Tinto Flavour #22 - 27th of May 2025

[GeorgeVVBush]

Ok, first of all, who made Joey Diaz King of Georgia? Not that I'm against it, I'd just be baffled if the king will start rambling about how Saracens killed Michael Jacks... I mean, Choban Noyan.

On a serious note though, I kind of expected slightly more content for presentation . With that being said, I'd like to add a few more suggestions for Georgia:

1) add two additional Advances:

1. Georgian Embassies (Age of Reformation) - Georgia maintained relations with Western powers and regular correspondence with Catholic sovereigns even during the internal turmoil and near constant war against islamic powers. Moreover, Georgians were somewhat more cordial and friendly towards Catholics compared to other Orthodox nations at the time. Effect: +1 diplomatic reputation and halved religious penalty due to religious differences with Catholic powers (or something like that)
2. Legal Reforms of King Vakhtang - Referring to the extensive Legal reforms, conducted by Scholarly minded king Vakhtang VI of Kartil, new legal regulations helped to somewhat regulate and allevate the plight caused by the internal turmoil in the country. Effect: monthly control gain +0.10

2) I'd like to suggest several policies and estate privileges as well:

1. Sadrosho Districts (Policy) - sadroshos were military divisions of the country, that organized armies from the different parts of the kingdom. Meaning "Banners", they were headed by the Military officials, and often, Clergy that were loyal to the monarch. Effect: Army Discipline +10%, Levy size +10%, clergy Influence +25%
2. Church Militant (Clergy Privilege) - Georgian Orthodox tradition was distinguished from its sister churches with its attitude towards war. Most notably, participation of the Church officials in the military affairs and the presence of the concepts similar to the holy war and crusade, that made it somewhat more akin to the Latins in that regard, than Greeks. Effect: Army Morale +15%, Clergy can lead armies, clergy influence +50%
3. Satsikhistavo (Nobles Privilege0 - A special Tax allocated to sustain "Tsikhistavis" ( Castellans ) and their charges. This ensured that Georgian Defensive capabilities would not wither, but it presented an additional financial burden for the kingdom. effect: Fort Maintenance -20%, monthly development +0.10, Nobles loyalty +5%, tax efficiiency -10%

some of the suggestions for Localizations:
Government (Ruler)
Empire - Imperia (Imperatori)
Kingdom - Samepo(Mepe/Dedopali)
Duchy - Saeristavo (Eristavi)
County - Samouravo (Mouravi)

Duchy (Subject/Protectorate of Georgia or Georgian State) - Samtavro(Mtavari)
Samtavros were semindependent entities with Mtavaris having considerably large autonomy, compared to Eristavis that functionally, administratively and even etymologically were more similar to the Byzantine Strategoi than actual Dukes. Georgia is Gender Neutral language and doesnt really have female equivalents for the Political positions (asides Dedopali (Queen) though, Female Sovereigns (and not Queen consorts) such as Tamar and Rusudan were refered to as "Mepes" ). Early Georgian Language didnt distingush clearly between Kingdom and Empire, with Samepo generally meant "realm" and mepe meaning "sovereign" (again, similarly to Greek "Basileia" and "Basileus", though several imperial titles were present in the early tongue such as Keisari (Caesar) and Tvitmpkrobeli (Autocrat). However, by the timespan of the game, "Imperia" and "Imperatori" began to enter Georgian language. For example, the title was used with the correspondence with the Austrian and Spanish Monarchs. So, I think that Imperia and Imperator would be an appropriate localizations for that time

 

[Alekslav123]

I wrote the "Sveštenstvo" thing and some other stuff, but as ppl have pointed out kler was used and I'm not knowledgeable enough on the kler and klir different to give an opinion. "Meštanin" only means you are from a place, If you live in Barcelona you are a meštanin of barcelona thats it, a king/emperor is a meštanin of his capital, it in no way implies that you are a merchant, rich or poor so it should be chaned to "Trgovci" in my opinion but if there's some old word I'm not remembering that whould be better. Since all the estates have non-english names you chould rename the crown "Kruna" it's a 1 to 1 translation.

"Krayishnik" sould be "Krajišnik" and the privilege sould be called "Krajišnik Vlastelin", it means a noble who's in charge of that area.

A local "Baština" has cultural significance so maybe add one more effect to reflect that like?

Hajduks were freedom fighters against the turks I know theres no ambush/gorila warfere bonus to add so maybe add vision throw forest? Hajduks hid in mountains and forests and were adept at navigating that type of terrain, they also went into hiding during winter when the whould be easier to spot so to counter the additional vision maybe make it not work in winter?

