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Mr. T - For Help with Sound Issues?

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Captain
Aug 12, 2001
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Hi all and the venerable Mr. T. especially so,

Castellon advised me to ask for help here with my sound problems; basically I hear every sound once upon loading and then it's gone. Music is fine. Game version is NA 1.05. I had this problem before and it was solved by tuning down the accelerator functions to Basic, but even None won't do it now. It's a 800 MHz machine, running speed is 1min=2mon. Heeeeeeeeelp please ! I need my EU fix and it's not complete without sounds of carnage :D
 
I know what you mean...it just isn't the same when you can't hear the swords clashing, musskets firing, and those 40-pounders volleying. :D

Let's see...

I need a few more details to see if we can nail down the problem.

OS are you using>:
Version (build)>:
Sound card>:
Driver version>:
Current DirectX version>:

and just to be safe...

Video card>:
Driver version>:

Most likely it's somewhere in there. Out of curiosity, have you tried doing a complete uninstall and reinstall of the game?
 
OK I'm using

Win 98 4.10.1998
Creative Labs SB PCI128, driver from 2-25-2000 (their latest driver screws up everything BTW)
DirectX 9.0
GeForce2 GTS on the 4.13.01 4072 drivers

I haven't uninstalled and reinstalled, keeping it as the last resort.

Many thanks,
 
Did the problem develop before or after you installed DirectX 9?
Also how much ram do you have?
 
Originally posted by Castellon
Did the problem develop before or after you installed DirectX 9?
Also how much ram do you have?
Click to expand...

Before; DirectX 9 was an attempt to fix it. I've 512 RAM. Did I mention I'm running EEP?
 
I'm in the process of running some extensive tests with the DirectX 9.0 update. The very first thing it did was crash horribly on game load. I tuned down acceleration and then I had the same sound problem you're describing. After renaming the avi filder to avi_old my problems seemed to disappear completely (even with hardware acceleration back up to full) so give that a whirl and let me know how it works out.
 
That didn't exactly work. It's skipping the intro screens now but that's about all that changed. I tuned acceleration down and restarted but no dice. Then again, I didn't have a horrible crash you're describing so we seem to be even :)

My continuing gratitude for your continuing help,
 
Well, let's try uninstalling and then reinstalling the whole thing then. Back up your save game first, of course, and then do a complete uninstall as per the directions in the FAQ (see link in my sig.). When you reinstall, just patch to 1.05 (no EEP) first, then rename the avi folder and then start a new game to see if you're still having the same problem. If you aren't, then install the EEP and start a new game again to see if that's working. Let me know how that goes. :)
 
I have bad news. Resintalling the whole thing didn't fix the problem with either GC or EEP, avi or avi_old. In addition I have developped a new problem - I'm getting a critical error: database mismatch whenever I am trying to load or even start a new game. Sometimes it just crashes right away, sometimes lets me proceed but leads to strange results.

I've also put GUFSM 1.0 in and the whole thing actually has a very washed-out look to it; is that normal or another bug has appeared? They look entirely unlike advertised on the webpage; prolly will have to reinstall again to get rid of them

With hopes of your continuing assistance, I remain your faithful servant :cool:
 
Okay...this may take us a little while to work our way through but we will resolve it.

First off, let's take things one step at a time only. We'll work towards getting a stable, working standard 1.05 with no mods and only when we're sure we've got that will we start adding any of the mods. That way we're both on the same page and we stand a better chance of isolating the problems.

From what you're reporting the first step is definitely to perform a complete uninstall. Make sure you follow all of the step in the uninstall procedure by clearing out the temp folder and removing the registry key. The step-by-step instructions can be found here. Make sure you follow every step, because if you skip one you may leave unwanted files behind that will cause us problems later. Also make sure you clean out the temp folders, recycle bin, etc. as per the intruction, and defragment your drive.

Now add the nVidia 41.09 driver for your GeForce2 card. This driver was released in early December and seems to be extremely stable and is far more reliable than the one you have right now.

