• We have updated our Community Code of Conduct. Please read through the new rules for the forum that are an integral part of Paradox Interactive’s User Agreement.

Dev Diary #99 - Ground Combat & Army Rework

Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris dev diary. Today's dev diary is about some changes coming to ground combat and armies in the 2.0 'Cherryh' update. This will be the last dev diary before we take a break for the holidays, so there will be no diaries in the next week or the week after that. Stellaris dev diaries return on Thursday January 11th, 2018.

Defense Armies and Fortresses
Constructing Defense Armies have always been largely a meaningless exercise in Stellaris. While they are useful for reducing Unrest and occasionally might be able to beat off an unprepared attacker, the fact that a planet is capped on how many armies can be defending it while the attacker is *not* capped on how many armies are attacking, coupled with the general weakness of defense armies, means that defending a planet against a ground invasion is generally an exercise in futility and will at most delay an attacker by a few weeks. However, if we solved this by just making defense armies a lot stronger or capping the number of attacking units, the result would turn every invasion of a backwater colony into a big affair - something that is not particularly desirable when a war can involve several different actors with hundreds of planets between them.

For this reason, we have decided to rework Defense Armies into something that is actually useful, but requires a significant investment of resources to muster more than a token defense. Instead of being directly buildable by the empire, defense armies are created from certain buildings. The capital building will produce defense armies depending on its level, as will some other planetary uniques like Military Academy. If you want a planet to be well defended, however, you will need to construct Fortress building on its tiles. Fortresses require a pop to work them, do not produce any other resources than a small amount of Unity, but provide a significant amount of defense armies to protect the planet. Armies spawned by Fortresses are also impervious to orbital bombardment, and will not be able to be killed without first ruining the building itself. The armies generated by a building have their species and type set by the pop working it, so a Very Strong Battle Thrall will produce several powerful defense armies if placed on a Fortress, and special pops like Droids will produce their own variants like Robotic Defense Armies rather than the normal ones. Fortified worlds will also be able to be fit with an FTL inhibitor (the exact way they get them is not yet determined) that prevents enemy fleets from leaving the system unless the world is captured, which allows for the creation of Fortress Worlds to protect strategically important systems.
2017_12_21_3.png

(Building icon is a placeholder)

One more important change related to Defense Armies is a change to Unrest: Armies on planets no longer reduce Unrest directly. Instead, to handle a planet with high Unrest, you will need to construct Fortress-style buildings or take other measures (such as using Edicts) to reduce the planetary Unrest. This means you cannot simply capture a planet and then spam a dozen defense armies to immediately zero out the Unrest. As part of this, we will be balancing certain events and effect to ensure newly captured worlds do not instantly defect back to their former owner.

Finally, as part of all these changes Defense Armies have received a general buff and there are several new technologies that unlock additional tiers of forts and various improvements to Defense Armies' combat ability, meaning that they will grow stronger alongside the invention of new, more powerful assault armies.

Assault Army Management
A major aim of our changes to armies is to reduce the amount of unnecessary micromanagement of armies. For this reason, and to make Assault Armies' role more explicit, we have decided to change Assault Armies to always be based in space. Whenever not directly engaged in an invasion, Assault Armies will now always automatically embark onto their transports, ready to be used to invade another world. We also aim to fix the minor but immersion-breaking bug where transport fleets are giving endlessly increasing sequential names whenever they land and embark again.

Combat Width, Retreating and Collateral Damage
Another change to ground combat is the introduction of new mechanics in the form of Combat Width. Combat Width is determined by the size of the planet, and decides how many armies can be taking and receiving damage at the same time: For example, if 20 assault armies invade a world held by 10 defense armies with a combat width of 10, all 10 defense armies will be immediately engaged in battle while only half the assault armies will be able to deal and receive damage, with additional assault armies joining the fray as the armies in front of them are destroyed. This means that it is no longer possible to take a well defended world without losses by simply throwing a hundred clone armies at it: If you wish to minimize losses (and thus War Exhaustion), you will need to invest in expensive, high-maintenance elite armies.
2017_12_21_1.png

(Interface not final)

We've also added the concept of Collateral Damage: As armies fight on the planet, civilians and civilian infrastructure is caught in the fighting. Each time an army deals damage in battle, it will inflict a random amount of Collateral Damage, which increases Planetary Damage similar to Orbital Bombardment (see below) and can lead to the death of Pops and the destruction of buildings and tiles. Some armies will deal more Collateral Damage than others: For example, Xenomorph armies are highly destructive and cost-efficient, but will wreak immense havoc on the planet, potentially leaving it in ruins in the process of capturing it for your empire.

