u are forgetting 1 important trait
in phase A allies get dis:
that is ZOOMSNIPE btw ^-^
and axis get a dis:
and thats if they are lucky. usualy they get something like DIS:
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u are forgetting 1 important trait
in phase A allies get dis:
that is ZOOMSNIPE btw ^-^
and axis get a dis:
and thats if they are lucky. usualy they get something like DIS:
What does that have to do with the "Allies numbers advantage is expressed in their cards" that clearly doesn't exist?
Why are you bitching about phase distribution when I'm addressing numbers per card and number of cards.
There is no meaningful difference in actual availability of tanks across all decks with the exception of Winhund and 2DB being outliers but not even by much.
The quality of those tanks is a completely different discussion.
Why are you bitching about phase distribution when I'm addressing numbers per card and number of cards.
There is no meaningful difference in actual availability of tanks across all decks with the exception of Winhund and 2DB being outliers but not even by much.
The quality of those tanks is a completely different discussion.
I'm curious why availability, specifically German surplus of tanks, is so bothersome for you. I totally understand if you think the availability is too low for some Allied divisions but having two per card of something that costs 280 points seems to be pretty reasonable for decks that rely on it. Obviously that was just a random example and I am not even sure you have an issue with that particular example but I am curious as to what really upsets you about the German surplus. Can you list a few examples within the decks that you think have too many of a certain sort of tank?
I'm not even complaining about that now. That ship sailed a long time ago.
All I did was point out that zoomsnipe was wrong to state that the historical Allies numbers advantage is expressed in their cards, which they are not because most all Axis decks have cards that mirror those of the Allies.
My questioning before was about 3rd armored vs 12th SS during the closed beta and also in the open beta. It was a question of design. Why does 3rd Armored get access to roughly 16% of its real life medium tank complement and 12th SS gets close to 50% of its Panthers and PzIVs. It has nothing to do with X unit being OP, it has to do with deck building and options, and forcing a player to think about deck building. I'm not a fan of the large number of 76's and Jumbos in 3rd Armored but I'm also not sure why I should be able to build a deck of straight Panthers with 12th SS. If 12th SS had the same 15 or 16% availablility of its premium tanks like 3rd Armored had then they'd only have access to like 10 Panthers. And they'd have like 15 PzIV's.
Those Panthers and PzIV's would have different distributions through the Phase system and a player would still have to look at veterancy when building a deck. It would be more nuanced and you would certainly see more PzIV's than you did with 12th SS. A good player may still only need to deploy like 6 Panthers an entire round and be set, but at least they would probably have to build a deck that put them on the razor's edge of reserves to do so, which is why more PzIV's would be seen.
It has nothing to do with crying about something being OP which is why I was so f*cking irritated with wehraboos crying about me touching thier precious Hitler Youth, when the reality was that I was at no point looking at it from a 3rd Armored POV. All of my complaints about 12th SS have come from MY TIME PLAYING WITH THE DIVISION and feeling like it wasn't challenging and deck building was braindead.
I WANT TO FACE hordes of Shermans with my Panthers. I want to feel insecure about my flanks. I want to know that I don't have that many tanks at my disposal. What I don't want is 4 Jumbos and 4 Panthers shooting at one another at 1000m and doing nothing. It's awful gameplay and it isn't even remotely historical.
All I did was point out that zoomsnipe was wrong to state that the historical Allies numbers advantage is expressed in their cards, which they are not because most all Axis decks have cards that mirror those of the Allies.
My questioning before was about 3rd armored vs 12th SS during the closed beta and also in the open beta. It was a question of design. Why does 3rd Armored get access to roughly 16% of its real life medium tank complement and 12th SS gets close to 50% of its Panthers and PzIVs. It has nothing to do with X unit being OP, it has to do with deck building and options, and forcing a player to think about deck building. I'm not a fan of the large number of 76's and Jumbos in 3rd Armored but I'm also not sure why I should be able to build a deck of straight Panthers with 12th SS. If 12th SS had the same 15 or 16% availablility of its premium tanks like 3rd Armored had then they'd only have access to like 10 Panthers. And they'd have like 15 PzIV's.
