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Stellaris Dev Diary #100 - Titans and Planet Destroyers

Hello everyone and welcome to this very special triple digit Stellaris development diary! Today's dev diary marks the start of talking about the Apocalypse Expansion that will be accompanying the 2.0 'Cherryh' update. We still can't give you an ETA on the release of either, and there's a fair bit to cover in the expansion before then, but we're getting closer. As this is the start of talking about paid features, I just want to take a moment to reiterate that everything talked about in dev diaries 91-99 (with the exception of Dev Diary #95 which was about Humanoids) were about the Cherryh update and all features and changes mentioned in these previous dev diaries are part of the free update, NOT the expansion. Everything mentioned in this dev diary will be part of the paid Apocalypse expansion, however. Please note that some of the screenshots in this dev diary feature placeholder art and icons.


Planet Destroyers (Apocalypse Feature)
As mentioned all the way back in Dev Diary #50 and again in Dev Diary #69, Planet Destroyers have been on our wish list for quite some time, but wasn't something we could make work with restrictive nature of the old warscore system. Now that this is no longer a concern thanks to the new war system we talked about in Dev Diary #93, we finally have our chance to implement this beloved sci-fi staple.

Planet Destroyers come in the form of a new ship class called a Colossus. Though nominally a military ship, the Colossus has no actual fleet combat capability, but is instead a single massive weapon solely dedicated to the purpose of laying waste to enemy planets. To build a Colossus, you must first already know how to build Titans (more on those below) and then take the Colossus Project Ascension Perk, which unlocks a special project to research and design your first Colossus. Each Colossus mounts a single World Devastator-class weapon, and during the course of the project you will be given the option to choose which such weapon you want to focus on, with five potential options to choose from:
  • World Cracker: Shatters a planet, leaving behind a broken debris field that can be mined for resources. Available to non-Pacifists.
  • Global Pacifier: Encases the planet in an impenetrable shield, permanently cutting it off from the rest of the galaxy. A research station can be built to study the planet afterwards.
  • Neutron Sweep: Destroys most higher forms of life on the planet but leaves the infrastructure intact for colonization. Available to non-Spiritualist, non-Pacifist empires.
  • God Ray: Converts all organic Pops on the planet to spiritualist and destroys all machine/synthetic pops, as well as massively increasing spiritualist ethics attraction on the planet for a time. Available to Spiritualist empires.
  • Nanobot Dispersal: Assimilates all Pops on the planet, causing it to defect to your empire with its newly cyborgized population. Only available to Driven Assimilators (and thus requires Synthetic Dawn as well).
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(Weapon icons are placeholders)

Additional types of World Devastator weapons that are potentially available to your empire can be researched as rare technologies after finishing the Colossus project. Once the project is complete, you will be able to build a Colossus at any Starbase with a shipyard where you have the Colossus Assembly Yards building built. Once built, the Colossus functions similar to a civilian ship, in that it is own fleet, and cannot be merged with other fleets. Each empire can only have a single Colossus active at the same time, but can build a new one if their active one is destroyed.

Colossi have no conventional armaments (though we are discussing a few medium/PD turrets to them), and their real purpose is to target enemy planets. When a Colossus is ordered to target a planet, it will travel straight towards it, ignoring enemy ships entirely even if they fire on it. The Colossus will travel to the planet, take up position and begin charging its weapon. The weapon takes quite some time to charge, giving enemy fleets a chance to try and destroy the Colossus to stop it from firing (though Colossi naturally can take a great deal of punishment, they are not invincible). Once the weapons is fully charged, it will fire, executing its effects (as described above) on the hapless planet. The Colossus is then free to continue on to the next planet if you so wish. Most Colossi weapons can only target planets owned by empires you are at war with, though some of them can target primitive worlds and the World Cracker can be used on uncolonized rock-type worlds (but will not always generate a mineral deposit in that case).
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(Animations & interface are partly WIP)

The system for creating World Devastator weapons is fully scriptable, and modders will be able to create their own planet-destroying/changing effects.

