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i work right now on the battle of the atlantic and i recoginzed it too, but first i concentrate on the production of subs/convoys and escorts.
the values of the navalunits are from hip before DD was released .
 
Loki134 said:
i work right now on the battle of the atlantic and i recoginzed it too, but first i concentrate on the production of subs/convoys and escorts.
the values of the navalunits are from hip before DD was released .
Click to expand...

Sweet :D I am really looking forward to your tweaking.

Another observation: in the beginning of the war (before the fall of France and Norway) when I send my subs to the Atlantic, they take the route through the English Channel. This is ofcourse often the shortest way to the southern atlantic. But I guess that in real life taking this route was very dangerous indeed. Right now my subs can travel through the channel without being spotted. Is this realistic ?

Also, so far I have never tried to intercept convoys with a surface raider (Graf Spee). Can it be done? I mean can a lone raider break out to the atlantic and stand a chance to return from the mission? Guess that depends on how great a chance there is of him being spotted and how fast he is compared to the ships that try to intercept him. Is the lone surface raider a feasable option to make the lives of the allies miserable?
 
English Channel
if the Royal navy have destroyers in the channel and the royal airforce da naval bombing they will spot you - like in reallife.
perhaps i raise the priority of the channel for the royal navy.

surface ships can raid convoys and but there were not very effective , because if a allied plane spotted the ship , the allies tried to move around them.
 
Hi, great mod you've got here.

No longer can I(The Soviets) invade Germany (I usually build 24 transports after reducing dissent and upgrading a small part of my army) in 1937 and
turn it into my slave. Something weird- I found if I puppeted them when one of the provinces was in rebellion/grey it turned into Federal Germany so they have some really good tech teams but was still Stalinist(!) I wonder why that happens? (I'm talking vanilla here, not HIP)

Anyway, I can't do that now which is great as it's realistic. I also enjoy this mod so much because I dont spend all my time trying to steal techs (Did my head in) every week when I need to save the money for TC.

So here's how my HIP game is turning out-

I decided to turn my attention to the SCW instead as my usual attack on Germany now meets with failure. I waited for the Nationalists to annex Euskudi so I could invade myself(My transports can only reach Northern Spain), conquered all their forces in mainland Spain and waited for the Republicans to Annex the Nationalists....

After waiting a looooong time it became obvious that they wouldnt.

I saved, started with the Republicans, annexed the Nationalists, saved, started back with the Soviets and waited hoping the Republicans would turn Communist and/or an event fired where I gained an event because the Republicans won. Nothing happened.

So instead I went back to my previous save and puppeted the Nationalists (What I really wanted was a tech trading partner for the USSR as early as possible) who immediatly changed to Stalinist (As happens when you puppet any nation when your the Soviets) then attacked the remnants of the Republicans. After the Nationalists had united Spain (At least they annexed the Republicans) they turned into Paternal Autocrats! Argghh! I'm allied to Franco the Fascist! Italy also had an event because the Nationalists won (Germany got an event even though the SCW was still in full swing) which brought on Stalins stroke 17 years early! (That was a joke not an event)

With hindsight I should have annexed then puppeted the whole of Spain. At least my troops gained alot of experience.

I've noticed even on very fast the days are crawling by now compared to vanilla doomsday, taking up 203k of memory. I've never had a problem with performance before.

Next plan is to guarantee Polish independance and help take down the Nazis (Still agreed the Mol-Rib pact to get those cores) post Sept 9th. Hope my transports make it, I'm banking on the allies breaking the German Navy so I can make the landing as my outdated ships havent got a prayer.

Cheers.
 
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Surface raiders and subs

Loki,

I think it will be very difficult to model the lone surface raider. In real life, the greatest asset they had going for them was that the enemy did not know their exact position. Even when spotted they would make a run for it in an unknown direction before an in intercepting task force could target them. Against a human player it is perhaps possible, but against the AI that plays without fog of war... I don't see how. The AI will probably find them soon enough and destroy the raiders.

Regarding subs and anti convoy missions: the problem is that AFAIK most u boots where destroyed by the convoy escorts. But in HoI2 the escort don't damage the u boots, they only lessen the number of transports sunk. To damage u boots you need to put CL/DD task forces on ASW missions. They have a hard time finding them let alone destroy them. Paradox should change the way things work; convoy escorts should do damage to u boots on convoy raids.

Just my two cents...
 
PanzerMike said:
Loki,

I think it will be very difficult to model the lone surface raider. In real life, the greatest asset they had going for them was that the enemy did not know their exact position. Even when spotted they would make a run for it in an unknown direction before an in intercepting task force could target them. Against a human player it is perhaps possible, but against the AI that plays without fog of war... I don't see how. The AI will probably find them soon enough and destroy the raiders.

Regarding subs and anti convoy missions: the problem is that AFAIK most u boots where destroyed by the convoy escorts. But in HoI2 the escort don't damage the u boots, they only lessen the number of transports sunk. To damage u boots you need to put CL/DD task forces on ASW missions. They have a hard time finding them let alone destroy them. Paradox should change the way things work; convoy escorts should do damage to u boots on convoy raids.

