• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

HOI4 Dev Diary - Bag of Tricks #3

Hello everyone, and welcome back to a new dev diary for Man the Guns and the 1.6 “Ironclad” update! Unfortunately, the next part of the naval combat rework is not entirely ready to show off, yet, and so to give them some extra time I’m stepping into the breach to give you an update on some of the things (this is by no means an exhaustive list, but rather the highlights) the HoI4 Content Design team have fixed or adjusted since showing off the focus trees :)

Issues regarding ideology (and drift)

An issue that has come up in the community on multiple occasions are the issues caused by permanent ideology drift National Spirits. For instance, puppeting a fascist nation as a communist, only to have it gradually drift back to fascism because it once upon a time got a National Spirit giving it 0.10 fascism drift.

To solve this, we’ve gone with a two-pronged approach. First of all, all National Spirits that give ideology drift now either time out after 2-3 years, or, in the case of Spirits that have other effects than just ideology drift, and therefore need to be permanent, are removed when the ideology shifts away from the ideology drift they provide.

dev diary timed ideas.png


In addition, we’ve added new decisions that give you greater control over the ideology of your subjects. These allow you to expend political power to give an ideology drift, and, when ideology support becomes high enough, forcibly swap them to your ideology.

dev diary nation building.png
dev diary police action.png


Adjustments to Netherlands focus tree

I was not too pleased with the Monarchist path in the Netherlands focus tree, and so I’ve tinkered a little bit with it to make it more unique and (hopefully) more interesting. The original design suffered from, yes, being too constrained by historical plausibility. Attempting to trace the most likely path for a royal take-over we can find some indications that Queen Wilhelmina historically wanted to use her wartime popularity, combined with the weakness of the Dutch Government-in-Exile (GiE), to obtain sweeping constitutional changes that would give much greater power to the Queen, after the liberation of the Netherlands. In HoI4, however, this would entail requiring the player to play poorly, lose the fight in the continent, become a government-in-exile, then flip to Neutrality, and subsequently gain no benefits at all from the tree because you do not control your land anymore, while just sitting back and supporting the British in their war (because historically the Queen wanted to do just that, rather than doing any ‘cool independent stuff’ on her own). None of this makes for fun gameplay.

dev diary monarchist path.png

The Monarchist path is on the left-hand side, but shares certain focuses (the branch leading up to "Request Allied Favors") with the Democratic path (the right-hand side).

It is still possible to go through the path as a GiE, as multiple focuses give you bonuses regardless of whether you have control of your homeland or not. However, it is no longer a requirement to have capitulated. New focuses give offmap military factories, as well as building up Belgium and Luxemburg after you get them through Revive the Buffer State Proposal. A final focus has been added to give a sort of ‘endgame’. Wilhelminism revolves around a cunning plot to use the German Kaiser (in exile in Huis Doorn in the Netherlands since the end of the First World War) to attract German deserters, and incite an insurrection to weaken the German position. This focus periodically spawns free divisions comprised of German deserters, while also giving Germany a National Spirit draining their manpower. Once any German territory has been ‘liberated’ by the Netherlands, an actual civil war kicks off in Germany, where the Kaiser (or his son, if he died) leads a rebellion (headquartered in the territory you just liberated) to put the von Hohenzollerns back on the German throne. This civil war nation exists as a puppet of the Netherlands, and so can be supported by you. Once the war is won, the Kaiser will require you to fulfill your end of the bargain, involving releasing them as an independent nation, and then proposes to create a formal alliance. If you happen to own Waking the Tiger, this will also set this new Germany on the Kaiserreich path, likely leading to a war with the Allies (who won’t be too happy with you doing all this in the first place).

dev diary wilhelminism.png


Adjustments to the British focus tree

In the original UK focus tree reveal, I mentioned the naval tree would get a make-over as well. This has now been done.

dev diary uk naval tree.png


Various new additions have been made to the tree. Anti-Non-Contact Committee gives tech bonuses to minelaying and minesweeping, while Anti-Submarine Training School gives doctrine bonuses to Convoy Defense, as well as a National Spirit that improves Destroyer experience gain. ASW Warfare gives 2x ahead of time tech bonuses for Anti-Submarine Warfare modules, while Expanding the Repair Yards gives a couple of Dockyards and a national spirit making repairs and refits cheaper and faster. Vanguard gives a modern Battleship template, and also creates a ‘free’ battleship of this template in Clydebank (Lanark state).

dev diary vanguard.png


I also added some focuses that tie in to the Reinforce the Empire branch. As the British relied heavily on their light cruisers to keep the trade lanes secure, that is now represented in a new focus that requires both Naval Rearmament as well as Service Overseas.

dev diary light cruisers.png


Following Commonwealth Ties, then, comes the last addition: a focus representing the massive British Commonwealth Air Training Plan. This gives bonuses to air (and air wing) experience gain, reflecting the impact of one of the largest air training programs in history.

dev diary commonwealth air plan.png


Of these, all are part of the free rework except for those that rely on paid features; i.e. ASW Warfare, Expand the Repair Yards, Vanguard, and Anti-Non-Contact Committee will not be available without the DLC.

