There is a lot of tags in this game. A great number of them are mere revolter tags so understandably they won't always see the light of the day, but there's another handful that most people will never get the chance to know simply because... they do not exist in the 1444 bookmark.
Do note, I'm not talking about choosing them in 1444 by releasing as vassal states or talking about revolters, but not having them ever appear. You know how Funj spawns in Africa without no one ever asking (and also Sulu in the Spice Islands)? Yeah, those tags don't even get that chance. They're relegated to mere filler in later starts. It's even weirder because most of these appear due to succession crises and whatnot, so they could simply be revolter tags for their "parent" tags, at least as a temporary solution until the devs have more time to dedicate to East Asia (pls revamp China ;-; ).
So here I'm going to list them and suggest courses of action for them to be added. I'm not going to post event/decision codes here nor unique NI sets, but that's not to say I'm not willing to, it's just that it's not the scope of this opening post (but could easily be discussed in the thread). Do note that I also have no idea about the devs' intent with them, much less which ones are EU3 leftovers, so maybe there might be reasons for them not existing in the 1444 bookmark.
The following states do not ever exist in the 1444 bookmark: Champassak, Luang Prabang, Muan Phuang, Vientiane, Demak, Blambangan, Mataram, Banten, Cirebon, Palembang, Aceh, Banjar, Maguindanao, Lanao, Habsan, Lanfang, Sharjah, Annam, Tonkin, Jalayirids, Doughlat, Khoshuud, Zunghar, Kokkand, Hausa, Yatenga, Segu, Aussa, Darfur, Geledi, Baroda, Nagpur, Deccan, Oudh, Parma, Meissen.
Champassak - CHK
Luang Prabang - LUA
Muan Phuang - MPH
Vientiane - VIE
Long-term: DHEs for succession disputes in the region.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for the four tags in 1444; also give them a decision for reinstating Lan Xang.
Demak - DMK
Blambangan - BLM
Mataram - MTR
Banten - BAN
Cirebon - CRB
Long-term: DHEs for the spread of Islam in the region, kinda like what we have now in Japan/China with the Jesuits.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for the two tags in 1444; also give them a decision for reinstating an Hindu Majapahit.
Palembang - PLB
Solution: Add it as a vassal of Majapahit in 1444, or at least as a free OPM nation.
Aceh - ATJ
Long-term: Redesign of the whole Sumatra island.
Short-term: Aceh as a hateful vassal of Pasai.
Banjar - BNJ
Solution: A Funj-like event to fire after Majapahit disappears and Demak/Mataram exist (or maybe simply if Kediri/Surabaya aren't owned by Majapahit anymore).
Maguindanao - MGD
Solution: A Funj-like event to fire if a Muslim Johor ever appears in Southeast Asia (or maybe after 1520 if there's any Muslim nation in SEA with more than one province).
Lanao - LNO
Easy solution: A Funj-like event to fire in Lanao if Maguindanao exists.
Elaborated solution: A one-time event to let Lanao spawn as a vassal of Maguindanao if they control the province after a certain date (maybe 1600).
Habsan - JAJ
Solution: A one-time event to let Habsan spawn as a vassal/march of Ahmednagar (or any country with Marathi as their primary culture) if they control the province after a certain date (possibly 1500).
Lanfang - LFA
Solution: A one-time event for Brunei (or any country with Bornean as their primary culture), if they control the province and there is an European province in the Indonesia region and they aren't allied or subjected to those Europeans, to release Lanfang as an independent state (or as a vassal under Qing/Ming/random Chinese state with Hakka as their primary culture), for a big opinion boost with Qing (or all Chinese states if Qing doesn't exist) and possibly some other temporary diplomatic boosts.
Sharjah - SHR
Long-term: Oman/Arabia needs to get more DHEs, but that's not the scope of this thread (as of now at least).
Short-term: Just add them to 1444 with unique NIs (also not the scope as of now) and to hell with it.
Annam - ANN
Tonkin - TOK
Long-term: DHEs for succession disputes in the region.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for both tags; also give them a decision for reuniting Dai Viet.
Jalayirids - JAI
Long-term: Purple Phoenix-like event chain for Mongolia.
Short-term: Just give back their cores in the Iraq/Persian region and watch if the AI does something.
Doughlat - DGL
Solution: I actually don't know, I'd prefer the tag existed in the area but maybe inactive cores would also work...
Khoshuud - KSD
Zunghar - ZUN
Long-term: Bukhara-like decisions for Oirat-culture countries, with unique NIs.
Short-term: Bukhara-like decisions for Oirat-culture countries, with horde NIs.
