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EU4 - Development Diary - 1st of November 2016

Hi everyone, and welcome to another development diary for Europa Universalis IV. This time its rather meaty and is about major gameplay changes for the 1.19 patch.

While we were reasonably happy with how Fort and Zone of Control has played out since introduced over a year ago, it has had one major drawback. The rules have so many cases to keep track of that it was practically impossible to make all cases clear to the player. This causes much confusion amongst players, who also had an experience that was not as great as they had hoped while playing.

So now Zone of Control have changed completely. Instead of affecting a province and sometimes blocking passage in adjacent provinces, Zone of Control rules are now area based.

Areas = The same map division that States/Territories are organsied around. And which 1.19 will show thicker borders around.


A Forts is:
  • hostile if it is controlled by someone you are at war with.
  • friendly if it is controlled by you, or by someone on your side in any war, unless you are at war with them (should not happen).
  • neutral otherwise.


An area is:
  • friendly if it has at least one friendly fort and no hostile fort.
  • hostile if it has at least one hostile fort and no friendly fort.
  • contested if it has at least one hostile fort and at least one friendly fort.
  • neutral otherwise.

Zone of Control blocks an army to move between two adjacent provinces if they belong to different areas, one of which is hostile and the other being either hostile or contested.

(Note that movement within areas is never blocked by Zone of Control)

An occupied province without a fort will flip back to its owner's control if there is in the area at least one non-besieged fort controlled by him but no hostile forts.

To ensure an army can always reach the fort that is blocking it from moving and then come back after sieging it down, all armies can ignore Military Access in all non-neutral areas

Rebels never impact hostile rules, and yes, Capital Forts now work like all other forts.

In order to stop the enemy from reaching the interior of your country, you will often need to have one fort in every area.. Even without that though, forts can force the enemy to make detours unless they first siege down some forts.

While doing this, an average country ends up with more forts than before, so maintenance have been halved.

While doing these changes, we have tweaked the map dramatically, adding in lots of wastelands to give natural borders, and also made a big revision to the area setup, so now areas are pretty much all between 3-5 provinces, giving a more even balance.

eu4_131.png





We have added a new peace treaty as well in 1.19, called “End Rivalry”. This peace option force the enemy to remove one of their Rivals. The removed Rival cannot be added again until 15 years after removed.


We play the game quite a lot every week, and read far more on what issues you as players have. So we keep balancing and changing things to make for a greater player experience. In 1.19 we have some rather important changes to how you play the game.

Combat has been changed a bit as well in this patch, as we removed the combat width penalties from terrain, as it made battles last way too long, and was a double defensive bonus combined with diceroll penalties.

Sieging units will no longer get a rivercrossing penalty if a relieving force engages them, even if they did cross a river a few days, months or years earlier.

We have changed the chance to increase colonysize from colonist being placed to instead being a lower the bigger the colony becomes. Previously it was pretty much a no-brainer to keep it as long as possible, as it became better the bigger the colony is. Now íts more of a choice..

Another complaint was the fixed levels of liberty desire that got applied to vassals and marches as they grew past certain arbitrary limits. Now it is scaling by development of the subject so you can always judge impact of their growth.

For those of you that care about score, Great Powers are now likelier to be getting score each month, as they have a default +5 rating in each category. Also maintaining enough forts is now an impact on your military score gain.

Corruption is now not entirely 100% bad, as a country with 100 corruption will now get -20 unrest in their realm.

Courthouse & Town Halls no longer affect unrest but instead reduce state maintainance by 25% and 50% respectively, while their building costs have been halved.

The Casus Belli from Expansion and Exploration Ideagroups did not really work as great as before with the new technology system, so in 1.19 they are getting changed. The Casus Belli themselves are gone..

Exploration Finisher now allows you to fabricate claim on another continent that is in your capital in a colonial region. (Colonial Subjects can do it everywhere in a colonial region.)

Expansion Finisher now allows you to fabricate claims inside any trade company region that is on another continent than your capital. (Without Wealth of Nations, it is any overseas port not in a colonial region, and not in europe.)

At the same time, distance impact on building spy networks have been dropped to 1/10th of before.

For those of you that have Rights of Man, we are now adding even more things. In 1.19, Trade Goods will have a local impact. A Grain Province gives +0.5 Land Force Limit, Iron gives 20% Faster Building Construction & Ivory gives 20% cheaper state maintenance.

