CK2 Dev Diary #34: Facts about Artifacts, Real talk about Relics

[Darkrenown]

Hello all, it’s been a while, but it’s my turn to write a Dev Diary again! Today I’m going to tell you about the Treasury system we’re adding in 2.7. This system itself is part of the free patch. However, a lot of the content for it is part of Monks and Mystics.

The Treasury is where characters store their items, such as weapons, artifacts, or holy relics. In many ways items are much like Character Modifiers which you are likely already familiar with, but Character Modifiers are a fairly limited and not entirely clear system. With the new Treasury system we have greater control over how they work and when they are active as well as more UI space to display and explain them. Not only that, this system allows items to be inheritable and stealable.

We hope that seeing your character’s items as physical object rather than just a number on their character sheet will offer greater immersion, especially for player who like to focus on role-playing. Sure, in the past you could find a nice axe to increase your personal combat skill, but it was just another number - now you’ll see a gleaming axe, ready to hew the limbs from your foes!

this is not quite final artwork, but it should be similar to what we end up with

As an example, say your Character has found the Holy Grail - you will now see the Grail in your Treasury with a picture and a description as well as the effects of owning it. Further, if some Norseman comes along and raids your castle, there’s a chance that he’ll make off with your precious Grail - however, since he’s not a Christian your most holy relic is nothing more than a fancy cup to him.

As mentioned, items are also inheritable, they all go to a character’s primary heir. In the event someone dies without an heir, the items will pass to their liege if they have one, but they have a chance of being lost in the process. If an independant character dies without heirs, their items are lost - although if time permits we have talked about them having a chance to be snapped up by powerful vassals.

For 2.7 we’re converting several character modifiers into items, such as the +1 axe you might find while raiding, the saint’s bones you might find on a pilgrimage, or the trophy you made from the skull of your rival. With Monks and Mystics we’re adding a lot more, such as:

• Commissioning swords from skilled smiths.
• Buying fabulous Crown Jewels.
• Hunting for Holy Artifacts.

As well as the items you can find or make while playing, we have also added a system to place some Artifacts into character’s Treasuries when a new game is started. These are mostly placed at random to keep things interesting, but there are also a few historical artifacts given to famous characters.

 

[Darkrenown]

Will you be able to aquire Retainers and mounts with this system as well, or is it just items?

Just items, although there's no reason you couldn't use it for other things if modding.

 

[Darkrenown]

Cool idea! Two questions:
Is there a limit to how much stuff you can have in your treasury?
Can you sell your stuff?

Your Treasury is effectively limitless. It's not possible to sell items, although it's a good idea.

So were modifiers like the holy relic.

Also will character modifiers still exist?

Well true, but it was done on a case by case basis while items inherit by default Character modifiers will still exist, we're just replacing the suitable ones with items.

They always all go to the primary heir? Even with gavelkind? Because that would seem to eventually lead to a huge stacking of e.g. holy relics---especially if you get them more frequently than now. You can already end up with many of them as is.

They do. We can look into splitting them more if artifact pileup becomes a problem, but it might be more that the relic event needs tuned. The idea is they'll stay with the player as your characters die.

Can swords break or will you have it for all eternity (assuming nobody nicks it)?
And can you have as many as you like?
So they give any boni? Prestige perhaps?

Items don't break, although you could do so through events if desired. You can collect as many items as you like, but not everything stacks - e.g. you aren't a combat god just because you have 5 swords.

The best crown jewels can also reduce the short reign penalty.

 

[blackninja9939]

The Game of Thrones mod is going to love this.

Depends on if we can see them on dead character otherwise you won't be able to trace back the inheritance of VS swords etc which is something I like to do. We could probably work around it but it would be a nice thing to have

Also we have no artists to make the images lol

 

[Darkrenown]

Nice! Some questions:

- Can you see the items of other characters? If so, can specific items be hidden (e.g. "Secret Cultist Knife of +2 Intrigue")?

- Can we see the stats given by specific items by mousing over them or a summary of item-given stats?

- Can we attempt to steal items with the Intrigue focus?

- What happens if you somehow get more than one copy of an item (e.g. if your heir already has one)? Can you decide what to do with the extra item (e.g. give it to your spare), or is it deleted automatically? Can you hold duplicates of some items (e.g. the crown jewels of the HRE and France)?