Creative Labs has also just released a new driver for the SB PCI128 that I would suggest that you download and install too. The one you want is the R128-DRV-W4-LA revision (12/20/02) which you'll find at the top of the page linked here.

Next, do a cold boot of your computer (shut down and power off the computer and let it sit for at least 30 seconds before powering up and booting into Windows).

Now run the DirectX diagnostic tools (start-->run-->dxdig.exe) and make sure it's reporting that everything is fine after running all tests.

Then re-install the basic 1.0 game from the CD and patch it with the 1.05 patch. Don't add anything after this, though (don't add the EEP or other mods).

At this point (with any luck) you should have a working version of 1.05 NA so I'd like you to test it at this point. Launch the game and see if everything's behaving. If it is, report that back here and then proceed with the EEP installation and then retest. If you're having any problems at all with the basic 1.05, though, do not try to install any of the mods yet because that will just confuse things. Just let me know and we'll take the next step from there.

Actually...if you are having a problem at that point, I'd like you to rename the avi folder to avi_old again and try launching again.

If that still doesn't work, next adjust your hardware acceleration to turn it off and try again.

Let me know how the above works out before you even think about installing those mods, though. I want to make sure we've got a basic 1.05 functioning happily before we start modding files or anything.

Good luck.
 
Alas. Spent several hours again today following the instructions to the letter. The uninstall option that comes with the game cleaned both registry and Install Shield folder by itself; I checked. Then removed EUI for good measure and its registry keys, emptied everything, scannned, defragged, put 41.09 display drivers in. I cannot install the sound drivers you recommend as they only work with W98 SE unlike advertised, and the next one in that list crashes my sound completely. Booted cold, dxdiag was fine, installed and patched. Started a new game (incidentally got conquered by the Turks as Byzantium) but the same problem persists :( Renamed to avi_old and launched. Crashed horribly. Rebooted, launched again - fine, but the problem is there. Reduced acceleration to basic, rebooted - same thing. Seems like we're running out of options here short of putting a newer Windows version in, but of course that will make my current problems seem trivial by comparison with the new ones... :confused:
 
Don't depair yet. :)

There are a few more possibilities that I'd like to check next.

The first one is that I'm wondering if, when you did the uninstall procedure, you removed all the Windows temp folders as you were doing so. I've seen bits and pieces that have sat in those folders and have caused startling errors in the past. If you didn't then go back through the procedure again and make sure you do so before reinstalling the game.

The next thing I'm wondering relates to the sound driver. I gather that you had to revert to that Feb 2000 driver to get the card to work, and that's definitely something I'd look at as a "hot spot" for this problem. When you went to the page I linked above and the driver didn't work, did you happen to try the R128-DRV-W3-US (dated Jan. 2002) driver instead? Maybe that one would work for you? The trouble with any of the early drivers (pre mid-2001) is that many aren't fine tuned for later versions of DX and will cause problems even though the DX diagnostic tool says they're fine. I believe it has to do with buffers not clearing correctly and DX can be a real pig with those!

If the R128-DRV-W3-US driver won't work, see if you can find a 3rd part driver somewhere on the internet that is compatible with your card and has a 01/2002 release date. You might find one on the PC World website for instance.

I'm also curious about what happens if you turn the sound off using the EU2_Settings.exe - or you can manually edit the settings.cfg file using Notepad. This would disable the background music but the sound effects should function perfectly. If they do, you could play the music files in the background using Winamp or some other MP3 player.

One last question/idea for this instalment of help...what screen resolution are you running at? There are a few instances where people have reported strange problems when using something other than the basic 800x600. Let's do one test with it set to that (if it isn't already). Again, use EU2_Settings.exe to change this, or manually edit using Notepad. Your settings.cfg file should read as follows for the test:
Code: 
[color=yellow]
1
0
0
"SCREEN_SIZE_X 800"
"SCREEN_SIZE_Y 600"
"MUSIC_OFF"
"europa.valkyrienet.com"[/color]

Let me know re the above and if you're still having problems we'll move on to a couple things that I like doing even less than anything I've suggested so far. Fear not, though. We'll get you up and running one way or another. :)
 
Originally posted by MrT
There are a few more possibilities that I'd like to check next.