We have also improved the “trading in good” - bonus, where some are almost twice as powerful as before, and some have changed completely.

Next week we'll be back talking about all interface improvements for 1.19.
 
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The new ZoC rules just threw Switzerland into nothingness, after it finally became viable with 1.18 do to easier defender advantage on your own forts. Now you only need to lose once and the enemy can probably stackwipe you since you only have 2 areas and movement in an area is not restricted anymore. In general, every smaller nation has completely lost their last defensive advantage due to the new non-restrictiveness of movement for the local area. Guess we have to wait for another fix of ZoCs in the future...
 
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Nope. It's a way to partially unwind the hatchet job that the Institution system did to the effectiveness of two idea groups' finishers.

(And if you were taking Exploration purely for the CB at the end, you're very strange.)

I think the proposed changes make it even worse!

Edit: Need to think about it so more but I think I would get behind a system where the natives will get spread of your institutions over time (perhaps at an accelarated rate) so the reforming process isn't instantaneous. I havent played a native game in 1.18 yet so not really qualified to think/understand how it should be balanced from their perspective.

Make the Exploration finisher give you the CB as it is in 1.18 for tags in colonial regions where you have a CN (regardless of the tag's institution level). Also give you the CB on unrefomed nations even if you dont have A CN.
 
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Imagine a late-game nation with 100 level 8 forts. Do you want to siege that down? Because I certainly don't.
I don't want to see that, which is why I proposed a higher initial cost of forts. 100 level 8 forts should be a huge expense to setup. You're also taking over 100 building slots that could go toward better things.

A better replacement for maintenance should be repair costs. After a fort is sieged down, you should have to pay a cost to reinforce it back up, much like you have to pay to reinforce troops after casualties. What a pleasant strategic decision, determining if you want to bother manning each fort as it is occupied or captured.
 
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but these ZOC rules mean you'll need two layers of forts, right? If only your front-line areas have forts, the areas behind them count as "neutral", and can simply be walked into freely from "hostile" front-line areas with forts. IMO, an easy fix is to say that areas where all provinces are controlled by enemies also count as "hostile" and/or "contested" - you'll only need to grab one undefended province to make it "neutral", so it'll be fast, but you can't just waltz through their line of forts into their heartland.

I don't want to see that, which is why I proposed a higher initial cost of forts. 100 level 8 forts should be a huge expense to setup. You're also taking over 100 building slots that could go toward better things.

A better replacement for maintenance should be repair costs. After a fort is sieged down, you should have to pay a cost to reinforce it back up, much like you have to pay to reinforce troops after casualties. What a pleasant strategic decision, determining if you want to bother manning each fort as it is occupied or captured.

100 level 8 forts is 80,000 ducats, plus 200 ducats/month even after these changes. I think that's enough of a cost, given that you can raise and maintain a couple hundred thousand mercs and also build the Panama and Suez canals for that.
 
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Courthouse & Town Halls no longer affect unrest but instead reduce state maintainance by 25% and 50% respectively, while their building costs have been halved.

How about Docks? Even if I do a "tall" playthrough with few provinces I avoid getting them, after all, this kind of country needs to focus at Quality of troops/ships, that means your forces should be superior to enemy. As they are much better they don't take losses. So having an extra sailors is quite pointless.

How about we split the "Local shipbuilding time" and "Local ship repair" between Docks and Shipyards?
 
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We have changed the chance to increase colonysize from colonist being placed to instead being a lower the bigger the colony becomes. Previously it was pretty much a no-brainer to keep it as long as possible, as it became better the bigger the colony is. Now íts more of a choice..
What does that mean? Colonial nation will not colonize on their own anymore or some penalty as a CN gets bigger?
 
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Correct me if I'm wrong, but these ZOC rules mean you'll need two layers of forts, right? If only your front-line areas have forts, the areas behind them count as "neutral", and can simply be walked into freely from "hostile" front-line areas with forts. IMO, an easy fix is to say that areas where all provinces are controlled by enemies also count as "hostile" and/or "contested" - you'll only need to grab one undefended province to make it "neutral", so it'll be fast, but you can't just waltz through their line of forts into their heartland.