Titans (Apocalypse Feature)
Titans are another new ship class available in the Apocalypse expansion, but unlike the Colossus they are much more like conventional warships. Titans are researched through a regular tier 5 technology, and can be built in any Starbase with a shipyard and the Titan Assembly Yards building. Titans are massive flagships that come equipped with an array of heavy long-ranged weaponry and layer upon layer of shields and armor. Their front section has a single Titanic-size slot that can fit weapons even stronger than XL weapons, such as the immensely powerful Perdition Beam that can fire across a whole system and potentially destroy a battleship in a single shot. Titans also have an aura slot that can fit a single offensive or defensive aura that can buff friendly ships in the same fleet or debuff nearby enemy ships. Titans are intended to be the flagships of your fleets, and as such are limited in number: You can always field at least one Titan, plus an additional amount dependent on your overall naval capacity.
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Ion Cannons (Apocalypse Feature)
Finally, there is one last Apocalype feature to talk about for today: Ion Cannons. Ion Cannons are stations that can be built as part of the defense platform fleet of a Starbase. Each Ion Cannon is essentially a single massive gun emplacement that mounts a single Titanic weapon, allowing the Starbase to engage enemy fleets at massive ranges and greatly improving the Starbase's ability to deal with enemy Battleships and Titans.
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That's all for today! Next week we'll continue talking about Cherryh and Apocalypse expansion, on the topic of Marauders, Pirates and the Great Khan.
 
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I think that this is exactly what will happen, the whine in forums about the underpowered planet destroyers will be insuportable, principally considering thar overpowered planet destroyers are worst to the tactical/stratey aspect of the game that underpowered planet destroyers.

You can't make everyone happy..but everyone can mod the offensive/defensive abilitys of this superweapons to his likings and they are all happy..except the ones that don't like modding. .__.

Looks more like a ppl problem than a game problem. ^^
 
You can't make everyone happy..but everyone can mod the offensive/defensive abilitys of this superweapons to his likings and they are all happy..except the ones that don't like modding. .__.

Looks more like a ppl problem than a game problem. ^^

Of course it's a "people problem". People like and demand all the wrong things :(

(that's only half-serious)
 
Problem is, they will inevitably go one of two ways: either so game-breakingly OP that the only valid strategy will be rushing for one ASAP; or impractical/situational/expensive enough for that not to happen, but instead cause a tide of people whining about how they're underpowered and that by the time they get one, they should have paved the way for an easy "win" rather than being as underwhelming as they are. I simply don't see this turning out that well.

Let's not be overly pessimistic about human nature! Surely there's a happy median where half the people complain that they are game-breakingly OP and the other half complain that they are too impractical/situational/expensive.
 
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You can't make everyone happy..but everyone can mod the offensive/defensive abilitys of this superweapons to his likings and they are all happy..except the ones that don't like modding. .__.

Looks more like a ppl problem than a game problem. ^^

I want to build a space empire without cheating, but I suck so I don't have a choice.
 
Let's not be overly pessimistic about human nature! Surely there happy median where half the people complain that they are game-breakingly OP and the other half complain that they are too impractical/situational/expensive.

I like you xD
 
Can not wait until this patch and expansion comes out along with 2.0 it's what I've been waiting for! Does that mean I can use the colossus to destroy tiny planets in neigboring systems that are useless an replace the system with ringworlds? I know in the base you couldn't.
 
I want to build a space empire without cheating, but I suck so I don't have a choice.

What exactly means cheating on a single player game. oO

And nobody says something about making things easier, only different.

If you feel better look at yourself like a godlike creator compareable with the ones that actually build the game. All you do is creating a galaxy like your vision of how it should be.

If you are more in masochism give the ai 1000% bonus on everything and watch your worlds burning. :p
 
Hmm...
Yes. This is good.
Really look forward to this update and expansion.

The question is if you would be able to un-shield the shielded worlds once you don't need them anymore/want to colonize them.
I mean, it seems like something you would be able to do if you were the one who created the shield. o_O
 
The question is if you would be able to un-shield the shielded worlds once you don't need them anymore/want to colonize them.
I mean, it seems like something you would be able to do if you were the one who created the shield. o_O

Oh sure, let us also re-assemble the planets we smashed, instant-repopulate the worlds we neutron bomb'd; and de-godifiy the planets we god ray'd. Obviously if we did the process, we should easily be able to reverse it.
 
I wouldn't mind to see relation drop modifier after player constructs doomsday weapon - others would be afraid of using this cannon on them in case of war. After all, primary function of this stuff is to wipe off (AKA purge) whole populations on targeted planets.

BTW can you target your own colonized planets?
 
@Wiz Out of curiosity,are the enigmatic shields and core being depicted on the same ships here an indication we may be able to acquire both of them again from the Enigmatic Fortress chain?I feel like the nerf to the fortress in general was a bit heavy handed and would love to see it restored to at least some of it's former glory.
 
I just want to throw my own bit into this, even though i fully expect it to be lost in space and time.