While working on combat mechanics we also took the time to change the way Morale Damage works, making it something that is suffered by both sides (instead of just the loser) and making the effects of it more gradual, so that armies suffer a drop in combat efficiency once they are <50% morale, and then another, sharper drop when they are broken (0% morale). This should make certain armies, such as Psi Armies, highly effective against low-morale opponents like Slave Armies, but less effective against an unfeeling army of Droids. Finally, we've also tweaked the damage-dealing algorithm so that damage is less evenly spread among combatants, making it so that even an outnumbered force can destroy regiments and inflict war exhaustion on the enemy.
2017_12_21_2.png


Finally, we have made some changes to retreats. When an attacker retreats from a ground combat, there is now a significant chance that each retreating regiment is destroyed while attempting to return to space, making retreat a risky endeavour and eliminating the tactic of simply send in the same army again and again in wave attacks, instead making retreats something you do in order to preserve at least some of your army in a poorly chosen engagement.

Orbital Bombardment Changes
Finally, again in the interest of reducing the micromanagement needed during war, we've changed the way orbital bombardment works. Fortifications have been entirely cut from planets, so that there is no need to bombard lightly defended worlds before going in with the ground troops. Instead, we have added a requirement that planets cannot be invaded if there is a hostile Starbase in the system, so that transports cannot snipe worlds that are protected by defensive installations present in the same system. Orbital Bombardment, instead of being something you have to manage and wait for in every single planetary engagement, is now something you do to soften up a particularly well defended target, or simply to wreak havoc on the enemy's planet and drive up their War Exhaustion.

As a planet is bombarded, the fleet will deal Planetary Damage, ruining buildings and killing Pops. Bombarding fleets will also do damage to armies present on the planet (unless those armies are protected by a Fortress), and over a long enough time can decimate a defending force, though doing so will likely cause heavy damage to the planet and may delay the attacker long enough that the owner of the planet has time to build up their forces or inflict enough war exhaustion to force a peace. The rate at which the planet is damaged can also be slowed with the construction of buildings such as Planetary Defense Shield, further dragging out the process.

As part of these changes, we've consolidated the Bombardment Stances into the following:
  • Selective: Deals normal damage to armies/buildings and light damage to pops. Cannot kill the last 10 pops.
  • Indiscriminate: Deals heavy damage to armies, buildings and pops. Cannot kill the last 5 pops.
  • Armageddon: Deals massive damage to armies, buildings and pops. Can turn planets into depopulated Tomb Worlds with enough bombardment. Only available to certain empires such as Purifiers.

Attachments
Finally, on the topic of attachments, we have decided to cut them entirely from the game. We discussed a variety of ways to improve the way you assign them, but ultimately decided that we already have so many types of armies and not nearly enough combat mechanics to justify a significant investment of UI time that could go towards something like the Fleet Manager instead. The technologies that previously unlocked attachments will be changed to give other effects, such as direct buffs to certain army types.

That's all for today! As I said, we're now going on hiatus, so I'll see you again on January 11th with a dev diary about... well, that's a secret, actually. You'll just have to wait and see!
 
Last edited:
  • 1
Reactions:
These changes sound good!

An unrelated topic - Can we get rid of the active sensor link abuses? Right now, in multiplayer, adversaries can get active sensor links with your vassals, when you go to war - BAM that player knows everything about your fleets and systems.

I also dislike when I discover a human player across the galaxy on year 25 because he is abusing the star chart and sensor link options. This one isn't as critical as the vassal sensor link problem, but it is cheesy and immersion breaking for me.
 
Will you be able to bombard a planet if a hostile starbase is in the system? There are concerns that throwing a single corvette to bomb every world will induce war exhaustion quickly, my hope is that fleet power scales with damage done on planets so that a single ship cannot damage a world let a lone a heavily defended one. Am I correct in assuming this?
 
Yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes yes!!!

Can we PLEASE GET A BETA FOR THIS ALREADY? Words can not describe how awesome this is.
 
- Can we make a FTL emergency retreat if a fleet is in a system with FTL inhibitor ? With and without a space battle.
Given the other place we've seen FTL inhibitors explained was the Starbases, I would imagine the answer (IIRC) is the same: if your fleet is inside an Inhibited system, you either need to destroy the inhibitor or engage emergency FTL and go MIA for a while.
 