Map changes

The map changes dev diary had a lot of suggestions from the community, and I worked through a number of them (too many to list), but I will mention the most important here.

A number of new tags were added:

Mauritania
Namibia
Western Sahara (Sahrawi Arab Democratic Republic)
British Antilles
French Guyana
Maldives
Fiji/Melanesia
Slovenia
Bosnia
Macedonia
Northern Ireland

To accomodate Mauritania, the western-most impassable state has been made passable, allowing armies to move down into subsaharan Africa both in Egypt in the east, as well as in the west.

dev diary mauritania.png


Namibia has been added due to popular request, and the Caprivi strip has been fixed.

dev diary caprivi strip.png


The Balkans have been further… balkanized, and the states for Montenegro and Macedonia have been adjusted.

dev diary balkans.png


Thanks to an initiative by @Tristan Edge, a large number of victory points have been adjusted and/or added.

A lot of VP adjustments happened to:
Greece, Turkey, Portugal, Mexico, Poland, Czechoslovakia, European Russia

Other VP adjustments happened to:
Spain, France, USA, Germany, Italy, China, Siberia

dev diary western poland.png

Sneak preview of the new VPs in Western Poland

Also, when adding new tags, I put in an effort to ensure all releasable tags have at least one victory point (their capital). This has seen a dramatic increase in the amount of victory points in Africa, the Caribbean, and some in Asia.

Finally, some naval zones have been split up to make better use of the new naval terrain, as well as making for more interesting strategic choices with your navy. One example here: the Aegean.

dev diary naval zone Aegean.png


Don't forget to check out the stream today at 4PM CET, where Gabriel and Niall (Daniel is unfortunately the victim of biological warfare today) will be continuing with their communist Mexico playthrough. We'll see you guys next week, for a new dev diary! :)

Rejected titles

- Yet another focus tree about the German Kaiser
- My Conquest is the Sea of Victory Points
- HOI4: Now with 200% more balkanization
- Installing Democracies has never been so easy
- Issuing the HoI4 community challenge: Western Sahara World Conquest
- The "People Actually Live Here Now"-update
 
What would happen if I finish Vanguard focus, but doesn't control any naval base in Lamark state?
 
In the German national tree, when you successfully partition Yugoslavia, can an event pop up where Germany can gift the southwestern Ljublana province to them (the current alternative is that you keep all of Slovenia)?
 
You did say (I think, correct me if I'm wrong) that they would have been able to build a BB in 12 months if they put the money into it. That was the biggest thing I was addressing - I'd argue that's far too fast for any BB of the period.

As for British shipbuilding more broadly, I haven't gotten the impression it was particularly quick, but that it was efficient (whereas American shipbuilding was relatively quick, but also relatively inefficient). With the only 1930s example you provide, the KGVs, saying something like 'notwithstanding the turret' is a bit misleading, as turrets plus guns are a huge part of battleship construction. I haven't gotten into the details, but wasn't Vanguard laid down in 1941 and completed in 1946 (but beset with delays because resources were sent to higher-priority tasks, so the time isn't really indicative)?

That said, that's just my impression - while I will argue strongly that a 12-month BB was not feasible, I wouldn't argue against your arguing for a British production time/cost reduction buff, that's far more a judgement thing.


Well there are several things to unpack. Even with the turret issues with the KGV it took just 25 months to build the thing, the national government as well insisted on doing the KGV as cheaply as possible so this likely affected the overall completion dates as well. It was commissioned about a year later and commissioning takes place after a bit of a workup. In contrast the Iowa class with US manufacturing took 27-28 months from being laid down to construct. This was even with the greater industry of the US and the pressing concern by Roosevelt to have battleships that were able to stop the the Japanese fleet.

The South Dakotas took roughly the same time as the the KGV's but shared many design elements with the North Dakotas which took close to three years under peacetime conditions to production. In effect looking at comparative US production, the British battleships were constructed more quickly, and quite probably more efficiently. The benefits to US production rate were found in the serial production capabilities, whereas the UK had a limited number of slipways capable of undertaking production tasks.

In this sense a production speed boost would make sense for the UK as they are naturally forced to be better at build.

Indeed checking your sources further suggests the same, the UK used fewer slipways to produce more total tonnage of shipping to compare WW1 and WW2. This suggests an increase in raw speed rather than anything else. Hence a more efficient production rate, while the US with considerably more slipways do more production less efficiently.
 
With the new naval focus, and the ability to make dedicated ASW hunter-killer groups on the way, might I petition for the inclusion in the British fleet commander line up a certain Frederic John Walker, aka our finest uboat killer? He never made admiral, alas, but he was in charge of the 2nd Support Group throughout 1943, as well as having a role in the execution of Operation Dynamo, and defending the invasion force in Normandy from uboat attacks, eventually dying from a cerebral thrombosis, likely brought on through overwork on the 7th July 1944.
I don't think there is any other captain during the war that can claim as many uboat kills as 'Johnnie' Walker did, and I'd say as figures in the Battle of the Atlantic go, he's up there with Max Horton and Percy Noble.
 
