last century, the beer may have improved since) your beer really wasn't much chop (at least if you're used to Australian beer - you may think the same in reverse ). Your vodka and hospitality were great though .

 

[Had a dad]

Will invitation to cold Russia considered to be a threat in such context?

months ago one of the pdx devs offered to send me surströmming, and still haven't figured out if they were being nice or if it was a threat

 

[C-Breeze]

Some really nice features announced here. It's been a long time coming, and for a while I wasn't sure we'd ever see it, but actual control groups? Quick somebody pinch me! That and division consolidation are both noteworthy. Two great adds to help flesh out the game!

 

[CrazyZombie]

Aye, I don't mean this in a bad way - when I was over there (last decade of last century, the beer may have improved since) your beer really wasn't much chop (at least if you're used to Australian beer - you may think the same in reverse ). Your vodka and hospitality were great though .

If you make it again here and visit for example Volgograd, never try vodka "Stalingrad". It is something, you can surely burn a tank with.

months ago one of the pdx devs offered to send me surströmming, and still haven't figured out if they were being nice or if it was a threat

And problem is that you couldn't ask, as having to be nice too...