Great change. Hope the annihilation of pop or building with armagedon will be faster than the current rate.
Play a xenopohobe empire without. Landing on planet will be perfect.
Purging thank to space fleet :).
 
Okay, some questions:
1. Bombardment Stance: is there a non-bombardment stance (if all you want to do is blockade the planet)? Are some empires locked into that one?

2. AI Army building: One of hte biggest downfalls of the AI was that it simply lacked the ability to purposefully build armies to actually conquer a planet. The enemy fleet could get stuck bombarding one planet for years, never actually having the troops to conquer it (because of some hickup in the Budgeting).
With increased casualies (and the inability to have assault armies savely planetside), will you be able to teach it to build enough armies for any given planetary attack?

3. What about Fanatical Purgers and Forts on Conqeured planets? By their nature the pop that would man the Fort is being purged. Wich means it propably provides no Unrest supression or Defensive armies. And manually ferrying in the Primary species pops can be tiresome at best.
Any plans to allow us to spawn a primary species pop upon taking the planet (simialr to how one can do when taking a planet from the contigency)?
 
Will you be able to bombard a planet if a hostile starbase is in the system? There are concerns that throwing a single corvette to bomb every world will induce war exhaustion quickly, my hope is that fleet power scales with damage done on planets so that a single ship cannot damage a world let a lone a heavily defended one. Am I correct in assuming this?
Fleet power already scales- a small handful of ships can sit above a planet for as long as you'd like and never reduce its fortifications as of this moment.
 
This will be the last dev diary before we take a break for the holidays, so there will be no diaries in the next week or the week after that.

Certainly earned your vacation this year, have a merry christmas (or whatever religious equivalent holiday you prefer) and a good start in the new year!
Not that I actually expect Wiz to notice or read this comment :_(

, but requires a significant investment of resources to muster more than a token defense. Instead of being directly buildable by the empire, defense armies are created from certain buildings. The capital building will produce defense armies depending on its level, as will some other planetary uniques like Military Academy. If you want a planet to be well defended, however, you will need to construct Fortress building on its tiles. Fortresses require a pop to work them, do not produce any other resources than a small amount of Unity,

I really, REALLY like this solution. It removes micromanagement and instead has players invest valuable tiles.
However, Why give it a 1 Unity yield? That's still half a monument, which I priorize on every planet because it'S a main unity income early on. I would much rather have seen something minor like 1 mineral/energy instead (which would as well promote the concept of defending slave armies when combo'd with chattel slavery, etc).

The armies generated by a building have their species and type set by the pop working it, so a Very Strong Battle Thrall will produce several powerful defense armies if placed on a Fortress, and special pops like Droids will produce their own variants like Robotic Defense Armies rather than the normal ones.

Neat attention to detail!

Fortified worlds will also be able to be fit with an FTL inhibitor (the exact way they get them is not yet determined) that prevents enemy fleets from leaving the system unless the world is captured, which allows for the creation of Fortress Worlds to protect strategically important systems.

I hope you make the presence of FTL Inhibitors sufficiently clear to enemies, and give them an alternative way to disengage from their trapped state. Would be pretty annoying to have your fleet get stuck for months trying to bomb that 'outer rim colony' you just wanted to pass by, but happened to have an Inhibitor.

Finally, as part of all these changes Defense Armies have received a general buff and there are several new technologies that unlock additional tiers of forts and various improvements to Defense Armies' combat ability, meaning that they will grow stronger alongside the invention of new, more powerful assault armies.

I was always amused that Defensive Armies never advanced beyond their one tier, not counting attachments and such like.

A major aim of our changes to armies is to reduce the amount of unnecessary micromanagement of armies. For this reason, and to make Assault Armies' role more explicit, we have decided to change Assault Armies to always be based in space. Whenever not directly engaged in an invasion, Assault Armies will now always automatically embark onto their transports, ready to be used to invade another world. We also aim to fix the minor but immersion-breaking bug where transport fleets are giving endlessly increasing sequential names whenever they land and embark again.

Very good decision. Will the Transport ships as well remain 'locked in orbit' instead of doing vanishing/reappearing acts (usually including stealth upgrades to the newest ship loadout and full repairs)?
As well, glad to see that long standing issue fixed. Now I can finally have Genetic Elite Armies with proper 40k names. World Eaters incoming!

This means that it is no longer possible to take a well defended world without losses by simply throwing a hundred clone armies at it: If you wish to minimize losses (and thus War Exhaustion), you will need to invest in expensive, high-maintenance elite armies.

