Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary will be about changes and new additions for Fallen Empires in the 1.8 'Čapek' update and its accompanying (unannounced) Story Pack, about which we cannot currently provide any information except what's in this dev diary (there will be info about other features in the pack coming in later dev diaries). We also cannot currently provide say anything about the release date for the update other than to say that it's not coming out anytime soon. After what happened with 1.6, we want to take our time with this one and make sure we get it to you in a good shape.

Ancient Caretakers (Story Pack)
Those with the Story Pack will be able to encounter a brand new Fallen Empire - the Ancient Caretakers. The Ancient Caretakers is a fallen synthetic civilization that appears to be the remnant of some great conflict in the distant past. From what they tell you, they appear to have been part of something called the 'Custodian Project', an initiative to construct and maintain a number of ringworlds as a refuge for biological sapients fleeing some unknown menace. Their erratic behavior and speech, however, suggests that something may be very wrong indeed with this Fallen Machine Empire.

The Ancient Caretakers have a new attitude called 'Enigmatic' and an obscured opinion score to represent their bizarre and unpredictable nature. They may help you with gifts of ships of technology, request your assistance with tasks that may make little apparent sense, or even make demands of your empire that you would be unwise to ignore. They do not awaken like a regular Fallen Empire, but instead have a particular 'triggering event' that, if it happens during the course of the game, will automatically awaken them... though they will not always awaken in the same way. All in all, they behave quite differently from the other Fallen and Awakened Empires, and have their own backstory to explore, as well as unique interactions when dealing with other synthetic civilizations.

Fallen Empire Tweaks & Changes (Čapek Update)
In addition to the Ancient Caretakers, there are also some changes coming to the current batch of Fallen Empires. First of all, because the Ancient Caretakers also make use of ringworlds, we decided that you'd end up with just a few too many ringworlds to conquer and restore kicking around. Thus, for those with the Story Pack, we made a new initializer for the Keepers of Knowledge with a more traditional Fallen Empire setup of Gaia Worlds and outlying colonies, including some unique features and buildings to suit their archivarian ways. The old initializer with its three ringworlds still exists, however, and will spawn for those that do not have the Story Pack, so those without do not have their Fallen Empire ringworlds taken away.

Other than that, the following changes were done to the existing Fallen Empires:
- Keepers of Knowledge were changed to have their behavior (Hatred of AI) no longer directly conflict with their ethos (Materialist). Both their Fallen and Awakened variants no longer hold a grudge against AI, but instead have doubled down on their obsession with collecting and hoarding knowledge. Satellites of Awakened Keepers of Knowledge are no longer required to ban AI, but will have to contribute a major share of their research to their overlord.
- Holy Guardians were changed to be a bit more interactive, and are now able to offer tasks and give gifts to the younger races, though they will mostly only deign to do so to fellow Spiritualists. They have also taken over some of the Keepers of Knowledge's hatred of AI, and you can expect their Awakened variant to offer no quarter to synthetic civilizations.
- Militant Isolationists and Enigmatic Observers have mostly been left unchanged, asides from some updates to their initializers and ship designs, such as removing the Synths previously used by the Militant Isolationists and giving them to the Keepers of Knowledge instead. They will now also start with more trait points for their species than the other Fallen Empires, to represent their focus on the biological.

Finally, a change was done to the way you establish contact with Fallen Empires. Previously, unless you had done something to anger them (for example colonize a Holy World) FEs would open communications only when you directly entered their space. This has been changed so that Fallen Empires will now instead contact you when your ships enter any system adjacent to their space. This should make it harder to accidentally colonize next to Militant Isolationists and also make it so that your exploring science ship isn't immediately hurled back to your capital just because it happened to take a wrong turn after Omicron Persei.

That's all for today! Next week we'll be discussing some changes coming to Hive Minds and Devouring Swarms, as well as the addition of Dynamic Tradition Swapping in 1.8 'Čapek'.

 

[jose2534]

- Holy Guardians were changed to be a bit more interactive

YES!!!!!!!!! At last I can play my spiritualist nation and get along with the Holy Guardians

to represent their focus on the biological.

So, for Utopia owners, this means that they will have the super expensive traits?

Another question: someone that does not have the Utopia features, such as hive minds, will be able to have the story pack anyway? Because that sinth is a hive mind for what I can tell.

 

[mwyeoh]

This all looks awesome!
More story events will always make Stellaris more interesting

 

[Jorlem]

contribute a major share of their research to their overlord.