Some sillier questions:

- Are you sure you have the right Grail if it is a fancy cup? Shouldn't it be the cup of a simple carpenter...?

- With the Grail being discussed, can we get Excalibur from some strange woman lying around in a pond, or perhaps the Holy Hand Grenade of Antioch?

No, just a summary of the effects.

Both - there's a summary on your character sheet and you can see per item stats in your Treasury.

No (would be nice to add though).

You can hold multiple items, but not all effects stack. E.g. if you hold multiple bones of saints, those stack, but if you have multiple Holy grails (not something which should be possible, but for example) they would not since only one can be "real".

Personally I think all the grails were real, it was Donvan's impure motives that made him melt

So wait is a +2 axe a magic weapon or just masterwork?

It's an epic, of course!

Will there be only event chains, or will hunting be connected with other gameplay mechanics? I kinda hope for hunting artifacts Lelouch style ('If you need to find small secret society hideout somewhere in China, you should start with coup d'etat and pushing your marionette as new head of government of China').

Also
Sorry for offtopic, but I wanted to ask for some time.
Is there any chance for the series of dev diaries like 'Mechanics X: what we wanted to do, whaw we did, what we think about result, how would we do it in CK 3'? I often feel that some core mechanics is strange, either I don't understand the concept behind mechanics, or it doesn't work. It would be cool to confront my observations and guesses with official position of the team.

Mostly event chains, but it's also possible to steal them while sieging or raiding holdings.

DD idea is neat, but I think it would make more sense to do that when/if we make CK3. We do discuss what we intended/what we did a bit in post mortum DDs after expansions come out.

A completely new system, well done Paradox!

By the way, Does it mean every religion will get its own holy relics(such as unreformed pagans)?
Will they influence religious authority?

Every religion group got some, but Christians got most.

Is there any chance these items can stack? so we can have more than one, and if yes can we get them with a working hidden = yes flag? Further, can we give them command_modifier blocks?

As mentioned, some stack (it's a setting when you define them). Command modifiers are something I have already requested be made, but it's not currently in - hopefully we'll add it. Hidden I think already works, but I'm not certain. Speaking of hidden, we'll do a mod support diary with details at some point, but we've expanded hidden on traits/modifiers etc to have an is_visible trigger so you can control who sees what if desired

Will there be any prestige benefit for stealing and holding another religion's holy relics, or possibly a chance to convert by spending time in your treasury and having a revelation while viewing one?

There's prestige for stealing them, yes.

So you're saying I should indiscriminately butcher my vassals so I steal their ****?

Exactly!

Waow, waow, waow, waow. This is definitely a must have dlc.

MODDERS, ASSEMBLE.

Not to "unsell" you on it, but remember the system is in the patch, so if modding is your only concern you don't actually need the DLC.

Would it be possible to add hidden effects to Items? For example, you have a nice jewel that gives you some prestige bonus and all is well. Except that anyone that owns it keep dying, due to a hidden malus to health. The hidden effect could then be revealed in an event after a couple of short generations.

It's a fun idea, but not currently possible. Might be able to add it though.

 

[Bratyn]

Will there be any prestige benefit for stealing and holding another religion's holy relics, or possibly a chance to convert by spending time in your treasury and having a revelation while viewing one?

Will there be events with the carousing focus to go show off your artifacts during a party, with chances of them being stolen or damaged, or maybe play a game with someone else who has artifacts, winner takes one?

Will the Necronomicon be an artifact? Somewhat related, will there be artifacts with downsides?

We are going through content of previous DLCs to change items/artifacts/relics from character modifiers (which they used to be) to actual physical items that are used by the new inventory system.

And yes, you may find certain rare items that, other than having purely beneficial effects, will also be detrimental...

 

[Bratyn]

It seems you can't give or sell them, only lose them, in the present state of the game. So if you have an object with detrimental effect, you are stuck with it for a long time. It can be frustrating.

We are looking into this

 

[Bratyn]

Questions:
1) Do you automatically have a treasury or do you need to build one?

2) Is it possible to have "items" without owning a treasury?

3) Are unlanded characters able to have items?

You automatically have one.

No (follows from answer #1).

Yes.