I have so far not posted on any of the previous dev posts(at least not for this expansion) because I really am generally positive and the concerns I do have have never been large enough to be worth the time. Also, I am one of those people that really never cared much for doomsday weapons or titian class ships, so I walk into this with a rather neutral opinion to start.


That said, I found the post pretty underwhelming and here is why:

It plays the concepts too straight and does not really give me confidence that they are explored enough to be more then gimmicks. While I never begged for them to be implemented, I fear that something is still wasted if they are implemented half focused or rushed.
First, the Titians:
I worry they fall into the same niche of battleships(or replace that niche) and shift everything one step down, then people want another bigger class again and so forth.

If they are to be added, they need to be completely unique in their role, as stated in the main post, they should be the flagship. But a flagship is not the ship with the big bad gun, or it should not be because otherwise it can be just as well be replaced by an equally powerful number of smaller ships. I think for the Titian to be interesting and more then a gimmick you need to focus on the support role that the ship holds. I already appreciate that the passive aura buffs have been given back to it(the battleships had them in 1.00) but unless they have been massively reworked that is simply not enough, as it did not do much in 1.00 either.

I much rather they would be explored in a mechanical sense that is not currently implemented.(and yes, that is a lot of work, but that is why I said that it should not be rushed or half hearted) Give a fleet that has a Titian class ship special activateable abilities that add some player input into fights.

For example, the flagship can coordinate all the ships in the fleet to gain extra dodge, to increase fire power, divert power to shields. Or more drastic moves, like the flagship "shielding" the rest of the fleet and drawing all fire to itself and having to be destroyed before the other ships become targetable, or the flagship allowing the rest of the fleet to emergency FTL without any form of damage or casualties but forcing itself to be left behind(either being destroyed in the action or simply being the only ship left).
Even those are admittedly pretty boring examples, but it is an idea the actual dev's could expand on, the point being that a fleet of 10k strength and a titan(lets say having 5k strength) is not equal to a fleet of 15k fleet strength, because the titan adds a tangible benefit that other ships can not replace. Otherwise I don't see how you will effectively make the Titian different from having a few more battleships in your fleet. And no, big long range gun isn't really a tangible difference to me because distance has so little actual gameplay meaning in this game and battleships can pretty much shoot across the system already.


Ion cannons is whatever and kinda suffer from the same issue, but even the dev post seemed not to care to talk about them much. I will just say that the name is grossly representative of the idea to me, as someone who grew up with star wars I expected it to be a gun that stuns ships, not blows them up. To which I will say, if Titians actually became more interesting and as such focal points of conflict, I would love for the ion cannon to do exactly that, stun the enemy titan to disable whatever boosts or benefits it was giving to the rest of the fleet, allowing you to counter the key strategy the enemy was implementing.

As for the big one, the planet destroyers, it fared the best out of the 3 features but I feel like it wasnt explored far enough.

  • World Cracker: Is generic but fine, it does what it needs to.

    Global Pacifier:
    I really hope they expand on this idea because I thought this was the best of the options(from how interesting it is) and it had made me hopeful the rest would be just as good. It would be really neat if the shield can not only be studied but also (With a lot of effort) be broken again, by whoever owns the space and the research station around it. This would lead into some really interesting event chains where the species on the planet, once freed, could have changed in the time that has passed. I would advice a bunch of different events that could happen. They could simply become militaristic in responds to having been treated so poorly(and not protected by their empire). They could have been stuck in a time bubble where things move faster(or slower, though faster is more interesting) then the rest of the galaxy, so that while it takes you 10 years to break them out, for them 100 years past(or more) and their bodies have evolved to adapt to this new environment. They could also be all dead, the planet now a tomb world as the inhabitants decided that existing in a planet cut off from the rest of the galaxy was not worth it and inacted a mass self extinction suicide(or simply a war for resources)

    You would never know what really will happen to the planet when you encase it, but the wide array of possibilities would make it epic, not just to encase it, but also to free it down the line. I think the planet destroyer's really need something like this to make it more then just a gimmick.
  • Neutron Sweep: This one is fine, though it would still be cool if it had a chance to mutate some of the pops or draw the attention from other empires(maybe unbidden)
  • God Ray: This one is pretty cool but the way it is described I am confused who would actually use it, just because the planet is now spiritualist doesnt mean you stopped being at war with them and they would still hate you? Maybe I misjudging it, but I just have some concerns that its implementation at release will either be too weak or too strong.(For example, can you constantly nuke your own planets to force all your pops to be spiritualist? It doesn't state it has any downside. In which case I would say that spiritualists should just be able to build these on space stations to god ray their own pops at all time, but then you are removing the whole faction system from the ethic in late game)

  • Nanobot Dispersal: This one is fine too but I don't really understand why its unique to the Driven Assimilators, it feels overly restrictive because I can see militaristic synthetic empires using it too, and even the rogue servitors to use it in a modified form to turn all the pops obedient(aka god ray but for rogue servitors).


