HOI4 Dev Diary - The Intelligence Agency

[Choorus]

Its easy. Make Russia start with no faction, and make it join Allies only when USSR is attcked.

Excuse me, but why the heck would we want the USSR to be part of the Allies rather than use the tripartite mechanics already developed at a great cost?

 

[Iskulya]

There is no "tripartite mechanism developed at great cost".

With that said, Soviets in the allies is supremely undesirable since it would just result in hundreds of of British and American divisions fighting in the Swamps of Pripyat which is neither historical nor desirable.

It is true that there is no Soviet faction, in reality, not while the war was ongoing. The game is wrong in portraying Tannu Tuva and Mongolia as sovereign nations. They were both integrated puppets at best.

The soviet faction exists to prevent them from joining another faction, and that is it. It does facilitate alt history of other communist countries joining them.

 

[SanguiniusStyle]

Wow...


Just see how game was in 2016 and look it now... Amazing.

I love these changes. More complexity, more fun and less social life

 

[Kalksomat]

Why would a nation with a strong Civil Industry be able to field a strong intelligence agency?
The whole connection between Civil factories and Espionage seems not logical to me

 

[Dlin369]

Why would a nation with a strong Civil Industry be able to field a strong intelligence agency?
The whole connection between Civil factories and Espionage seems not logical to me

Civilian factories in HoI4 represent economic/industrial prowess

Industrial/economic prowess means more money and assets


More money and assets = a better funded agency

a better funded agency = a more powerful agency

 

[theyouer]

Am I missing something? The CIC costs are temporary like prospecting right? So based on the prices we've been shown, a medium-sized minor with at least 15 available CIC should be able to max out their agency right? It might leave no CIC to build up other warfighting capacity but a focused Canada or even Netherlands could develop a strong program right?

Maybe I missed a recurring cost somewhere.

 

[Dlin369]

Am I missing something? The CIC costs are temporary like prospecting right? So based on the prices we've been shown, a medium-sized minor with at least 15 available CIC should be able to max out their agency right? It might leave no CIC to build up other warfighting capacity but a focused Canada or even Netherlands could develop a strong program right?

Maybe I missed a recurring cost somewhere.

Numbers in dev diaries are usually WIP, so I’m sure the time needed for some of the better upgrades will be longer. Also I’m sure there’ll be tier two upgrades that require other upgrades to unlock.

 

[Kalksomat]

Civilian factories in HoI4 represent economic/industrial prowess

Industrial/economic prowess means more money and assets


More money and assets = a better funded agency

a better funded agency = a more powerful agency

That probably makes sense for HoI with its simplistic approach to economy.

But I do think that it would also make sense for a very militarily strong nation to fund the agency through military funding. A military of course is also funded through the economy, but in the game these things are pretty much seperate, apart from the fact you can build military factories with your civil factories. You don`t need a big civil economy to pay for your big military economy once you have it.
A strong military power would probably have a big spy network, even with a small civil economy

I just think it is weird that on one hand your Civs produce soap and bread for your people`s need of consumer goods and on the other hand they can fuel your spy network.

 

[Dlin369]

That probably makes sense for HoI with its simplistic approach to economy.

But I do think that it would also make sense for a very militarily strong nation to fund the agency through military funding. A military of course is also funded through the economy, but in the game these things are pretty much seperate, apart from the fact you can build military factories with your civil factories. You don`t need a big civil economy to pay for your big military economy once you have it.
A strong military power would probably have a big spy network, even with a small civil economy

I just think it is weird that on one hand your Civs produce soap and bread for your people`s need of consumer goods and on the other hand they can fuel your spy network.

military factories and dockyards contribute to your civilian goods needs, so if you have a too military heavy economy you run into trouble with economic growth - so there is a relationship between current military factories and civilian industry

I hope the material elements of the intelligence agency stuff is paid for by military factories (like cyanide pills and cryptostuff) and personnel upgrades (like spy training and agency expansion) is paid for by civilian industry. Giving spies secret submarines would be pretty cool too

 

[Faideeeeeee21]

That´s very cool! I cant wait to figth intel wars to have an edge on the battledield!