I usually preferred a select few elite armies over hundreds of clones, mostly because of the micro hassle that included, but I'm both happy to see latter becoming less viable, yet a non-tedious option.

By the by, I think you teasered higher maintenance cost, but didn't mention them with a single word in the dev diary, past this line? Any details (not non-final numbers tho, duh) on that?

Armageddon: Deals massive damage to armies, buildings and pops. Can turn planets into depopulated Tomb Worlds with enough bombardment. Only available to certain empires such as Purifiers.

<3 Tombworld Terraforming

Finally, on the topic of attachments, we have decided to cut them entirely from the game. We discussed a variety of ways to improve the way you assign them, but ultimately decided that we already have so many types of armies and not nearly enough combat mechanics to justify a significant investment of UI time that could go towards something like the Fleet Manager instead. The technologies that previously unlocked attachments will be changed to give other effects, such as direct buffs to certain army types.

I know you'll get some idiots using this as ammunition to whine about 'OMG PDX REMOVING CONTENT FROM A GAME I OWN', but I strongly support these kinds of decision. Cutting something from the game because you realize it's only detrimental to the gameplay is something practiced way too hesitantly by most developers. Proves good sense of judgement.

Keep up the good work!
 
I really hoped fortresses (and maybe planetary-defense-station like railguns) could be build on additional (special-)tiles. Those tiles could be used to individualize planets as fortification worlds and others as mining worlds, for example.
And what about the annoying transports? I dreamed of them replaced by some kind of auxiliaryslot put on ships.
:/
 
Yes. We realize this is a bit odd, but compare the amount of times you would actually use an assault army to defend a planet compared to the amount of times you have to click 'embark' after invading one...

Oh yes, but I never minded the extra clicks. It's your call I guess.

On that topic, will this be moddable?
 
If a system and a planet have inhibitors, does this mean an invading fleet will need to destroy both inhibitors to leave the system?

If yes, that's a sneaky way to punish doomstacks.
 
Hmm... over all i like the changes and am sad to see the attachments go, but this i must say feels like to defend my high production/important worlds i will need to add yet another building to defend them, cutting their production. now, dont get me wrong, this is not a "oh no micro management!" argument, but on a number of worlds when building tall (as i normally do) 2 tiles can be a serious trade off to keep these few precious dots mine. This, should be good :)
 
Why not allow attachments to do auxiliary/utility things, for example prefab fortifications allow an assault army to remain on a planet and give it some resistance to orbital bombardment to allow you to garrison newly occupied worlds or drop-troopers allow you to deploy from space instantly [this'd work better if defence armies could shoot at armies in the process of landing if there were no enemy armies on the ground, but could still be used to reinforce armies with forces from space more easily] or commandos which lets them attack against enemy reserves or stuff like that, rather than %age bonuses.
 
I like it. Of course there are some things I worry about:
1) If you create an impenetrable fortress planet, can this realistically keep your empire safe? Or will you lose the planet when the space is taken around your system and someone forces a wargoal for that system's starhold etc? (I know you might force the enemy fleet to stay in system, but they already destroyed the starhold so especially don't they control this system?)
2) Will we get better resettle/genemod mechanic? I can see the resilient trait being more useful but if I have to micro move pops around empire to spread resilient species out I will go INSANE.

But overall I like it. I'm sad to see the attachments go, but I understand it. In future I'd love to see troop types/upgrades that have their own interface, or maybe a setting in empire policy that determines further what "type" of troops you recruit. Like instead of attachment you get a new policy that makes your defensive troops "tank battalions" or "mech battalions" or "clone armies". I guess you would have to have three tiers of mods, the tile mods resulting from pop working the tile, the planetary mods resulting from unique buildings (like the barracks or clone vats), and empire wide mods resulting from policy/unique techs. Ok this could get a bit too complicated :(
 
@Wiz I like the changes generally, but how does just blocking assault armies from staying on a planet after an attack improve micromanagement?

For me the big issue is that armies are completely vulnerable while in space and I usually find myself leaving them on a world to avoid their destruction either whilst in orbit or engaged following a fleet in combat.

Is there no way to integrate them into fleets where they can be defended? What if larger ships like cruisers and battleships were given a utility slots capable of housing armies? Even as a late mid game tech this surely would avoid the micro associated with armies that people find so egregious.

Don't want to seem overly critical though, I love the other changes. Merry Christmas to you and the rest of the dev team.