    Preferably I think there should be one for each ethic, though I understand that would be a lot of work. But atm the spread of options feels random and like picked out of a hat, one very specific empire gets a whole weapon type to itself and itself alone, then one ethic(spiritalist) get a gun to itself, but the authoritarians don't seem to have ANY option to them.
    Here is my list, one for each ethic:

    Milistariest: World Cracker.

    Pacifist: Global Pacifer

    Xenophobe: Neutron sweep

    Materialist: Nano Dispersal

    Spiritualist: God Ray

    Authoritarian: They wouldn't want to blow up the planet, or lock it into a shield, or kill all the pops, and can't god ray them because its not a religion. Why wouldn't the authoritarians have a gun that turns all the people on the planet into mindless slave husks? I would argue OP, but the god ray opened that door and I could easily advice balance options, have it massively insult other empires(even more then most of the others), have it have a big fail risks, instead accidentally killing many of the pops in the process or even driving some of them into zombies and forcing you to still land armies to clean up the mess.

    Xenophile: A weapon that works like the proposed Nanobot Dispersal for Rogue Servitors, making all the pop's into some form of pet pop that removes their happiness bar and massively reduces productivity but makes them passively increase Xenophile happiness.(I admit, I am reaching here, but it be a pretty funny to Pettfy a bunch of giant space spider in the style of Wander over Yonder)

  • Egalitarian: This one I really can't come up with one because the idea of modifying or even hampering another race all together seems to go against the ethos, maybe they simply drop care packages and make the pops more happy all together.



    You might think my ideas stupid or unreasonably difficult to implement, but let me reiterate my core point, non of these need to be put into the game, but I do feel that both Titians and Planet Destroyers, if bothered to be implemented, should feel unique and like fully fleshed out concepts rather then just battleships +1 and planet exploders. Making a planet vanish once or twice is cool, but having long term irreversible affects to a planet and its population, and the whole galaxy to witness it, would make for much more interesting scenarios. And you can still have your vanilla planet cracker for those who just need a quick simple solution.
 
Oh sure, let us also re-assemble the planets we smashed, instant-repopulate the worlds we neutron bomb'd; and de-godifiy the planets we god ray'd. Obviously if we did the process, we should easily be able to reverse it.
For real? C'mon, I was just stating my opinion. No need to quote what I said and make fun of me.
If you Think about it, un-shielding a World isn't really that far-fetched. I mean, for real, you can create a ringworld with 100 tiles (four full sized planets) and bend the laws of the universe with the Jump Drive. Why should you NOT be able to deactivate your own shield?

Anyway, you can have your opinion, and I can have mine. Just, don't make fun of people. It's not fun.
 
For real? C'mon, I was just stating my opinion. No need to quote what I said and make fun of me.
If you Think about it, un-shielding a World isn't really that far-fetched. I mean, for real, you can create a ringworld with 100 tiles (four full sized planets) and bend the laws of the universe with the Jump Drive. Why should you NOT be able to deactivate your own shield?

Anyway, you can have your opinion, and I can have mine. Just, don't make fun of people. It's not fun.

If anything, it's weird that we can't unshield the them. We can unshield worlds that we find in FE territory, and let's face it: the shields they've made are far superiour to ours.

Also, if shielding can't be undone, then what makes it even different from World Cracker? Sure, there's a different "flavour" to it similar to comparing Determined Exterminators and Driven Assimilators, but in the end both are hated by all organics in the entire galaxy.
 
For real? C'mon, I was just stating my opinion. No need to quote what I said and make fun of me.
If you Think about it, un-shielding a World isn't really that far-fetched. I mean, for real, you can create a ringworld with 100 tiles (four full sized planets) and bend the laws of the universe with the Jump Drive. Why should you NOT be able to deactivate your own shield?
The same reason you can't rebuild the planet you cracked. Building a planet should actually be easier than building a ringworld.

Also, if shielding can't be undone, then what makes it even different from World Cracker? Sure, there's a different "flavour"
Don't dismiss the flavour. The flavour is the entire point. It's why pacifists can have it.