Kokkand - KOK
Long-term: DHE for a Kokand revolt in Bukhara.
Short-term: Give Kokand cores in Transoxiana region.
Hausa - HAU
Long-term: Hausa decision for Hausa-culture nations with unique NIs.
Short-term: Hausa decision for Hausa-culture nations.
Yatenga - YAT
Long-term: Add a Yatenga core in Yatenga; also add a decision for them to unify Mossi.
Short-term: Add a Yatenga core in Yatenga.
Segu - SOF
Solution: Add cores for Segu in Bambara-culture provinces.
Aussa - AFA
Solution: Give cores to Aussa in Adal. Possibly even divide the whole starting Adal territory between Aussa and Harar inactive cores.
Darfur - DAR
Solution: Funj-like event in empty provinces west of Funj (except for a single province so they don't get a border with Kanem/Yao).
Geledi - GLE
Long-term: DHE for a Geledi revolt in Ajuuraan if they ever start getting too weak (maybe losing a war and/or having high WE).
Short-term: Give Geledi cores in Afgooye province and its neighbour provinces.
Baroda - BDA
Nagpur - NAG
Deccan - DEC
Oudh - ODH
Long-term: DHE events for the fall of the Mughal Empire
Short-term: Meh, the AI never forms Mughals anyway, this can wait a bit more.
Parma - PAR
Meissen - MEI
If anyone else knows about any tag I might have ignored, please post. Any other suggestions are also welcome.
Do note, I'm not talking about choosing them in 1444 by releasing as vassal states or talking about revolters, but not having them ever appear. You know how Funj spawns in Africa without no one ever asking (and also Sulu in the Spice Islands)? Yeah, those tags don't even get that chance. They're relegated to mere filler in later starts. It's even weirder because most of these appear due to succession crises and whatnot, so they could simply be revolter tags for their "parent" tags, at least as a temporary solution until the devs have more time to dedicate to East Asia (pls revamp China ;-; ).
So here I'm going to list them and suggest courses of action for them to be added. I'm not going to post event/decision codes here nor unique NI sets, but that's not to say I'm not willing to, it's just that it's not the scope of this opening post (but could easily be discussed in the thread). Do note that I also have no idea about the devs' intent with them, much less which ones are EU3 leftovers, so maybe there might be reasons for them not existing in the 1444 bookmark.
The following states do not ever exist in the 1444 bookmark: Champassak, Luang Prabang, Muan Phuang, Vientiane, Demak, Blambangan, Mataram, Banten, Cirebon, Palembang, Aceh, Banjar, Maguindanao, Lanao, Habsan, Lanfang, Sharjah, Annam, Tonkin, Jalayirids, Doughlat, Khoshuud, Zunghar, Kokkand, Hausa, Yatenga, Segu, Aussa, Darfur, Geledi, Baroda, Nagpur, Deccan, Oudh, Parma, Meissen.
Champassak - CHK
Luang Prabang - LUA
Muan Phuang - MPH
Vientiane - VIE
These nations appear historically after Lan Xang explodes due to succession disputes by the early 1700s. Could be added as a special DHE which would probably be too specific work to dispend right now, but most likely could work by adding cores in Lan Xang territory. Unfortunately they'd all have Laotian culture so no chance to be kept forever, but 150 years might be a good enough time window. They could also have a decision for tag-changing back to Lan Xang once controlling Vientiane, Luang Prabang and Champasak.
Long-term: DHEs for succession disputes in the region.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for the four tags in 1444; also give them a decision for reinstating Lan Xang.
Demak - DMK
Blambangan - BLM
Mataram - MTR
Banten - BAN
Cirebon - CRB
Succession crises and the spread of Islam in Java/Sumatra led to Majapahit and Sunda's demise. Considering Bali also becomes independent once Majapahit falls and they already exist as a revolter tag in 1444, the same solution suggested for Lan Xang would work here. There could also be a decision for Demak, Blambangan, Bali and Mataram to change back to Majapahit (the tag would need to be Hindu, though, so three of them would need to convert).
Long-term: DHEs for the spread of Islam in the region, kinda like what we have now in Japan/China with the Jesuits.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for the two tags in 1444; also give them a decision for reinstating an Hindu Majapahit.
Palembang - PLB
It kinda has to do with the Islam spread... but they already existed before it. As a vassal of Majapahit, even. So I'm not sure why they don't even exist as a full-fledged tag in 1444.
Solution: Add it as a vassal of Majapahit in 1444, or at least as a free OPM nation.