Just my two cents...
Click to expand...

Just some info...
Heavily modded V46 no DD
As GER
Around 41 and 42 my subs get attacked regularly by the Naval AI's of UK and US.
If I base Subs in France the UK portstrikes them into submission.
I broke up the Kriegsmarine one game into raiding parties of 1 capital and 1 escort, and sent them into the atlantic to convoy raid during the days for three months. NOTHING. No convoys sunk. No attack by the RN.
 
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Lone Raiders

PanzerMike,
A lone surface raider or a unit like Bismarck and Prinz Eugen can put a big dent in English convoys. If you can get them out of the North Sea into the Atlantic, they eat unescorted convoys for breakfast. It is a viable strategy to use in the HIP. If the Royal Navy can intercept you however, like in real life, you don't stand much of a chance with just a lone "Graf Spee" type pocket battleship.

Alekpier
 
Maybe it's the naval AI from Hoi2 that's causing your problem Lights. I stopped bothering with convoy raiding in HOi2 due to the futility. But with DD (and HIP of course) using subs in wolfpacks of 2-3 works great. The RN does sink my uboats occasionaly (which is good) while I sink a lot of convoy ships. I've never tested or tried surface raiding though. The thought of sending out the Bismarck without a support fleet makes me cringe.
 
Aidan said:
Maybe it's the naval AI from Hoi2 that's causing your problem Lights. I stopped bothering with convoy raiding in HOi2 due to the futility. But with DD (and HIP of course) using subs in wolfpacks of 2-3 works great. The RN does sink my uboats occasionaly (which is good) while I sink a lot of convoy ships. I've never tested or tried surface raiding though. The thought of sending out the Bismarck without a support fleet makes me cringe.
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By 1943 I usually sink over 1000 merchant men (HIP v46 UK starts with 2600.) One reload as UK they had approx. 1600 left with a build for escorts and merchants in their active cue. I had managed to decimate their escorts. My losses average 7 to 10 Ubootsflottes, but I get damaged quite a bit requiring longer repair visits.
As for the Lone Raiders...They weren't doing anything for me but eating up supplies so i figured why not, by the time i need the Kriegsmarine they'll be outdated.
 
KeldorKatarn said:
I have a question for you guys.

If you look at your current games. (Maybe load a savegame with other nations as well to get an idea) Do you have the feeling that there are too many resources around? That they are not rare enough? Maybe that it is too easy to stockpile by the time the war starts?
Click to expand...
I'd have to say yes. When I play as Germany I never initiate any trades. I only use the ones available from the start and what the AI asks me for.

From my latest v46 HIP March 28, 1943 save (I know I'm stuck in the Dark Ages with v46, but Doomsday just doesn't appeal to me.)

GER
oil = 83360.8516
supplies = 6278.0000
rare_materials = 373225.5313
metal = 512576.3125
energy = 1725739.8750
money = 2217784.0000
Supplies are low because of large number of SS creation events coupled with New Order East - Rosenberg plan unit creation of ethnic SS Infantry Divisions from the Baltics, Byelorus, Urkraine. I always include a supply and manpower reduction for created units. (26 SS divisions total 2/3 Inf Div.)

UK
oil = 138652.9375
supplies = 1143.1102
rare_materials = 258841.8438
metal = 254756.4219
energy = 281777.7500
money = 2598.9917
For Shipping discussion above
transports = 1759.0000
escorts = 0.0000

USA
oil = 188111.3906
supplies = 10917.5117
rare_materials = 305725.5000
metal = 427435.9375
energy = 1110775.3750
money = 3197753.2500
Shipping
transports = 1347.0000 (begins with 1400)
escorts = 0.0000 (begins with 3)

JAP
oil = 42890.4844
supplies = 3731.3079
rare_materials = 170469.2344
metal = 187234.1250
energy = 192773.9219
money = 8752.2451

ITA
oil = 7019.4224
supplies = 793.7923
rare_materials = 34022.7930
metal = 567.5161
energy = 64621.6484
money = 6719.8740

SOV
oil = 53921.4492
supplies = 0.0000
rare_materials = 154375.1406
metal = 307391.9688
energy = 568193.8750
money = 2424.2227
I think the SOV Mobilization events are what deplete the Soviet AI's supply stockpile. Heres SOV ratios:
consumer = 0.2144
supply = 0.6824
production = 0.0000
reinforcement = 0.0810
upgrading = 0.0221

Maybe make some of the free resource helping hands reserved for AI's and stipulate a no new player initiated trades house rule until February 36 for human to allow the AI Trade matrix to settle itself out before a human player gobbles everything up.
 
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KeldorKatarn said:
I have a question for you guys.

If you look at your current games. (Maybe load a savegame with other nations as well to get an idea) Do you have the feeling that there are too many resources around? That they are not rare enough? Maybe that it is too easy to stockpile by the time the war starts?
Click to expand...

I don't even bother to trade for resources. I've never been close to running out of anything except for supplies (which was my own fault) :)
 
Ok, because that is something I am currently working on. I am trying to make the ressources a lot more rare, so that trading will hopefully become a must.
Also oil will become more rare, there might even be short times when there are shortages. Hopefully that will also make the situation of the UK a lot more vulnerable to convoy attacks.