The first one is that I'm wondering if, when you did the uninstall procedure, you removed all the Windows temp folders as you were doing so.
Click to expand...

I cleaned the contents of C:\WINDOWS\TEMP as instructed. Does that cover what you had in mind?


The next thing I'm wondering relates to the sound driver. I gather that you had to revert to that Feb 2000 driver to get the card to work, and that's definitely something I'd look at as a "hot spot" for this problem. When you went to the page I linked above and the driver didn't work, did you happen to try the R128-DRV-W3-US (dated Jan. 2002) driver instead? Maybe that one would work for you? The trouble with any of the early drivers (pre mid-2001) is that many aren't fine tuned for later versions of DX and will cause problems even though the DX diagnostic tool says they're fine. I believe it has to do with buffers not clearing correctly and DX can be a real pig with those!
Click to expand...

Yes, that's a problem; as I said, the second one (Jan. 2002) screws up my sound completely. Initially when you asked me about sound drivers, I went off in search of newer ones. I tried the ones on Creative website, but as they didn't work, I went off to a drivers site (can't recall the name) and spent a few hours trying stuff out. Nothing newer than I have actually worked. Has to do with my Windows 98 not being SE I believe. I'll search further on PCWorld to see what happens.


I'm also curious about what happens if you turn the sound off using the EU2_Settings.exe - or you can manually edit the settings.cfg file using Notepad. This would disable the background music but the sound effects should function perfectly. If they do, you could play the music files in the background using Winamp or some other MP3 player.
Click to expand...

Will try that.

One last question/idea for this instalment of help...what screen resolution are you running at? There are a few instances where people have reported strange problems when using something other than the basic 800x600.
Click to expand...

I'm at 800x600, taking it easy on my eyes :)

I'll let you know how the search goes. Thanks!
 
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Originally posted by Alva
I cleaned the contents of C:\WINDOWS\TEMP as instructed. Does that cover what you had in mind?

I'm at 800x600, taking it easy on my eyes :)

I'll let you know how the search goes. Thanks!
Click to expand...
Yep. That's what I had in mind. I just wanted to check since you hadn't mentioned it specifically.

I hope you'll be able to find a driver that's more recent and resolves this issue...although it's beginning to look a lot like jpd's problem and your systems are fairly similar in many regards.

If you're unsuccessful in your current search and testing, I think our next step is going to have to be rolling back DirectX to 8.x to tset that out. I'll give you instructions if/when the time comes. :)
 
OK I had an exciting weekend here. First of all after installing 10 versions of various drivers I RTFM and concluded I have an onboard Creative CT5880 on a Gigabyte MB and not an honest to god SB PCI128 after all. I went off in search of drivers for that one; to make a long story short, i now have 4.12.01.1191 from 9-12-2000 and that's the best I'm going to get under Win98. It still shows up as Creative SB PCI 128 under System but I'm pretty sure these are the right drivers.

Now I went into thorough testing under NA 1.05. The extent of testing was actually such that I was inadvertently drawn into a WC with England; it's 1449 now and it's going very well :D Now the sound problem is still there, but it's more complex than I suggested. For I do get some sounds on a constant basis - such as colonist sending/success/failure and tax collectors being built. Anything associated with clicking and/or armies/provinces is gone however. Turning music off in EUsettings doesn't do anything; avi is renamed to avi_old.

If you're still having fun, let's continue.. if I understand right, jpd solved his problem by changing the sound drivers? All the best,
 
Hi Alva,

Yes, right now the sound issue is resolved for me.

It turns out that the Audigy II comes with two sets of sound drivers, the old style Win9x VxD ones, and the new style unified Win9x/WinNT WDM ones. Using autorun you automatically get the latter.