Those Panthers and PzIV's would have different distributions through the Phase system and a player would still have to look at veterancy when building a deck. It would be more nuanced and you would certainly see more PzIV's than you did with 12th SS. A good player may still only need to deploy like 6 Panthers an entire round and be set, but at least they would probably have to build a deck that put them on the razor's edge of reserves to do so, which is why more PzIV's would be seen.
It has nothing to do with crying about something being OP which is why I was so f*cking irritated with wehraboos crying about me touching thier precious Hitler Youth, when the reality was that I was at no point looking at it from a 3rd Armored POV. All of my complaints about 12th SS have come from MY TIME PLAYING WITH THE DIVISION and feeling like it wasn't challenging and deck building was braindead.
I WANT TO FACE hordes of Shermans with my Panthers. I want to feel insecure about my flanks. I want to know that I don't have that many tanks at my disposal. What I don't want is 4 Jumbos and 4 Panthers shooting at one another at 1000m and doing nothing. It's awful gameplay and it isn't even remotely historical.
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Also, not to mention, I've long been shitty with Eugen for their choices in balancing availability. For the most part, in Red Dragon they just did mirrored availability with some random exceptions like allowing 4 x Challenger II's or a ton of Strv122's.
I felt that when they decided to do a historical game with historical TO&E, and decided to create battlegroups from those TO&E's that they should've just picked a percentage and applied that uniformly across the game. At least for things like vehicles and possibly towed pieces. This would avoid a lot of the "X division is OP or has too many of Y".
If you can simply say "all divisions are given equal treatment with regard to their historical complement" there's really nothing to bitch about. Fact is fact. When you start allowing one division to have such a lopsided availability, you open the game up for a lot of bitching from people like me.
It's either blatant favoritism, laziness, or shitty game design. It certainly cannot be seen as fair.
But I guess Eugen with all their great community interactions over the years would just call it "Flavor".
I felt that when they decided to do a historical game with historical TO&E, and decided to create battlegroups from those TO&E's that they should've just picked a percentage and applied that uniformly across the game. At least for things like vehicles and possibly towed pieces. This would avoid a lot of the "X division is OP or has too many of Y".
If you can simply say "all divisions are given equal treatment with regard to their historical complement" there's really nothing to bitch about. Fact is fact. When you start allowing one division to have such a lopsided availability, you open the game up for a lot of bitching from people like me.
It's either blatant favoritism, laziness, or shitty game design. It certainly cannot be seen as fair.
But I guess Eugen with all their great community interactions over the years would just call it "Flavor".
i was just showing as allies u can get out a bunch of medium in phase A, while axis get barely anything. so while allies may have similar/ only slightly better per card tanks as axis in B and C, they also have a lot in phase A. that is 10 whole minutes of multiple allied mediums fighting at best a StuG that is easily flanked, or a firefly that is 200 points with a single MG and no HE.
u wanna know why windhund have shit phase B and C availability? because it is the only axis deck to get medium tanks and 1200m TDs in phase A, and on top of the availability hit they have the worst income in the entire game. all for capability that a lot of allied decks already have. well not rly their firesupport is shit outside of 800m autocannons because the pz III have needle gun and Marder have only 10 HE rounds. i am not complaining about phase distribution or crying about windhund, i am completely fine with the balance in this game just stating some information that u are not considering.
because flavour. and by phase B a good allied armour deck player could and would already have 2-6 mediums, lights, and TD's on the map. good luck building 6 panther when all your shit is getting blasted by m10's, shermans and/ or cromwells.
and well here is the problem. panthers and tigers are easy to control, you just find a good spot and and attack move with support, all u have to do is not make stupid choices like dueling a sherman in 300m. the allied player has to be aggressive in phase A, and keep up the pressure in B so that even IF axis get a breakthrough in C, they still lose. and this is actually very easy to do with pancerna, guards, and especially france with good players.