Testing will have to show if the AI can handle this, but I think that shouldn't be the problem since the AI is usually trading more than any human player does.
 
Trials

Did some testing with lone surface raiders. I sent out two ships: Graf Spee and Deutschland. They broke out to the atlantic and stayed there for a few months. They sunk quite a number of convoys. The Graf Spee was intercepted once but managed to get away with considerable damage. She made it back to port and was repaired. After that I decided to send the Scheer to the atlantic. She was intercepted between Iceland and Scotland before she could reach the hunting grounds. She was sunk :mad:

All in all, it looks like the lone surface raider is worth a try but it is very dangerous. Sounds realistic huh ?
 
I tried this mod for the first time and have just played 1936 as the UK. Some observations:

* Yemen should not be in the Allies or even friendly to the UK. See Mutawakkilite Kingdom of Yemen

* Belgium and France should not be allied to the UK. Trade in blueprints and free gifts of resources was not happening then.

* The UK granted Egypt full sovereignty per the event. The result was that UK immediately lost military access and had 0% chance to regain it. The Med fleet had to evacuate from Alex to Bombay to avoid fatal attrition.

* The RAF OoB is especially wrong. For example, No 2 and 3 groups did not exist at this time and No 1 Group was auxiliary not a bomber group. And there was no such thing as "Strategic Bomber Command".

* The 2-2-6 event has not been corrected as in vanilla DD. That's the 2-26 event because it occurs on the 26 of Feb.

* Belgium was doing naval research which is both futile and ahistorical.

* The Scottish ports should be more substantial as there were major naval bases and shipbuilding centres there.

* It only takes a year to build a capital ship such as a battleship. I thought this mod was supposed to be more historical than vanilla, not less?

Andrew
 
Colonel Warden said:
I tried this mod for the first time and have just played 1936 as the UK. Some observations:

* Yemen should not be in the Allies or even friendly to the UK. See Mutawakkilite Kingdom of Yemen
Click to expand...

Yemen is not in the allies. We corrected that weeks ago.

* Belgium and France should not be allied to the UK. Trade in blueprints and free gifts of resources was not happening then.
Click to expand...

Trading blueprints and resource gifts are standard AI procedure for its allies.
We can't change that. Eliminating the entrie alliance is certainly not currect, since the Allies represent the locarno pact at this point.
We made several changes already, like removing Belgium from the alliance in Oct 1936 or removing Yemen and letting the USSR move into Poland without declaring war on the western allies.
We will try to further improve the forming of the historic alliances.

* The 2-2-6 event has not been corrected as in vanilla DD. That's the 2-26 event because it occurs on the 26 of Feb.
Click to expand...

Has been corrected

* Belgium was doing naval research which is both futile and ahistorical.
Click to expand...

Futile is a matter of your point of view. Belgium DID start rebuild its Navy
when World War II broke out. They didn't know they would be overrun in a year since they were officially neutral at that time.
Anyway we will look into that matter and see if we should decrease the ammount of research Belgium is putting into the Navy tech trees.
It is already quite low.

* The Scottish ports should be more substantial as there were major naval bases and shipbuilding centres there.
Click to expand...

Scapa Flow and Inverness have been increased in size to 10

* It only takes a year to build a capital ship such as a battleship. I thought this mod was supposed to be more historical than vanilla, not less?
Click to expand...

The time to build any unit is country specific, but we will look into that. If it is really too low, we will correct it.
 
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KeldorKatarn said:
Yemen is not in the allies.

Eliminating the entrie alliance is certainly not currect, since the Allies represent the locarno pact at this point.

Scapa Flow and Inverness have been increased in size to 10
Click to expand...
Yemen has been made a British puppet which is wrong. They regularly fought the British over the disputed frontier of the Aden Protectorate.

Locarno was a system of guarantees. Under its terms, British should have joined Germany if France attacked Germany. So you're saying that Germany should be in the Allies too? No, guarantees are best simulated in the game as guarantees, of course. The alliance with the French should happen by event in 1939, as with Poland.

Inverness!? Glasgow is the port that most needs to be increased to 10.

Andrew
 
i should reduce the portsize of Scapa Flow , because after u47 sank the HMS Royal Oak churchill realized , that Scapa Flow has not the capability to be the homeport of the "Home Fleet" . you should reduce it to 5 . i think the other scottish should not be 10 or 9.
 
About the RAF OoB

Colonel Warden is right;
2nd Group was forming in 1936 two active squadrons start of 1936 No. 21, and No.101 and two of their squadrons formed in 1937.
3rd Group was forming in 1936 five squadrons active in start of 1936 and one of them was a training squadron, 3 squadrons fromed in 1937 Nos. 37,115, and 149
4th Group was forming in 1936 2 active squadrons at the start of 1936, two formed in 1936, two formed in 1937,
5th Group was forming 1936,37 two squadrons formed in 1936 4 squadrons formed 1937 and Nos 106 and 107 squadrons were still reserve training in Sept 1939
 
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