CK2: Dev Diary #117 - Historical Wonders

[Tuscany]

Hello, builders, architects and peasants.


Today we will be telling you about the Historical Great Works that already exist in game. Of course there are so many Great Works that it would have been hard to fit them all in so we have chosen just a select few.


We also decided not to place a Great Work in Constantinople. The walls are already represented in game, and this will give the player a chance to build their own Great Work there. Also adding historical Great Works is rather easy via modding so you can set up the exact type of Great Work you want!


So without further ado I present the historical Great Works present at the 769 game start:

Pyramids of Khufu

Stonehenge

Mausoleum of Halicarnassus

Lighthouse of Alexandria

Konark Sun Temple

Apostolic Palace

House of Wisdom

Petra

Great Works in EU4
The thousands of ducats that the rulers invest in the foundations of the Great Works are investments that will have effects for ages. To make sure this characterizes your realm even more, we’ve made sure to transfer these feats when we’re converting save games from CK2 to EU4.


The rule is that every Great Work that has completed its final stage will be represented by a permanent province modifier in a converted EU4 game. By default we also ignore any historical Great Works that were present at the start of the campaign of CK2 but that rule is easily changed by modifying a value in the defines file before converting.


Different types of province modifier will apply depending on the type of Great Work it originated from. The following list will define the effects of the fully completed Great Works in converted EU4 games:


Cathedrals
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Papal Influence +1

Grand Mosque
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Monthly Piety +0.01
Missionaries +1

Synagogue
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Legitimacy +1

Great Temple
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Religious Unity +15%

Great Buddhist Temple
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Tolerance of Heathens +1

Great Hindu Temple
Local Tax Modifier +100%
Tolerance of Heathens +1

Ruler Statue
Legitimacy +0.5
Max Absolutism +10

Grand Fortress
Local Defensiveness +100%
Local Manpower Modifier +100%
Army Tradition +0.5

Great Underground City
Local Defensiveness +50%
Local Development Cost -15%
Local Hostile Attrition +2%
Local Core Creation Cost +100%

Great Walls
Local Trade Power +50%
Local Hostile Attrition +2%
Local Defensiveness +50%
Caravan Power +20%

Great Harbor
Local Trade Power +50%
Local Sailors +100%
Naval Force Limit Modifier +15%

Great Lighthouse
Local Trade Power +50%
Global Ship Trade Power +30%
Trade Range Modifier +25%

Grand Amphitheater
Global Unrest -1
War Exhaustion Cost -20%
General Cost -10%

Royal Palace
Max States +5
Monthly Splendor +1

Magnificent Garden
Diplomats +1
Global Spy Offence +40%
Global Spy Defence -20% (sic)

Grand University
Local Development Cost -10%
Advisor Pool +1
Global Institution Spread +15%

Great Library
Local Development Cost -10%
Advisor Cost -15%
Diplomats +1

Grand Mausoleum
Legitimacy +1
Diplomatic Reputation +2
Fabricate Claims Cost -20%

Great Pyramid
Legitimacy +1
Stability Cost Modifier -10%

Great Stone Circle
Number of Accepted Cultures +1
Idea Cost -10%


That's all for today! But if you want to check out what this looks like in-game, please tune into our first ever 3.1 Great Works stream today (Friday the 22nd) at 14:00CET on twitch.tv/paradoxinteractive where we’ll be playing on the hottest of code.

If you can’t catch the livestream, we’ll be uploading it to our YouTube channel soon, and it is also always available in the Twitch VOD archive.

 

[Alfray Stryke]

Those modifiers upon EUIV conversion need nerfing, +10 absolutism?! :O

 

[MonzUn]

What on Earth made you think Stonehenge should look like that?

Here's a painting of Stonehenge from the late 1500s.

The historical Great Works share artwork with their generic counterparts (Pagan Stones in this case).
In addition to that, it's showing the damaged state and that typically corresponds to the second or third stage in terms of how far construction had gotten.
I think that the stone circle and other things are added on later stages but I'm not entirely sure.

 

[MonzUn]

Rome looking a lot like a completely empty grassland over there.

I assume some of that art is still work in progress? The Apostolic Palace is stilling on a plain green tablecloth...

A generic "city" background pucture would be welcome for cathedrals, amphitheatre and other eminently urban wonders

The backgrounds are separate and made so that they should work with all Great Works. Because of this, it's difficult to add in a lot of details without imposing a lot of restrictions on the Great Work images.
Adding an urban version would in addition to that have taken a lot of art resources as you would have to reflect the city density as well as all the architectural style mandated by the province culture. The background will change depending on the province terrain though.