This has never made much sense to me. With mineral or energy taxes, once you pay the tax, you no longer have the resources you paid. But with research taxes, once you pay the tax, you still have the knowledge you gained while doing that research. Perhaps instead of reducing your research rate, it could scatter some percentage of it into tech cards that are in the deck instead of applying it to the card you have active, and put a cap of two on the number of new cards you can draw when you finish a tech? That would be far more interesting and flavorful than yet another simple numerical penalty.

Keepers of Knowledge no longer hating synthetics isn't because we changed the lore to make them more benevolent, but rather because their personality simply clashed with their ethos (for example, in a War of Heaven between Materialist AE and Spiritualist AE, siding with *either* part would result in your robots being dismantled). That part of their personality was simply shifted to the Spiritualists instead, since Spiritualist ethos is explicitly anti-robot.

Why are Spiritualists anti-robot, anyway? I get them being against AIs, and thus being opposed to synths, but why do they care about tool use, or the sorts of computers we have today? Heck, even they use those, as their spacecraft are mechanical. Actually, could that be considered for a potential future change, giving the Spiritualists spacecraft models that are clearly psionic projections instead of machines, like the Unbidden appear to have?

 

[Everstill]

I wonder if the Fallen Machine Empire's AI suddenly turning defective because of a certain event is a mise en abyme of what happens with the game's AI whenever a new patch is released...

It would be a hilarious inside joke if you help them update to patch 1.6 and then all the AI Fallen Empire go all ERROR ERROR ERROR.

 

[Eldrake]

Why are Spiritualists anti-robot, anyway? I get them being against AIs, and thus being opposed to synths, but why do they care about tool use, or the sorts of computers we have today? Heck, even they use those, as their spacecraft are mechanical. Actually, could that be considered for a potential future change, giving the Spiritualists spacecraft models that are clearly psionic projections instead of machines, like the Unbidden appear to have?

Even the base robots appear to have some degree of artificial intelligence, if just enough to follow simple instructions. Given that the Keepers of Knowledge currently dislikes "Pursuing AI Robotics" as soon as you get robots, that's probably the case.

 

[Milten]

This has never made much sense to me. With mineral or energy taxes, once you pay the tax, you no longer have the resources you paid. But with research taxes, once you pay the tax, you still have the knowledge you gained while doing that research.

I sense lack of imagination. It's not just about knowledge, it's also about scientist's efforts. Imagine a quarter of your scientists instead of working on bureaucracy optimization, being busy studying hamster social interactions in 0.34 gravity for that AE.

 

[Everstill]

Will there be any content in v1.8 for players who don't like Fallen Empires and turn them off at the beginning?

Why would you turn off Fallen Empires? :/

This has never made much sense to me. With mineral or energy taxes, once you pay the tax, you no longer have the resources you paid. But with research taxes, once you pay the tax, you still have the knowledge you gained while doing that research. Perhaps instead of reducing your research rate, it could scatter some percentage of it into tech cards that are in the deck instead of applying it to the card you have active, and put a cap of two on the number of new cards you can draw when you finish a tech? That would be far more interesting and flavorful than yet another simple numerical penalty.

They force your Scientists to work for them? Very simple.

Why are Spiritualists anti-robot, anyway? I get them being against AIs, and thus being opposed to synths, but why do they care about tool use, or the sorts of computers we have today? Heck, even they use those, as their spacecraft are mechanical. Actually, could that be considered for a potential future change, giving the Spiritualists spacecraft models that are clearly psionic projections instead of machines, like the Unbidden appear to have?

Yep, Spiritualist should be able to use Robots and Cybernetics just fine. Droids are already a person imitation so we can see how it's a sin and full synth ascension is like a master sin super abomination.

The Artificial Inteligence Policy should offer AI levels permited: None, Robots, Droids, Synths, so Spiritualists can only have Robots.

 

[Dmitrius]

Well, this holocaust might have been way before other FE.

Plus it may be so that they themselves are the cause of that extinction, but it might have been that they were a tool of the other FE.

Yeah, plausible enough. If we wanted to go down that rabbit hole it's possible that the fallen empires are all the survivors of some apocalyptic event that caused a violent swing to isolationism. Across multiple epochs as you suggest.

It would be cool if the fallen empires were fleshed out in terms of story to include involvement in random events and the end game crises. For example a materialist FE might offer to sell you a shield that specifically rebuffs matter disintegratiors if you have proven wise (to them) across your playtime in the decisions made during events e.g. dismantling precursor monuments rather than worshipping them etc.