Dušan had a nickname "Silni" meaning to do whatever he wanted with no regard for right/wrong/price/consequence/opinion, there's no good translation that i can think of so maybe just don't translate it? I've also seen him being clled "the Mighty" but that's not the point of his nikename.

Dušan called himself Emperor of Serbs and Greeks(Romeja in old serbian) maybe give an event to accept/tolerate greek culture.

The Dušan's law called "Law of the godfearing/godbeliveing Emperor Stefan" was a important point in his reign and was famously strict and cruel so there rly should be an advance for it imo.

He also moved the capital to Skoplje so maybe add an event for that.

Lastly the fall of the empire at least in serbia is accredited to Dušan's heir Uroš "Nejaki" which mean weak (literal translation is not strong), who because of his inability to rule and being a child in time of his fathers death lost control of nobility and became in practice a ceremonial figure, the famous Knez Lazar (Count Lazar) who the ppl now call Emperor Lazar (I don't know when that started) was the leading nobleman in the now fragmented empire and was the leader of the army of the battle of Kosovo in 1389 where bouth he and Murat died. Because off all of that I think the disaster should focus less on the rebel growth or pretender (there was only one important one to my knowledge and he later proclaimed himself an Emperor in Epirus) it should focus on nobles being more powerful and decrese in control nation wide. A possible alternative history chould be an event chain to remove Uroš from the trone and crown Knez Lazar who was a cout/duke of Kruševac and it's surrounding. Theres also the battle of Marica where brothers Mrnjavčević lead a force against the ottoman push into the balkans and faild maybe add an event to support them or fund then if you add that battle as it was a big push for the ottomans.

This is all that comes to mind for now I'm very glad to see you guys listened (idk if it was because of me lol) and removed all the à/è and such. This was meant to be a reply on @Pavia 's reply to @BokicaTheEpic but as it has gonne this long and I want as many ppl who may know more then me to see it I'm posting it as a separate comment.

I think "Silni" being translated as Mighty is fine. Although Mighty is more aptly translated as "Moćni" it being used here as a translation for Silni works, as it still gets the general meaning across. It isnt an Ivan Grozni to Ivan the terrible type of situation

 

[Dzogli]

I think "Silni" being translated as Mighty is fine. Although Mighty is more aptly translated as "Moćni" it being used here as a translation for Silni works, as it still gets the general meaning across. It isnt an Ivan Grozni to Ivan the terrible type of situation

Well my problem with Mighty is that it only comes across as someone strong, "Silni" is more in the lines of "the Great" but more crule and tyrant like, so I'd like it better if it wasn't translated.

 

[Varus90]

"Silni" is more in the lines of "the Great" but more crule and tyrant like,

"The Terrible".

 

[Sizvahstar]

View attachment 1307666

https://www.earthenv.org/topography

https://www.opentopodata.org/datasets/mapzen/

View attachment 1307665

This is a great asset!

Looks like Austria's topography would get a bit of a nerf if followed zealously, though?

 

[PEliaz]

This is not the real life heightmap. This is still a highly stylised version, which overexaggerates a lot of the Southern Georgian / Armenian topography, and simplifies the shape of the Caucasus a lot. (And makes the shapes of the mountains too big/simple)

The actual DEM is a lot more high-res and diverse than this.
Hoping to see it drift more towards the IRL DEM (and add some snow to those mountaintops, too!)
Edit: that said, these screenshots are probably from a previous version, before they switched to the IRL DEM.

@Pavía can you elaborate whether or not these screenshots are from the new topographic style, or the old?

Some quick blender renders for a similar angle:

Monochrome	With DEM coloration
View attachment 1307610	View attachment 1307609

When I was watching a EU5 Youtuber I took these screenshots. At 21:24 and 25:18

 

[Alekslav123]

"The Terrible".

 

[giorgi1999]

@Pavía are there any Georgian collapse mechanics? Since even the Polish szlachta coup and the Muscovite Time of Troubles are scripted, I'd imagine this one would be too.

Yeah without any such mechanic, you might as well not bother with trying to represent Georgia accurately during this period.

 

[giorgi1999]

View attachment 1307754

View attachment 1307755

When I was watching a EU5 Youtuber I took these screenshots. At 21:24 and 25:18

Is this the real life?
Is this just fantasy?