killing these tanks also requires effort from the allied player, because he either needs to stun, position and then execute a proper flank attack, prepare a rush.etc.. and this takes a lot of micro. in pub matches axis heavy tank are disproportionately powerful, but in high skill matches they are an expensive tool that requires a large portion of your army worth of support to thrive. and if you try making heavy plays without that proper support (which is common since axis is usually down on conquest points), they are a nice 280-380 point pinata.
as for your point about 12th SS deckbuilding being braindead... i take 2 card of panzer IV one in phase C. do u? probably all panther and tiger because:
in pub matches its just: "hey guys lets camp!!! OK!!!!!!!!!!" 15 minute later due to no pressure being exerted on axis player they just sit and save for all the toys and slow push the allies off the map, who do not even have the skill to fight against the panthers to begin with... using these stupid scenario to complain about availability and balance is silly... allies armour deck take a lot more tactics and micro than the other deck in the game, but in my opinion are the strongest decks because of the enormous phase A advantage that snowballs thru B and is only really consistently stopped by Lehr in phase C. and this is on open maps, on more confined maps allied armour deck has a huge advantage in my opinion.
all the things you want in that last paragraph can be received when playing against good players btw.
lopsided availability....? FAVOURITISM?!?!? huh
in phase A:
my pancerna have a 2 recon stuarts, 2 command stuarts, 3 cromwell, 4 cromwell CS.
my 3AD 2 sherman, 2 command stuarts, 2 M8 scott.
my guards 3 cromwell, 1 command cromwell, 2 cromwell CS, AEC Mk.3.
my french 4 recon M8, 2 M10 TD, 2 command stuarts, 3 RBFM, 2 obsuier M8.
my 2nd infantry get 2 sherman DD, 2 T30 derp boy, and M7 DD mayonnaise launcher.
my scots get 3 honey stuarts, 4 churchill V, and the mitchverr express.
compared to
my lehr have 3 puma and some autocannon recon cars. and derp halftracks.
my 12th ss have beute brothers and some autocannon cars.
my 21st panzer have MadMat chubbster tanks and some autocannon cars, a pak half track.
and windhund with the aformentioned ability to field tanks and TD in phase A but with an overall availability and income nerf.
my 352nd get a panzer 3 H and some mutant czech TDs with a needle gun.
my 716th get madmat B2 collection. or if dumb i can take a bunch of madmat chubbsters. and thats all they get in phase B and C also XD
....
and then only lehr can ACTUALLY get more tanks than allies. and the only issue i really have is comparing their tank roster to 3AD - because they have similar income curve. nothing a few small changes cant fix.
so solution to this perceived axis availability OPPPP problem is we do historical TO&E? and axis have even less tanks? or we do that and then chuck panzer IV and StuG into phase A so we can have mirror match -_-
I was right to express it. 12 ss gets one firefly, guards armored gets 5 Stuarts and 3 Cromwells
I really want them to limit elite AT guns proliferation. Specifically for 15 scottish and 6 airborne. The 1-2 star at guns are kind of overpowered against many pz divisions in game.
Why? 17pndrs are really the only thing Allies have that can combat late game German armor effectively. Besides AT guns are very squishy and can be countered by pretty much anything not including tanks that only fire AP.
Im not talking 17 pdr they are fine. Rather 6 pdr elites. Many pz divisions only have light vehicles as their useful units in A. And elite at guns completely shut them down which is just a big hit to the whole playability of any pz div. Its actually pretty funny when airbornes beat panzer divisions in the open simply because they can pop vehicles instantly.
Smoke the AT guns field of view or call in a plane to do a A2G run on the AT guns. Even 1 plane strafing a AT gun can suppress him enough (not fully suppress) to mess up his aim and gives you time to move in your troops to finish him off.
Haven't you heard, AT guns are fine but HS129's are OP.
(I'm being sarcastic).
Honestly, just be careful. Recon.
Those two 6pdrs wreck so hard. I love that deck in open fields because of them. Juice them to triple vet and they just gun everything down.