 

[Denirosek]

I am extremely disappointed this thread wasn't named 'Listen very carefully, I will say this only once'.

 

[Kalksomat]

military factories and dockyards contribute to your civilian goods needs, so if you have a too military heavy economy you run into trouble with economic growth - so there is a relationship between current military factories and civilian industry

I hope the material elements of the intelligence agency stuff is paid for by military factories (like cyanide pills and cryptostuff) and personnel upgrades (like spy training and agency expansion) is paid for by civilian industry. Giving spies secret submarines would be pretty cool too

Military factories are not connected in any way to the need for consumer goods.
The factories needed for consumer goods are a percentage of your Civil factories and thus affected by their amount only

 

[Selzro]

Its easy. Make Russia start with no faction, and make it join Allies only when USSR is attcked.

And then Russia would have to fight Japan in every single game. I'm sure this would raise no complaints whatsoever.

 

[Axe99]

Cheers for the DD Podcat, and the super-intelligent DD . Really like the look of how the intelligence 'infrastructure' is so detailed, but also a big fan of how the spymaster can be left to the AI, if people just want to tanking around - nice design .

Naval Department - This is one of the basic branches that improves your intelligence gathering in that field. It will ensure that you get the most out of any naval intel you get.

Clearly the only department that matters .

Speaking of which, here's a pic of the Admiralty Operational Intelligence Centre (OIC) during WW2 - the central coordinating point for the Royal Navy's intelligence.

 

[llib]

We'll be covering agents in the future

What will they be covered with, concrete, or just normal earth grave? Or will it depend on how close they get to the core of the Manhattan project?

 

[pheonicia]

Military factories are not connected in any way to the need for consumer goods.
The factories needed for consumer goods are a percentage of your Civil factories and thus affected by their amount only

No? If you mouse over the tooltip it pretty clearly states that consumer goods is a percentage of all you civs miles and dockyards added together.

 

[xtfoster]

Will you be increasing the civilian factory base of the countries in the game?, I'm of the impression that, especially minor countries, have a hard time keeping up with so many features that require civilian factories (production licenses, buying resources, decisions, events, etc)

I hate to burst your bubble, but they are called 'Minors' for a reason. They aren't supposed to be able to do everything that the 'Majors' can, instead they are supposed to prioritize, or specialize.

 

[xtfoster]

I guess commandos are being added to the game?

Probably not as a unit, just as part of the spies themselves.

 

[xtfoster]

Why is there still a Comintern in the game as a Military alliance? It never existed as such. Furthermore during the war USSR joined the Allies, this should be represented. USSR being another faction is Ahistorical and prevents Allies from things like Plane stationing on Russian airbases like it historically happened:
Operation Frantic,
No. 151 Wing RAF,
Normandie-Niemen
And yes, i know that USSR was different and played its own game politically, but it can be represented in other ways, or make USSR exit allies after WW2 ends.

And historically Japan was part of the Axis, the Pact of Steel, and the Leader of the Greater East Asia Co-Prosperity Sphere - All military Alliances. Yet Japan didn't participate in the Axis war against the USSR (neither did Bulgaria for that matter). The games tries to model as close to historical without breaking the game. If the USSR was a full member of the Allies, then the Allies would be at war with Finland when the Coninuation War started (assuming it ever actually happens in game), the USSR would be at war with Japan when they kick of their part of WWII, and more importantly the USSR would be at war with itself (as part of the Allies) when it invaded Poland (assuming the game ever modeled that correctly).

 

[xtfoster]

Its easy. Make Russia start with no faction, and make it join Allies only when USSR is attcked.

Which would still force it into war with Japan when it attacks the USA/Philippines/DEI/UK. Same problem.