Would it be possible for this expansion to come with a updated tutorial with a video on all of the new rule changes for new players in game. New players might not want to spend hours on the forum just to get a handle starting a Man the Guns style game with older players having a leg up, having seen all the changes. The tutorial must be getting very old and out of date by now. I want this game to be as fun as possible for all player, new and old.
 
Just annex Denmark. ;)

An easy sollution, but it is just not the same: Considering i just want the old borders of the German Empire from 1914 First: If i only take Schleswig from Denmark it will create less world tension, then annexion Denmark. Second it looks so different with Schleswig or without it! And they have added even Togo and Quingdao, so why not Schleswig? I mean the first war for German unification (1863) was about that region! There is reason enough to add it.
 
I just hope that redrawing the shape of states to reflect modern day borders wont make it impossible to create an actual WW2 border like Molotov-Ribbentrop pact or war borders of Bulgaria and Albania for example.
 
I'm specifically thinking of France for their military, not once they are defeated and in exile. Also, because France is a major whose goal in the game and at the time was the land war against Germany and how that would effect everything if they won or lost. Governments in exile get some work in MtG, though I cannot say for certain if it will cover everything.

I also want Finland to be given some love in it as well. Poland too I suppose!

I would think Italy, Spain, Turkey, Bulgaria, and Greece would get all the attention needed in a Mediterranian DLC.

Fair enough but for France, developing the Free France section of the historical game I feel should take priority over just beefing up their military capabilities, as at the moment Free France isn't very fun to play, as you generally have limited manpower, resources and factories. This would also be applicable if any new start dates are added, such as 1941 for Barbarossa. I would agree with your suggestion for a Mediterranean DLC, although I would replace Turkey for Portugal, although thats mainly due to my thoughts that Turkey would work better with a Middle East pack (with Iraq, Iran, Saudi Arabia, Afghanistan, Yemen and Oman).
 
Free France is boring not because it doesn't have an unique Focus Tree, but because their historical situation kinda sucks. De Gaulle at the beginning had only a few colonial territories without much value and less than 10.000 French volunteers for his army.

His logistic situation was even worse because even with the forced conscription in the colonies he depends on the British to even equip a few good divisions. Most goverments in the world didn't want to help De Gaulle because the Vichy Regime was the internationally recognised government. Even American politicians didn't recognize Free France as the legitimate goverment even after Operation Torch.

The government in exile mechanics in Man the Guns will help them with a few good divisions, but adding more help in a revamped Focus Tree would most likely result in unfair and ahistorical buff.

I do think that a French revamped Focus Tree should instead change the facist path with a some focuses regarding the complicate relationship with Germany and Italy, so Vichy France can use that focus tree instead of the generic one, which is boring and also overpowered.
 
Great to finally see Bosnia! weyoo!

But macedonia's and montenegro's new states make it IMPOSSIBLE to make realistic WW2 borders(in a WW2 game) so please consider adding new new states for that or smth..
 
Barbed wire and razor wire are different things!

Exactly, some noobs think barbed wire is razor wire and that is why I put it in. I never laid barbed wire, but I have laid out my fair share of razor. My first plt sgt was considered very good at it; I inherited his reputation.
 
I just wish that you would mark the historical path in the focus tree or something that hints me in the right direction.
Having to pause and wiki with every decision is educative but keeps me away from new countries.
I get that all focuses are not 100% historical on that path (Its fantastic with the debates regarding that on these forums) but starting a game of china and japan and seeing those trees, well the game won’t be finished in the coming weeks.

And the event frequency is starting to get a bit spammy specially involving China, would love if the event system had some love in the long run. It feels as it just been following with since HOI 1 look wise and information wise.

Amazing news anyway!
 
Well there are several things to unpack. Even with the turret issues with the KGV it took just 25 months to build the thing, the national government as well insisted on doing the KGV as cheaply as possible so this likely affected the overall completion dates as well.

Is that time to build or time to launch? If launch, there's still a fair bit of work to do - here's a stirring vid of Prince of Wales launching after 28 months on the slips, and there's no armament and no small amount of the superstructure is yet-to-be-completed.


Let's not derail the thread though - if you want to keep talking about the possibility of a 12-month battleship, maybe start another thread or PM me?

Indeed checking your sources further suggests the same, the UK used fewer slipways to produce more total tonnage of shipping to compare WW1 and WW2. This suggests an increase in raw speed rather than anything else. Hence a more efficient production rate, while the US with considerably more slipways do more production less efficiently.

Like I said, I wouldn't be unhappy if this was in the game :) I'm just not confident enough from what I've read to push for it myself.
 
Is that time to build or time to launch? If launch, there's still a fair bit of work to do - here's a stirring vid of Prince of Wales launching after 28 months on the slips, and there's no armament and no small amount of the superstructure is yet-to-be-completed.


Before your post yesterday, I hadn't seen you on here for a while, Axe99. I suppose you are busy with other things and just show up when a new DD comes out.