Aceh - ATJ
Ehhhh this one is a bit awkward because Sumatra itself isn't perfectly pictured in-game (to begin with, was there even a Siak identity by then?) so whatever is done here wouldn't solve its problems. But still, Aceh should exist as an unruly vassal of Pasai (or at least with a gigantic Wants Your Provinces modifier) and claims to the whole nation. Anything else in Sumatra is 100% cannot be solved without an East Asia expansion hue.
Long-term: Redesign of the whole Sumatra island.
Short-term: Aceh as a hateful vassal of Pasai.
Banjar - BNJ
Appears after the destruction of Majapahit and consolidation of Demak (or Mataram). Would need an event for spawning in Banjar and Barito if the area is uncolonized, no two ways around it.
Solution: A Funj-like event to fire after Majapahit disappears and Demak/Mataram exist (or maybe simply if Kediri/Surabaya aren't owned by Majapahit anymore).
Maguindanao - MGD
Came to be after the area was converted to Islam by 1520. So, once again, a tag whose fate depends on the Islam spread in Southeast Asia. Its first ruler was a muslim from Johor, currently a revolter tag in Malacca; therefore, the spawning could depend on Johor existing as a Muslim nation.
Solution: A Funj-like event to fire if a Muslim Johor ever appears in Southeast Asia (or maybe after 1520 if there's any Muslim nation in SEA with more than one province).
Lanao - LNO
The Maguindanao sultan was the one responsible for setting a confederation of sultanates in Lanao. A revolter tag wouldn't make sense, so either the province should be uncolonized and then an event would make them spawn, or Maguindanao would spawn owning Lanao and then an one-time event would allow for Lanao to be released as a vassal.
Easy solution: A Funj-like event to fire in Lanao if Maguindanao exists.
Elaborated solution: A one-time event to let Lanao spawn as a vassal of Maguindanao if they control the province after a certain date (maybe 1600).
Habsan - JAJ
This one works kinda like Lanao. The difference is that the ruling family came from Ethiopia, so they're of Amhara culture (this could lead to some weird defections). Anyway, there could be an event to release Chaul as a vassal/march for Ahmednagar (or any country with Marathi as their primary culture) if they own it. The ruling family of Chaul/Janjira came to Ahmednagar by the end of 15th century, so the event could happen as soon as 1500.
By the way, I'm impressed they have unique NIs already.
By the way, I'm impressed they have unique NIs already.
Solution: A one-time event to let Habsan spawn as a vassal/march of Ahmednagar (or any country with Marathi as their primary culture) if they control the province after a certain date (possibly 1500).
Lanfang - LFA
This one is the most irrelevant tag because it only appears in 1789 as a Chinese OPM. Is this some old relic from EU3? They are interesting, anyway. Formed as a Republic to protect the local chinese laborers from the Dutch, voluntarily paid tribute to Qing, short-lived because Netherlands was too strong. They're too cool to be restricted to the second-to-last bookmark, East Asia could do with some mid-game merchant republics.
Solution: A one-time event for Brunei (or any country with Bornean as their primary culture), if they control the province and there is an European province in the Indonesia region and they aren't allied or subjected to those Europeans, to release Lanfang as an independent state (or as a vassal under Qing/Ming/random Chinese state with Hakka as their primary culture), for a big opinion boost with Qing (or all Chinese states if Qing doesn't exist) and possibly some other temporary diplomatic boosts.
Sharjah - SHR
This one is meant to represent the whole United Emirates area, isn't it? So shouldn't they have more... piracy-related NIs? Anyway. The region itself shouldn't be exactly controlled by Oman, there were too many tribes there, Portugal never seems to care about them in any of my games, and I've never seen Oman expanding into Africa like some later bookmarks show... it seems the region needs to be more fleshed out. I'd suggest simply adding Sharjah as a tribal (not horde) nation in the 1444 bookmark and leave them to their own fate. An AI Sharjah will most certainly be eaten by its neighbours, but the region kinda needs an overhaul anyway.
Long-term: Oman/Arabia needs to get more DHEs, but that's not the scope of this thread (as of now at least).
Short-term: Just add them to 1444 with unique NIs (also not the scope as of now) and to hell with it.
Annam - ANN
Tonkin - TOK
Tonkin and Annam appear in the 1579 bookmark representing the internal strife of Dai Viet, as most of it was controlled by the local lords due to a weak ruling dynasty. So, yet another succession crisis leading to a nation exploding. Lan Xang's solution would apply here.
Long-term: DHEs for succession disputes in the region.
Short-term: Add 150-year cores for both tags; also give them a decision for reuniting Dai Viet.