Edit:
Oh, and it is possible to override both the backgrounds and the wonder images via mods = )

 

[MonzUn]

Will it be possible to remake
Konark Sun Temple or mausoleum as christian cathedral?
Common great mocque as cathedral?
Will they save their original look with new functions?

P.s. agree about st. Sofia. We need it.

Converting a Great Work from one type to another was a stretch goal we had for this update that unfortunately did not make it in.

 

[MonzUn]

Hagia Sophia in Constantinople!

Now that that is out of the way, will loading an existing save add the Wonders in, or will save games started before the patch just be empty of wonders?
Also, can the wonders be turned off (like a DLC), or are they part of vanilla now?

Loading a previous save would leave the world devoid of historical Great Works as these are created when we resolve history at the beginning of the game.
Great Works can be turned off in the game rules. It can also be set to allow only the historical ones and if you want to be really strict you can also set it to a restrictive mode where the great Works exist but neither you nor the AI can change them in any way.

 

[MonzUn]

Shame. Is it likely to be included in a future patch?

It's one of the thing I would personally like to do, but I'm not up to date on what the future holds for us at the moment so I can't answer that I'm afraid.

 

[MonzUn]

@MonzUn

Thanks for the replies, especially since you made them during your Friday evening, after hours. You've at the very least allayed my fears about Stonehenge

Interacting with you guys and seeing what you think about what we're doing and how passionate you are about the game is a huge motivator and energy boost for me. I always look forward to our dev diaries

Good that I could alleviate your fears. I still won't go near it. There's something I don't trust about rocks catching fire!

 

[MonzUn]

"Pyramids of Khufu"

*angry Kemetic noise*

There's only ONE pyramid of Khufu.
It's either Pyramids of Giza, the Great Pyramid or THE Pyramid of Khufu not "Pyramids of Khufu".

Also, the Pyramids were no longer covered in white limestone by the start of the game, it would have long been gone due to theft, use for other construction projects or decay.

Yeah, I've made a note about fixing that. We first had it has "Pyramids of Giza", but that didn't make sense as the Great Work should be ONE pyramid, so then we chose one and probably only updated the last part of the name.

 

[MonzUn]

Does this mean that if I load a previous save that was started before the update that I'll be able to build great wonders but there won't be any historic ones?

Yes

 

[MonzUn]

@MonzUn Can provinces have more than one Great Wonder?

For example, in Rome there's also the Colosseum, the ruins of the library of Alexandria etc?

Also will Hellenics have any special wonders they can build aswell? (A special mausoleum that allows you to search for Alexanders body to entomb it perhaps, could work with Alexanders Bloodline event?)

Also in the stream I noticed that Dan & co could send alcoholic gifts, will Muslims characters not be able to do so as alcohol in Islam is a big no no?

Thanks.

1. Only one Great Work per province will be supported. This is a hard coded limitation that is very difficult to change at this point.
2. I don't know, I'm not a content developer
3. I don't know where we settled on that actually... I know there was some discussion about it being a thing during our time period but that it was frowned upon by religious leaders. But again, I'm not a content developer so I'm not thy guy to ask I'm afraid.

 

[MonzUn]

Is that something that you'll be looking to add in a later patch after the main update is released? Or has that particular stretch goal just been discarded altogether?


Would it be possible to have one great work represent multiple wonders? For instance, a hybrid great work in Alexandria to represent both the lighthouse and the library?

Great Work conversion is not 100% out of the picture but we can't promise anything either.

It is sort of possible... Since they will still behave like one, they will need to be constructed, upgraded, looted etc together, which may feel odd depending on what great Works you are dealing with.

 

[MonzUn]

@MonzUn Are you guys adding in balance changes in this patch? Will we hear about it later?

I still have concerns about the imperial roman system, eldership, dual deaths, and all the extra provinces given to nomads.

I don't think we have any balance changes (apart for those related to Great Works) planned for this update.
But I'm not sure as I'm relatively new to the team and therefore try to leave balance changes to the more experienced team members so that I don't accidentally upset the balance

 

[Alfray Stryke]

Is there will be a dev diary today?

Unlikely as CKII dev diaries are normally posted on Fridays.

 

[Snow Crystal]

Oh darn, I thought it was Friday, it's been a long week, my bad.

But there should be one tomorrow, yes

 

[Alfray Stryke]

But there should be one tomorrow, yes

I imagine it'll include the patch notes for next week's patch?