100 level 8 forts is 80,000 ducats, plus 200 ducats/month even after these changes. I think that's enough of a cost, given that you can raise and maintain a couple hundred thousand mercs and also build the Panama and Suez canals for that.
No, all your enemies provinces count as hostile, not just those with forts in their areas, so you cannot cross areas and skip the forts for stackwiping entirely. You should re-read the dev diary. It's a bit complex due to all the changes, so reading it again might help understand it better :)
 
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How about Docks? Even if I do a "tall" playthrough with few provinces I avoid getting them, after all, this kind of country needs to focus at Quality of troops/ships, that means your forces should be superior to enemy. As they are much better they don't take losses. So having an extra sailors is quite pointless.

How about we split the "Local shipbuilding time" and "Local ship repair" between Docks and Shipyards?

For sure. Docks are completely worthless - I have never run across a single situation where I was even tempted to buy them. And I'm playing a Russia game right now where I'm competing with major naval powers without owning much more than St. Petersberg and the White Sea. Sailors simply are not an issue. If they repaired my ships faster, I'd at least build a couple.

No, all your enemies provinces count as hostile, not just those with forts in their areas, so you cannot cross areas and skip the forts for stackwiping entirely. You should re-read the dev diary. It's a bit complex due to all the changes, so reading it again might help understand it better :)

I read it three times before posting that.

An area is:
  • friendly if it has at least one friendly fort and no hostile fort.
  • hostile if it has at least one hostile fort and no friendly fort.
  • contested if it has at least one hostile fort and at least one friendly fort.
  • neutral otherwise.

Zone of Control blocks an army to move between two adjacent provinces if they belong to different areas, one of which is hostile and the other being either hostile or contested.
 
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Nope. It's a way to partially unwind the hatchet job that the Institution system did to the effectiveness of two idea groups' finishers.

(And if you were taking Exploration purely for the CB at the end, you're very strange.)

The only way to conquer new world areas like Mexico quickly now is to take religious ideas, or wait until the 1700s for imperialism. The CB at the end of Exploration and Expansion were among the best in the game.
 
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Nice changes, any update on when this will be available in beta?

Also perhaps have a limit on how many forts a country can have, limited by the amount of provinces you have or the total development you have so they cannot be in almost every province.
 
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While doing this, an average country ends up with more forts than before, so maintenance have been halved.

While doing these changes, we have tweaked the map dramatically, adding in lots of wastelands to give natural borders, and also made a big revision to the area setup, so now areas are pretty much all between 3-5 provinces, giving a more even balance.
.

Can you tell/show us more abot the new wasteland Areas?

I welcome the new Fort ZoC mechanics, but to me it is still not entirely clear what will make a player actually build forts and not delete them like many do now.
The benefits of not having Forts are weaker (less money saved) but I dont see the incentive of chaning this particular style of game play (in Single Player at least).
 
This change is terrible for small nations. Now you can't hide behind a line of forts because you would need to be 2 areas deep. And you can't fight in mountains to balance out your lower force limit.
 
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What about changing those exploration and expansion claims to claim areas rather than provinces?
Or perhaps the spy network cost to claim a province could be reduced by the tech level difference.
 
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So for 200 gold (town hall) I can get a reduction of 0.0035 per development per month.

To return the investment in 100 years, that province would need to have 47.6 development (a little less if the province is far from your capital).

I guess I might build one in Paris...
 
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So, if I understand this correctly, a two-area deep line of forts is necessary to prevent the enemy from just walkling all over your territory? - i.e. if forts are put only in the border-areas, and there are no fort in the adjecent area deeper within your territory, then this area is neutral and the enemy can freely walk past your fort and deeper into your territory?

I'm waiting for a Dev response to this. I don't like the idea of an enemy army walking around the inner areas of my country without even sieging forts on the border. And possibly easily reaching the capital fort without sieging anything else.
 
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I seriously hope that the claims the are fabricated through the Exploration and Expansion finishers have some kind of discounts. Either for their fabrication or the war cost. Maybe both.
 
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Is the trade good bonuses going to scale off of development? Or are they just a flat bonus where "once I have this good, I get it's bonus"?
I could just see it being a hindrance to building tall.
 
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in 1.19 will trade cities be modable so you can put them into unique modded governments for Hansa and other Merchant republics, like they have in VeF and M&T?

The current system where they are only for basic merchant republics ruins the options you can have for unique systems.
 
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