 

[Jorlem]

I sense lack of imagination. It's not just about knowledge, it's also about scientist's efforts. Imagine a quarter of your scientists instead of working on bureaucracy optimization, being busy studying hamster social interactions in 0.34 gravity for that AE.

Read the next sentence in my earlier post. The idea I mentioned would show that loss of control over your own research in a far more interesting way than a generic numerical penalty, by scattering the research over other cards that are in your deck, and reducing your options for what you research next.

They force your Scientists to work for them? Very simple.

Then have them actually take the scientists instead of a boring numerical penalty. The Event Horizon event chain does that.

 

[Milten]

Read the next sentence in my earlier post. The idea I mentioned would show that loss of control over your own research in a far more interesting way than a generic numerical penalty, by scattering the research over other cards that are in your deck, and reducing your options for what you research next.

Messing with my tech deck would be more annoying than interesting for me. Preferences, I suppose.

Then have them actually take the scientists instead of a boring numerical penalty. The Event Horizon event chain does that.

EH goes for specific persona from millions and millions of scientists in your empire.

 

[Wizzington]

I honestly don't know why I even have to explain this but yes, there will be plenty of other content in the Story Pack besides Fallen Machine Empires. More info in future DDs.

 

[Nyrael]

This has never made much sense to me. With mineral or energy taxes, once you pay the tax, you no longer have the resources you paid. But with research taxes, once you pay the tax, you still have the knowledge you gained while doing that research. Perhaps instead of reducing your research rate, it could scatter some percentage of it into tech cards that are in the deck instead of applying it to the card you have active, and put a cap of two on the number of new cards you can draw when you finish a tech? That would be far more interesting and flavorful than yet another simple numerical penalty.

Research Points don't represent you doing the research, but your researching capabilities. Basically, you are giving them your research computers, control of your research facilities, millions of scientists who would otherwise be used by you, etc.

Even the base robots appear to have some degree of artificial intelligence, if just enough to follow simple instructions. Given that the Keepers of Knowledge currently dislikes "Pursuing AI Robotics" as soon as you get robots, that's probably the case.

Still, why would they care? At worst, they would think of them as machines with no sentient rights. The only thing with AI that should disturb them if if you slaughter yur entire populace and cop their minds to machines (aka, Sytnethic Ascension).

Then have them actually take the scientists instead of a boring numerical penalty. The Event Horizon event chain does that.

Why would they take them though? They don't need someone to lead their country' research (they have it themselves), they need those billions of scientists who are not represented as characters but do exist. I mean, you don't really think that you have only three people doing your research, right?

 

[klingonadmiral]

But, will there be any changes to the strength of Awakened Empires? Those guys are simply not beatable without exploiting the AI on 1000 star galaxies at the moment. And carefully keeping your fleets below the awakening threshold while eating the entire galaxy (because once they awake you need to be able to strike them immediately to stand a chance) isn't much fun either.

I do not care about more FE types as long as their very concept remains fundamentally flawed. Plus thanks for taking away our guaranteed ringworlds.

 

[ECFOX]

Wiz, Will there be more synth portraits for the fallen empire? If so will we be able to use those portraits too?

 

[huyderman]

The Computer is your friend. The Computer is perfectly sane, and only want what's best for you. Doubting the Computer is treason.

All Hail the Computer! All Hail Alpha Complex!​

 

[TempusxX]

so the little tid bit that you gave of some unknown menace harming the biological's and that the machine empire was protecting them from some unknown menance, the only thing I can think of as an unknown menance would be "The Contingency" or would it be some other unknown threat that we don't know about. Also the project I want to know more about


Edit: - Wiz if you see this will we be able to repair/fix the machine fallen empire since their is something wrong with them, or would that be a no

 

[grandad1982]

I honestly don't know why I even have to explain this but yes, there will be plenty of other content in the Story Pack besides Fallen Machine Empires. More info in future DDs.

Because the internet?

 

[VoidEmperor]

Love it

 

[Walter Peck]

I honestly don't know why I even have to explain this but yes, there will be plenty of other content in the Story Pack besides Fallen Machine Empires. More info in future DDs.

Because this is the internet. Anything over one syllable confuses the unwashed masses.

 

[Hype]

Basically, having both of them spawn a bunch of ringworlds would mean any medium or larger galaxy would be virtually guaranteed to have a lot of ringworlds. We want to keep them somewhat rare and special, not have them be all over the galaxy.

Is it not possible to reduce the number of ruined ringworlds instead of removing them from the fallen empire? Or at least make it an option that they player can choose when generating the galaxy.