 

[BokicaTheEpic]

I wrote the "Sveštenstvo" thing and some other stuff, but as ppl have pointed out kler was used and I'm not knowledgeable enough on the kler and klir different to give an opinion. "Meštanin" only means you are from a place, If you live in Barcelona you are a meštanin of barcelona thats it, a king/emperor is a meštanin of his capital, it in no way implies that you are a merchant, rich or poor so it should be chaned to "Trgovci" in my opinion but if there's some old word I'm not remembering that whould be better. Since all the estates have non-english names you chould rename the crown "Kruna" it's a 1 to 1 translation.

"Krayishnik" sould be "Krajišnik" and the privilege sould be called "Krajišnik Vlastelin", it means a noble who's in charge of that area.

A local "Baština" has cultural significance so maybe add one more effect to reflect that like?

Hajduks were freedom fighters against the turks I know theres no ambush/gorila warfere bonus to add so maybe add vision throw forest? Hajduks hid in mountains and forests and were adept at navigating that type of terrain, they also went into hiding during winter when the whould be easier to spot so to counter the additional vision maybe make it not work in winter?

Dušan had a nickname "Silni" meaning to do whatever he wanted with no regard for right/wrong/price/consequence/opinion, there's no good translation that i can think of so maybe just don't translate it? I've also seen him being clled "the Mighty" but that's not the point of his nikename.

Dušan called himself Emperor of Serbs and Greeks(Romeja in old serbian) maybe give an event to accept/tolerate greek culture.

The Dušan's law called "Law of the godfearing/godbeliveing Emperor Stefan" was a important point in his reign and was famously strict and cruel so there rly should be an advance for it imo.

He also moved the capital to Skoplje so maybe add an event for that.

Lastly the fall of the empire at least in serbia is accredited to Dušan's heir Uroš "Nejaki" which mean weak (literal translation is not strong), who because of his inability to rule and being a child in time of his fathers death lost control of nobility and became in practice a ceremonial figure, the famous Knez Lazar (Count Lazar) who the ppl now call Emperor Lazar (I don't know when that started) was the leading nobleman in the now fragmented empire and was the leader of the army of the battle of Kosovo in 1389 where bouth he and Murat died. Because off all of that I think the disaster should focus less on the rebel growth or pretender (there was only one important one to my knowledge and he later proclaimed himself an Emperor in Epirus) it should focus on nobles being more powerful and decrese in control nation wide. A possible alternative history chould be an event chain to remove Uroš from the trone and crown Knez Lazar who was a cout/duke of Kruševac and it's surrounding. Theres also the battle of Marica where brothers Mrnjavčević lead a force against the ottoman push into the balkans and faild maybe add an event to support them or fund then if you add that battle as it was a big push for the ottomans.

This is all that comes to mind for now I'm very glad to see you guys listened (idk if it was because of me lol) and removed all the à/è and such. This was meant to be a reply on @Pavia 's reply to @BokicaTheEpic but as it has gonne this long and I want as many ppl who may know more then me to see it I'm posting it as a separate comment.

Cool ideas, just one thing. Trgovci just means merchants/traders, it excludes other city/guild professions like bankers or city blacksmiths. I think that Građanstvo is the closest word for discribing the whole burgher estate. I mean if you look at it burgher just means burgh(castle*/town)-er(person*), so I don't think Građanstvo would be a bad idea, I mean it is used in academia and schools to describe the burgher class. Aslo great remark, meštanstvo really does not mean anything in Serbian.

 

[Masau]

Great dev diary! I have two questions though:

1. Does Armenia have content? (A substantial or small amount?)
2. Do formables show how much content they give? Would be nice to know, maybe something similar to the nation picker where it shows the amount of advances and events each one has.

 

[xxTesa]

Could there be a special event with Serbia that would allow the King to proclaim himself Eastern Roman Emperor by conquering Constantinople ?

 

[Alekslav123]

Great dev diary! I have two questions though:

1. Does Armenia have content? (A substantial or small amount?)
2. Do formables show how much content they give? Would be nice to know, maybe something similar to the nation picker where it shows the amount of advances and events each one has.

Im not sure if it counts potential events for available formables, but I saw in one of the youtube videos regarding EUV that when picking a nation before game start, on the upper left side of the screen it lists the amount of events a nation has (for example i think Serbia has around 27 while a nation like England has about 250 if i remember correctly)

 

[Dzogli]

Cool ideas, just one thing. Trgovci just means merchants/traders, it excludes other city/guild professions like bankers or city blacksmiths. I think that Građanstvo is the closest word for discribing the whole burgher estate. I mean if you look at it burgher just means burgh(castle*/town)-er(person*), so I don't think Građanstvo would be a bad idea, I mean it is used in academia and schools to describe the burgher class. Aslo great remark, meštanstvo really does not mean anything in Serbian.