Jalayirids - JAI
They should have cores in Iraq and Western Persia by the game's start... but I'm not sure if that would make them a revolter tag, considering their primary culture is Mongol. Considering the other solution would be some incentive for Mongolia to conquer all the way down to Baghdad (maybe a Purple Phoenix-like chain of events), I think the first one could be done at least for now.
Long-term: Purple Phoenix-like event chain for Mongolia.
Short-term: Just give back their cores in the Iraq/Persian region and watch if the AI does something.
Doughlat - DGL
It's weird. They never spawn, they don't appear in any bookmarks, they have no cores. And yet the best course of action (releasing them as a vassal state of Yarkand/Chagatai) would make Yarkand/Chagatai even weaker. Then again, why making tags if they can't exist (unless they are a EU3 leftover...)?
Solution: I actually don't know, I'd prefer the tag existed in the area but maybe inactive cores would also work...
Khoshuud - KSD
Zunghar - ZUN
Shouldn't there be decisions for Oirat (or countries with Oirat culture) to change tag to those two? Vassalize any Tibetan theocracy, become Khoshuud and release Zungaria region as Zunghar (just like the Bukhara decision); Control Tarim Basin, become Zunghar and release Tibet region as Khoshuud. Both could simply have Horde ideas, but I feel they'd deserve unique NIs.
By the way, I thought Bukhara kept its Horde NIs? The later starts give it generic ones. What a waste of time...
By the way, I thought Bukhara kept its Horde NIs? The later starts give it generic ones. What a waste of time...
Long-term: Bukhara-like decisions for Oirat-culture countries, with unique NIs.
Short-term: Bukhara-like decisions for Oirat-culture countries, with horde NIs.
Kokkand - KOK
Revolter state within Bukhara. Not exactly a problem per se, it could be "solved" right now by giving cores. It could be weird, though, considering Bukhara doesn't exist in 1444. But as of now, we have weirder things going on(Ming explosions, Sumatra, primitives without boats...).
Long-term: DHE for a Kokand revolt in Bukhara.
Short-term: Give Kokand cores in Transoxiana region.
Hausa - HAU
This is the easiest one. Just let the Hausa states unify under a Hausa tag. Or is there a decision for that already? I haven't found it. And why is Bonny set as Hausa's capital in the game's files, if it's an uncolonized province east of Benin, of all places?
Long-term: Hausa decision for Hausa-culture nations with unique NIs.
Short-term: Hausa decision for Hausa-culture nations.
Yatenga - YAT
Talk about a useless tag. Sorry, but I can't see why they should exist, considering the other Mossi ones don't. Deleting tags doesn't seem a good plan, so... just let them be a revolter tag in Yatenga province.
Long-term: Add a Yatenga core in Yatenga; also add a decision for them to unify Mossi.
Short-term: Add a Yatenga core in Yatenga.
Segu - SOF
Primary tag of the Bambara culture. Their history files give them Mali as primary culture, though. Not sure if it's WAD, maybe I'm missing something. It seems to me they could simply be a revolter tag in Macina territory. Well technically they are already, but with no cores.
Solution: Add cores for Segu in Bambara-culture provinces.
Aussa - AFA
Both Aussa and Harar came to be after Adal's fall from grace. Harar already has cores in Adal, so why not Aussa?
Solution: Give cores to Aussa in Adal. Possibly even divide the whole starting Adal territory between Aussa and Harar inactive cores.
Darfur - DAR
Isn't this one pretty much Funj 2.0? Just let they spawn like them.
Solution: Funj-like event in empty provinces west of Funj (except for a single province so they don't get a border with Kanem/Yao).
Geledi - GLE
Brought to life with Ajuuraan's demise. So yet another country that could get special DHEs for appearing but could make do with inactive cores in 1444.
Long-term: DHE for a Geledi revolt in Ajuuraan if they ever start getting too weak (maybe losing a war and/or having high WE).
Short-term: Give Geledi cores in Afgooye province and its neighbour provinces.
Baroda - BDA
Nagpur - NAG
Deccan - DEC
Oudh - ODH
Appear historically after the fall of Mughals. A DHE (or even a chain) would be needed, more or less so like the Timurid one with the Mughal revolt. I don't think this one can be easily solved Short-term:, so I'm only listing here for reference.
Long-term: DHE events for the fall of the Mughal Empire
Short-term: Meh, the AI never forms Mughals anyway, this can wait a bit more.
Parma - PAR
Meissen - MEI
Lol Europe. Not even going to bother until I play Common Sense.
If anyone else knows about any tag I might have ignored, please post. Any other suggestions are also welcome.
Last edited:
- 6
- 1
Upvote
0
