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APlayerInMC

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Mar 27, 2024
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Here, in today`s TT, we have witnessed our old friends back, Piety.
Yes, when you click the button, all the thousands of Assassins hidden in the mountains come out.
Why we can`t try more interesing things? Like opening alcohol import and export in low piety, or transmit Dhimmi pops into manpower via using piety?
PLZ, no mana again.
 
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I sympathize with what you're saying, but I don't think it is really like mana. Admin mana was some abstract currency representing the admin power and capacity of your country: that's real mana. Piety is a numerical, "sliding" indicator of a country's state like societal values and stability. It is still mana like in that it is a numerical abstraction of the country, but it represents the degree to which a country falls on some qualitative spectrum instead of just a number of "power points".

I do like your idea of it working more so by unlocking mechanics and interactions rather than spending it like a currency, but I think it's okay if it still acts like a currency sometimes.

Edit: Religious Influence is mana
 
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c5cf86bf6154850b660fee5c5047c58d.gif


The piety-meter is full, my lord!

We don't have an army anymore, let us pray for manpower, then!

the-surprising-power-of-prayer.jpg


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It worked! It was super effective!

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Our piety-meter is depleted, we need to wait until we'll be able to invoke a miracle again.
 
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pheonix_cruz said:
but I don't think it is really like mana
Click to expand...
You click the button to spend military points on the provincial development, then you exploit the province to get manpower.
So it's similar to what Piety do. In EU4 it's okay because there's no pops or buildings which pops working in to provide manpower. But it is EU5, a game that aims to avoid such thing like abstract points turns into concrete things, it is kind of unrealistic.
 
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Aquila SPQR said:
View attachment 1312681

The piety-meter is full, my lord!

We don't have an army anymore, let us pray for manpower, then!

View attachment 1312684

View attachment 1312685

View attachment 1312686

It worked! It was super effective!

View attachment 1312688

Our piety-meter is depleted, we need to wait until we'll be able to invoke a miracle again.
Click to expand...


While thats funny, I think its more immersive in terms of seeing it like: We can use our high level of society piety to move zealots and radicals to join the army to fight for Allah!

I think that was the thought process behind the abstraction rather than conjuring up armies with piety mana magic from God ahah
 
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Álvaro Núñez de Lara said:
While thats funny, I think its more immersive in terms of seeing it like: We can use our high level of society piety to move zealots and radicals to join the army to fight for Allah!

I think that was the thought process behind the abstraction rather than conjuring up armies with piety mana magic from God ahah
Click to expand...
But the manpower is generated out of nowhere
That's the problem
In EU5 you should buildings, let pops working in and consume goods to gain manpower. But for Islam countries they just pray and click the button.
 
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APlayerInMC said:
You click the button to spend military points on the provincial development, then you exploit the province to get manpower.
So it's similar to what Piety do. In EU4 it's okay because there's no pops or buildings which pops working in to provide manpower. But it is EU5, a game that aims to avoid such thing like abstract points turns into concrete things, it is kind of unrealistic.
Click to expand...
Yeah I forgot to address the manpower thing in my reply to this thread as well. I stand by piety in general and still don't think it's mana, but I also very much don't like being able to exchange piety for manpower that appears spontaneously. I would much prefer spending piety, at once or decreasing it over time, for something like a bonus to peasant to soldier conversion speed as opposed to manpower.
 
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Álvaro Núñez de Lara said:
While thats funny, I think its more immersive in terms of seeing it like: We can use our high level of society piety to move zealots and radicals to join the army to fight for Allah!

I think that was the thought process behind the abstraction rather than conjuring up armies with piety mana magic from God ahah
Click to expand...

Yeah, it can be rationalized somehow, but it still is a bit disappointing. Abstract "piety points" which can be exchanged for things like manpower and stability. And what "piety" is exactly? A measure how pious ruler is? State is? People are? And when you use that piety does it mean the state/ruler/people are now much less pious until piety-meter will rise again?

Stability - ok, fine. Though I'd prefer bonus to stability recovery if there's high piety ("we're pious, god watches over us, everything will be fine") instead of "spending piety to gain stability".

But manpower? Where exactly it comes from? You had 10 000 available recruits and now, after spending piety, you have 20 000? Why they didn't count as manpower earlier? Disabled people were miraculously cured?

Like with stability - I'd prefer some scalable bonus instead of an instant action costing "piety points". Just as high stability gives bonuses and low stability gives penalties - high piety would give some bonuses (to stability or even to monthly increase of manpower - "let's join the army and fight for pious cause") and low piety - penalties ("we've sinned, our state is cursed by god, there's no point in joining army of this sinful ruler").
 
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Aquila SPQR said:
View attachment 1312681

The piety-meter is full, my lord! ...
Click to expand...
This is so accurate and made me giggle in the office.

I agree with others here. This could be easily mitigated if the devs made the bonus a gradual increase in manpower/stability. Then it would feel less like instant magic and more like a long term institutional investment that sees results of convincing people over time.
 
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Aquila SPQR said:
But manpower? What exactly it comes from? You had 10 000 available recruits and now, after spending piety, you have 20 000? Why they didn't count as manpower earlier? Disabled people were miraculously cured?
Click to expand...
I think with manpower it makes sense. It represents people who would otherwise be inaccessible to the state for military purposes leaving their home/traditional societal role to volunteer for military service, because they've been convinced by their religious institutions to do so.

What doesn't make sense is the instant payoff. It takes time to organize/communicate a message. Then it takes time to convince people to drop everything, leave home, train/equip and go fight.
 
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PortDoubloon01 said:
I think with manpower it makes sense. It represents people who would otherwise be inaccessible to the state for military purposes leaving their home/traditional societal role to volunteer for military service, because they've been convinced by their religious institutions to do so.

What doesn't make sense is the instant payoff. It takes time to organize/communicate a message. Then it takes time to convince people to drop everything, leave home, train/equip and go fight.
Click to expand...

Yes, the instant reward for "payment" is the worst part of this (together with the idea of accumulating "piety points" which can be spent instantly). But that entire manpower thing also made me wonder...

Is "high piety" alone enough to convince masses to join the army? Shouldn't it be restricted to things like holy wars against heathens? If we're fighting against other followers of the same religion - why should we join the army if we're pious?
 
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Álvaro Núñez de Lara said:
While thats funny, I think its more immersive in terms of seeing it like: We can use our high level of society piety to move zealots and radicals to join the army to fight for Allah!

I think that was the thought process behind the abstraction rather than conjuring up armies with piety mana magic from God ahah
Click to expand...
Still bad designdecision IMO. I thought EU5 would get rid of those instant bonus buttons.
 
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It should be that clicking the button adds a modifier to the lands of non-frontier Muslim states which leaches 0.0001 of the pop or something that you then get over 3 months to represent Gazis leaving their lands to join you in your wars for Islam.
 
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