Can we further subdivide brigades?

[AlexLifeson]

Historical OOB included things like companies and battalions. Just like we use brigades to form divisions, can we use companies and battalions to form brigades?

Multiple companies = battalion
Multiple battalion = brigade
Multiple brigades = divs

and the ability to mix and match without merging. ie...

One div could be

3inf brigade
1at brigade
1art brigade
1 eng batallion
2 medical companies

 

[Opus]

I've might have misunderstood this, but afaik, even brigades will be gone, so no.

 

[sgt.stickybomb]

it would be a nice addition but it is unnecessary imo.

 

[franc001sher]

I've might have misunderstood this, but afaik, even brigades will be gone, so no.

Brigades will be gone?

 

[Forster]

Brigades will be gone?

I hope not.

 

[Charles Reeps]

I suggest looking at this. This is a great example of how to implement WWII division builds.

 

[franc001sher]

But the regiments should have its independence like what it is in HOI3. And the transfer of regiments among divisions is also important.

 

[Charles Reeps]

But the regiments should have its independence like what it is in HOI3.

Since IMO HOI3 should have used regiments for a proper structure, yes. I must say I really wouldn't like that level of micro.

 

[Bullfrog]

I could do without brigades. Their depiction in HoI3 is rather unrealistic. What they clearly represent is regiments and support battalions, which together make up divisions. Unfortunately in reality they are sort of a cross between a couple regiments and a division. They are usually independent combat units. In WW2, some divisions were indeed made up of brigades, but this was largely a pre war configuration that was phased out.

In HoI4, if they remain, simply stop calling them brigades and treat them as they are, which is clearly the regimental and battalion building blocks of a WW2 division. And let's create realistic divisions. Look up any TOE from the war and you'll see it is totally reproducible with the existing "brigades."

The most common division would be:

3 INF regiments
1 ART regiment
1 AT battalion
1 Eng battalion

This is totally doable with the existing system, it just needs stat rebalancing.

 

[Charles Reeps]

Bullfrog, you are correct on all points, but if you used the structure as is then the divisions were overpowered. The infantry "brigades" were supposed to contain the support units you listed, as evidenced by the tech research.

 

[EntropyAvatar]

The fact that you build individual vehicles suggests that things will be represented at a fairly fine level in the engine. It would be strange if the game tracked individual heavy tanks or AT guns but then forced you to always deploy them in brigade-sized chunks.

 

[franc001sher]

The tactical regiment-size deployment was very common in the realistic history although the micro management in this level is not common in game.
Especially for some expensive weapons like heavy tanks and artilleries, they are often deployed by regiment or battalions and not only used as corps-level assets.

 

[Bullfrog]

Bullfrog, you are correct on all points, but if you used the structure as is then the divisions were overpowered. The infantry "brigades" were supposed to contain the support units you listed, as evidenced by the tech research.

Right, the unit stats would need rebalancing. As for the infantry techs, specifically AT and light artillery, they could be broken up into the artillery tech tree, where they belong, to avoid any redundancy, perceived or not.

The fact that you build individual vehicles suggests that things will be represented at a fairly fine level in the engine. It would be strange if the game tracked individual heavy tanks or AT guns but then forced you to always deploy them in brigade-sized chunks.

Let's hope.

The tactical regiment-size deployment was very common in the realistic history although the micro management in this level is not common in game.
Especially for some expensive weapons like heavy tanks and artilleries, they are often deployed by regiment or battalions and not only used as corps-level assets.

The tank battalions in history were attached and reassigned to divisions or "independent" based on the needs of a particular battlefield circumstance. In HoI4, I'd like to see heavy tanks (for example) in small units that for all intents and purposes mimic the HoI2 brigade, essentially just a buff to the division that could be reassigned with the HoI3 style OOB reorg feature. And that would be the extent of the "Brigade" in HoI4. Though I'd love to drop the term entirely.

 

[AlexLifeson]

I suggest looking at this. This is a great example of how to implement WWII division builds.

yes, this is awesome!