When I was trying to solve the infinite loop errors on my system, the first thing (after messing around with the CPI/AGP timing registers of the VIA chipset) was to switch from WDM to VxD. Since this improved the system stability tremendously at that time I never bothered to switch back.

However, it was the one major difference (driver wise) between the working Win2K config and the failing win98 config, so I tested the therory. Other tests would involve pulling out sound cards, and thus were less attractive to try.

I still have to test right now if the system stability hasn't suffered by switching back to the WDM's, as right now the GART driver is gone as well. I'll have to test for a couple of hours with Soldier of Fortune II. If the current win9x setup survives that, then I truly will have solved the issue. Otherwise I just have swapped one problem for another, and is Win2K the only way out.

EDIT:

One thing DOES become clear, at least to me. EU2 definately does something irregular with the sound effects that some sound drivers don't like.

Just as with the 'exit to desktop' problems, EU2 is the only DirectX game that exhibits these irregularities, so at least some of the code in EU2 does not follow the official Microsoft DirectX programming guidelines. Paradox should really strive to be more compliant, so users like us don't need to spend days/weeks trying to figure out which WHQL certified drivers are messing up one particular game. After all, the Microsoft WHQL certification should ensure that if the drivers follow the official guidelines, the DirectX games should function as designed.

Another note: I wish VIA would let Microsoft certify their drivers on all of their chipsets. It has cost me several weeks before I figured out that is was their GART driver that was causing my system instabilities.
 
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As I've said in the other thread, I've got the same problem, messed around with drivers until the cows came home, no joy. I have tried unistalling, fiddling about, changing drivers, everything, and nothing has happened. I have a Creative Labs card, btw.

I get the 'critical error!' business, but it does work, surprisingly, apart from the aforementioned problems.

To be honest, I think there is some rather sloppy coding involved. Crashes to desktop, resolution changes, and this damn sound problem all add up to something being rotten in the state of EU2, if you ask me. Mabye I'm being unfair. But I've honestly never known this amount of problems in a game, really. It is an absolutely excellent game if you leave out the bugs etc, and I wish it wasn't spoiled for us by these damn problems.
 
I would certainly guess that we are trying to work around some core coding issues...although to be fair it might actually not be Paradox who're responsible for the sub-standard implementation if they bought a 3rd party implementation tool rather than coding it from scratch. Whatever the case, let's see if we can't make the best of the situation and resolve those issues on a one by one basis.

Vincent Julien: Let's start a new thread and have another go at trying to resolve your situation. Please be sure to give me the description of your problems once more, as well as a detailed system description and then we'll go from there.

Alva:

Okay, since some of the sounds are now fixed with the revised driver I'm wondering if doing one more full uninstall/reinstall mightn't be worth trying...not that it's guaranteed to work, but it would be worth trying. It might be that some strange things have been added to the config file that it picked up from the other driver...

After that, if you're still having the smae issue then install DirectX 8.0 from your EU2 CD (there's a copy on the CD which I believe you'll find is in a folder called "DirectX" or something obvious like that (I'm at the office right now and don't have my CD handy to check). IIRC there's an install.exe there that you can run and that will install DirectX 8.0 over your existing 9.0. If/when you di this, make sure you do a cold reboot (power off, wait 30 sec., then boot) before proceding.
 
Praise The Lord! :) I tried changing my drivers again on the off chance that something might happen, and bizzarely, it did work this time. I've no idea what happened the last time I tried it. It definetley didn't work then. The sound problem is now fixed. Seems like reverting to old drivers is the best way to tackle it, from what I've heard from other people, as well.

Thanks anyway, Mr T. :)
 
Mr. T - the last time I tried to downgrade DirectX from 7 to 6, I've crashed comprehensively; later I got it from Microsoft sources that it's not really possible to uninstall DirectX without reinstalling Windows. I've also had some DirectX uninstall utility hanging around but that's "at your own risk" kind of thing. Please confirm whether you want me to try to put DirectX 8.0 from EU2 on top of 9.0 (far as I know it shouldn't even work) or use some uninstall tool first - given that the problem originated under DX 8.1.
 
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