My focus was on merchants yes, in modern Serbian at least just like to be a "meštanin" is to be from somewhere to be a "gradjanin" is just to be from that city, this includes the poor so I thought it whould be better not to use gradjanstvo (dj and đ are the same thing) but yeah it's a lot better then meštanstvo. Castle/town -er is fine for english i guess cause burgh is no longer used but I feel like "Gradjanstvo" even if it is the correct translation whould create confusion because of it's modern meaning. "Zanatlije" whould be the burghers of the lower class, blacksmiths and such but exludes bankers and traders. No other words come to mind right now, gradjanstvo even if not perfect imo is far better then meštanstvo and trgovci does exlude too much you are right so gradjanstvo might be the way to go.

 

[Inzano]

Why do I have a bad feeling that Pavia will no longer answer questions. Yesterday he was still active until 5pm on the Venice Genoa flavour thread, but here he finished at 3:30pm. He thought: "I don't want to deal with the Balkans".

 

[Alekslav123]

My focus was on merchants yes, in modern Serbian at least just like to be a "meštanin" is to be from somewhere to be a "gradjanin" is just to be from that city, this includes the poor so I thought it whould be better not to use gradjanstvo (dj and đ are the same thing) but yeah it's a lot better then meštanstvo. Castle/town -er is fine for english i guess cause burgh is no longer used but I feel like "Gradjanstvo" even if it is the correct translation whould create confusion because of it's modern meaning. "Zanatlije" whould be the burghers of the lower class, blacksmiths and such but exludes bankers and traders. No other words come to mind right now, gradjanstvo even if not perfect imo is far better then meštanstvo and trgovci does exlude too much you are right so gradjanstvo might be the way to go.

Zanatlije would be neat, but yeah, like you said, doesnt really fit bankers or traders. I mostly agree with Bokica on this. Gradjanstvo would be the best equivalent to Burghers. Although you are right that if Used in its literal translation, it would refer to everyone living in a city, the same can be said for burgher if it was translated literally, but since burgher is used to refer to a social class rather than location of residents i think the same courtesy can be given to gradjanstvo in this case

 

[Masau]

Im not sure if it counts potential events for available formables, but I saw in one of the youtube videos regarding EUV that when picking a nation before game start, on the upper left side of the screen it lists the amount of events a nation has (for example i think Serbia has around 27 while a nation like England has about 250 if i remember correctly)

Yeah, I know, but would be nice since many nations can form the same and multiple nations so it wouldn't maek sense to add from all the possibilities. In the Russia falvour talk they said something like Muscovy has 100 events and another 80 IF they for Russia.


I belive they only show content for the base nation, not all formables it can make. And since you can't form all nations (considering formable tiers prevent forming lower tier nations) there can be different paths and, as such, there can't be a pre-defined and fixed ammount of content displayed to the player since their choices affect the amount of content.

 

[Dzogli]

Zanatlije would be neat, but yeah, like you said, doesnt really fit bankers or traders. I mostly agree with Bokica on this. Gradjanstvo would be the best equivalent to Burghers. Although you are right that if Used in its literal translation, it would refer to everyone living in a city, the same can be said for burgher if it was translated literally, but since burgher is used to refer to a social class rather than location of residents i think the same courtesy can be given to gradjanstvo in this case

The difference is that in modern English burgh isn't used so theres no confusion, while in Serbian garad is still used.

 

[Inzano]

My focus was on merchants yes, in modern Serbian at least just like to be a "meštanin" is to be from somewhere to be a "gradjanin" is just to be from that city, this includes the poor so I thought it whould be better not to use gradjanstvo (dj and đ are the same thing) but yeah it's a lot better then meštanstvo. Castle/town -er is fine for english i guess cause burgh is no longer used but I feel like "Gradjanstvo" even if it is the correct translation whould create confusion because of it's modern meaning. "Zanatlije" whould be the burghers of the lower class, blacksmiths and such but exludes bankers and traders. No other words come to mind right now, gradjanstvo even if not perfect imo is far better then meštanstvo and trgovci does exlude too much you are right so gradjanstvo might be the way to go.

"Zanatlije" would be better name for laborers then?

 

[Trepanator]

Why do I have a bad feeling that Pavia will no longer answer questions. Yesterday he was still active until 5pm on the Venice Genoa flavour thread, but here he finished at 3:30pm. He thought: "I don't want to deal with the Balkans".

honestly, a valid thought