It sounds like a very interesting idea to me. It is good to see that Stellaris is continuing to be different from other games out there.
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200 Months - I know, I know....splitting hairs and all, but we must not make new comers think this is TBS. ; )
Okay, this is my favourite dev diary yet. I like the sound of the approach. Playing Endless Space right now, and it feels immersion-breaking to be able to see the entire tech tree until the end of the game, and exactly how to get to the desired techs.
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@Teije makes a excellent point! you don't see unknown tech trees very often - seems more realistic to not know or at least have limited knowledge rather than see the whole tech tree right off the bat. I hope other games follow paradox's lead!
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Can we espionage them to gauge tech capacity, as well as inadvertantly allowing dangerous philosophical and political ideas to leak back into our empire?
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Meh, not really too excited about this Tech system, it seems too simplistic for me and too random. Doesn't seem very hands on, just spamming as much research stations as possible and then having to pick one of three options every once in a while... I much prefer a proper (well made) Tech tree allowing you to specialise in what you want instead of this Tech system in which the only way to 'specialise' in some kind of technology is through just praying to RNG that one of the Tech options you get is the Tech you want.
Well at least in this Stellaris seems to be unique to other 4X games, but if the system works, why change it? It really all depends on how many unique, fun and interesting technologies will be in game and to what extent you can actually manipulate the RNG with your scientist character, ethics etc. I hope those things will affect technology greatly, because the greater control the player has over the RNG the better. I really hate such randomness, imagine wanting to have a mind-controlling Empire, having all the ethics and Scientists which enhance the chance for the 'mind control' tech to appear, but then because of RNG, you play the entire game without that tech, and your RP goal was impossible because of your lack of control over technology. Or if you want to role-play as a Cyborg race - only if the RNG allows you to research the tech in a timely fashion!
Too much randomness - Bad. More control for the player - Good.
Well at least in this Stellaris seems to be unique to other 4X games, but if the system works, why change it? It really all depends on how many unique, fun and interesting technologies will be in game and to what extent you can actually manipulate the RNG with your scientist character, ethics etc. I hope those things will affect technology greatly, because the greater control the player has over the RNG the better. I really hate such randomness, imagine wanting to have a mind-controlling Empire, having all the ethics and Scientists which enhance the chance for the 'mind control' tech to appear, but then because of RNG, you play the entire game without that tech, and your RP goal was impossible because of your lack of control over technology. Or if you want to role-play as a Cyborg race - only if the RNG allows you to research the tech in a timely fashion!
Too much randomness - Bad. More control for the player - Good.
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On the other hand, we discovered gunpowder by accident, not because the Chinese emperor decided he wanted it.
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Do techs have any (temporary) drawbacks? If not, is this something easily moddable? What I'm envisioning is that certain technologies that are socially disruptive, causing temporary instability.
For example, the invention of the internet revolutionize how our species shares information but, it is incredibly different from how we did things before and people need some time to adjust. It makes piracy and sabotage much easier (until better protections are put in place) and it gives every nutjob a voice, causing social instability until people learn to be savvier consumers of information.
For example, the invention of the internet revolutionize how our species shares information but, it is incredibly different from how we did things before and people need some time to adjust. It makes piracy and sabotage much easier (until better protections are put in place) and it gives every nutjob a voice, causing social instability until people learn to be savvier consumers of information.
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Sentient AI? Stefania... no. No, bad! Haven't you read any science fiction!?
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On the other hand, as I said befor a couple posts up, a bit randomness is good for replayability.
You dont get the "best" way to go through the tech tree and most techs IRL were discovered by "accident" or luck... See gunpowder, antibiotica and such.
You can tell that some techs can be picked quite often, others aren't. That way other species are not merely your own race in disguise with some other boni. Now you not only get "real" other races (with the need to decipher their language first), but have to check first, if you attack them quite from the first contact, if they dont happen to luckily get some pretty badass weapon tech from the start just by having luck.
And concerning "...if the system works, why change it?": did it work? Or was it just that no one got the idea to implement another system? All games where you research something have a tech tree where you can view quite from the start which techs you have to research to get e.g. Lasers, of Horseriders or a Radiostation. But just because all others have it, does it make it any better?
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While you're not wrong, I'm very excited to see where PDX will take this and how it feels in practice. While we definitely won't get the level of pre-planning and control that you see with Civ-esque tech trees, I get the (mostly unfounded, granted) impression that we'll get a number of ways to influence the RNG. I expect scientist personalities and civ ethos will have a noticeable effect.
Can anyone give examples of randomized research in existing games? I've been trying to think of one, but I'm drawing blanks. Whether or not it's been done before, we'll get to try a fairly unusual tech system in Stellaris, and I'm definitely hyped for it!
And man, dat procedurally generated research, I love it to bits
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I am very happy about having a non linear tree.As I only play singleplayer one should learn how the adapt to the game situation rather that like in Civ where you do the same linear path each game.I would like to see some more fluff tech as that looks a little GC3, ie bland.
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Sure look nice, this maybe the best Paradox Game around if they do a good job and take their times improving it.
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I hope there is a solid chance of even early techs like Power Armour NOT reappearing if they are discarded, otherwise things like Colonisation and Offworld Construction (which are probably guaranteed to appear again) become no-brainers as first choices (essential for expansion and there's no downside). No-brainers are boring and therefore bad; either everyone should have them from the start, or they should be a big deal (always loved how early hyperdrives and colonisation were huge investments in Distant Worlds), not just cheap trivialities - "no, Mr. Dean, we currently have no clue about colonising other planets whatsoever. Yes, the project should take no more than a year, and after that we will be able to whip up a fully functional colony ship with room enough for sixty million people in no time. Yes, Mr. Dean, we really need just 10 000 bucks in funding." 
But that's just a really minor grumble, despite the amount of text I devoted to it. I'm all for this tech system.
Other than that though, nothing comes to mind - especially nothing where techs would be available randomly.
But that's just a really minor grumble, despite the amount of text I devoted to it.
I'm all for this tech system.Alpha Centauri had a "blind research" option - the tech tree was set in stone as normal, but you could only assign funds to research fields and had no control over what techs specifically were being researched.
Other than that though, nothing comes to mind - especially nothing where techs would be available randomly.
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That brings up memories of Victoria2 migration modifiers..
For the sake of modders I hope you eventually add a console command that writes the research mtth tables for the current tag to a log so it's easier to balance.
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Sounds every bit as intriguing as when I first heard of it. Hope it works out in the balance department, with the individual tech trees being noticeably distinct, yet more or less equally powerful.
Oh and I cannot stop to mention how bloody gorgeous the planets are
Oh and I cannot stop to mention how bloody gorgeous the planets are
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I think we can agree
our entire human history was just some guys being better at appeasing RNG gods
our entire human history was just some guys being better at appeasing RNG gods
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But it would be nice if we could get the "Final breakthrough at fusion-reactor technology" event rather sooner then later.
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Excellent. I always thought the tech system in MoO was one of the best things about the game, and this is basically that taken to its logical conclusion.