Confirmed CK III - HUGE FPS loss hovering over impassable terrain with an army.

[lunelune2413]

Short summary of your issue
HUGE FPS loss hovering over impassable terrain with an army.

Game Version
1.3

What OS are you playing on?
Windows

What platform are you using?
Steam

Do you have mods enabled?
No

Have you tried verifying your game files (Steam only)?
No

How much "pain" is this causing you?
7

Please explain the issue you experienced in the most condensed way possible
So I noticed that my rather beefy Ryzen 5800x and 3090 was struggling a lot during wars in areas with impassable terrain (Hitting 50-70 fps), so I did some research. When I selected my armies and hovered over impassable terrain, I experienced some moderate lag and it quickly went up again after my mouse moved away from the impassable terrain.

I restarted my game and closed everything in the background, but instead of gaining FPS I actually lost a little bit.

Also found out that army size doesn't matter, but how many armies you have selected.

In the images I have 2 images that shows how much FPS I lose by just selecting the army and hovering over impassable terrain with nothing else going on.

Please explain how to reproduce the issue
Raise your troops and hover over any impassable terrain with them selected and watch the fps counter.

Is there anything else you think could help us identify/replicate the issue?
Use multiple pc's since it appears that some pcs don't experience this issue at all.

My theory is that its the AI pathfinding of your army trying to calculate the best route for your army, but since its impassable terrain all it does is use too many resources.

I have attached a save game
No

Upload Attachment
File(s) attached

 

[Hanekin]

I have the same issue. From my experience it happens when you have units selected and hover over an impassible terrain and that for some reason artificially limits your framerates to 70 or so. I recorded it happening here

can you test and see if that's exactly the case for you?

 

[lunelune2413]

I have the same issue. From my experience it happens when you have units selected and hover over an impassible terrain and that for some reason artificially limits your framerates to 70 or so. I recorded it happening here

can you test and see if that's exactly the case for you?

I just tried it myself and found out the FPS loss is actually exactly because of that. I expierienced it and thought that it was just an issue with the army in general. It would appear that the FPS loss is only when you hover over impassable terrain.

So yes, this is the exact same issue that you're experiencing :/

 

[Earl Obelus of Brittany]

Hi there @lunelune2413,

thanks a lot for your report! Could you please send us your full hardware specification?
Have you also tried reinstalling the game and the Paradox Launcher? Please also check if you have the latest graphic drivers as that could affect the FPS as well.

Please provide further info and if nothing will change after those steps I will report the bug to our database, so our team would try to find a fix for it.

Cheers!

 

[Little Ian]

@lunelune2413 I am gonna upvote and say I've experienced the same thing - Also both of the above examples are in Africa. I have noticed that the 'desert sand' map shader/overlay seems like it makes the issue that both you and @Benckis have referenced more severe. To clarify, I have experienced the issue that you are describing as well (globally), but it seems to occur with greater severity in African or Middle Eastern areas with that desert sand effect. Interestingly, the new winter/snow overlays don't seem to cause the same interaction.

 

[Hanekin]

Hi there @lunelune2413,

thanks a lot for your report! Could you please send us your full hardware specification?
Have you also tried reinstalling the game and the Paradox Launcher? Please also check if you have the latest graphic drivers as that could affect the FPS as well.

Please provide further info and if nothing will change after those steps I will report the bug to our database, so our team would try to find a fix for it.

Cheers!

Since I also have the issue I will chime in to provide my specs too since it will help to solve the issue hopefully.

I have had this issue since September as I also have made a bug report thread back then, since then I've went through multiple drivers and even windows reinstalls so obviously I've reinstalled the game multiple times by now.

Specs:

GPU: GTX 1070 driver version 461.92
CPU: I7-7700
RAM: 2x8GB DDR4 2400 mhz
Game installed on SSD
Windows 10 version 20H2 build 19042.867

I can provide more detailed information if needs be.

Issue is very easy to reproduce, to reiterate if you hover over an impassable terrain while having an army selected you will see a sharp decrease in fps.

I assume everyone has this issue but it's not noticeable if you have 60Hz monitor since you can't actually feel the difference unless you play with frame counter but most people do not.

 

[Little Ian]

I have nearly the identical configuration described by @Benckis

GPU: GTX 1070, driver v461.92
CPI i7-6700
RAM 2x16GB DDR4 2400mhz
Game installed on M.2 SSD
Windows version 19042.867

 

[lunelune2413]

Hi there @lunelune2413,

thanks a lot for your report! Could you please send us your full hardware specification?
Have you also tried reinstalling the game and the Paradox Launcher? Please also check if you have the latest graphic drivers as that could affect the FPS as well.

Please provide further info and if nothing will change after those steps I will report the bug to our database, so our team would try to find a fix for it.

Cheers!

Hello there @Earl Obelus of Brittany

First I would like to say thank you for seeing my post.

My full Hardware specifications are the following:
CPU: AMD Ryzen 7 5800x
GPU: MSI 3090 Suprim x (Manually Undervolted. Have tried playing the game without undervolt and the issue persists)
RAM: 32gb 3600HZ dual channel.
Motherboard: Asus x570 TUF PLUS (WI-FI)
PSU: Corsair RM750.
SSD: Intel m.2 665p NVME (Where the game is installed)
HDD: Seagate Barracuda 7200 RPM 3.5 HDD.

I have tried to install it onto my HDD and reinstall it afterwards to my SSD, which sadly did nothing to fix the issue. I also have the latest RTX driver installed (They released a patch I think around a week ago and that sadly didn't fix my FPS issues).

I also tried to test it if it was exclusively an issue for 1.3.0. Which turned out that it isn't and it's actually it's something that's been there in previous versions too. Nobody has just seemingly reported this massive issue or it's been overlooked either by players or forum mods (Mistakes do sadly happen from time to time)

Like others have said and I realized after my initial post. This issue only happens when you specifically hover over ANY impassable terrain with a selected army. That is where it starts going down very rapidly and stays there until your mouse goes away from the impassable terrain and it starts going rapidly up again. Even if your mouse just glances over the impassable terrain the FPS will instantlly drop and go back up again.
Another issue with this is that the FPS actually gets worse the more armies you have selected. For example if for me personally if I just control 1 massive army it's usually at an annoying, but playable 50-70. Yet as soon as I split the army into two seperate armies and hover over the same impassable terrain with them both selected, it goes to a downright unplayable 40. If you repeat splitting your army, your FPS will actually get worse and that is even if your army is overall smaller than it was before.

I also tried to see if it was perhaps an issue with my settings, so I changed my game from high to low settings, which sadly did nothing to fix this issue and had at best increased my FPS by 1-2 frames.
Next I tried to see if it was because of my resolution being set to 1440p and when I changed it to 1920x1080 and only saw a 5-10 FPS difference. A difference that is really small when considering how much power 2560x1440 is supposed to take compared to 1920x1080.

This is obviously a huge issue for any person playing in or around an area like the Sahara where there is lots of impassable terrain or huge overhaul mods (Like the future Elder Kings 2 or Godherja) where parts of the map is filled with impassable terrain for strategic/Lore reasons. An issue that sadly affects the enjoyment of this overall awesome game in a very negative way.

A piece of advice for the team that's gonna look into this. Perhaps you can tell them to use computers with different Intel and AMD processors when they try to replicate this.

I really hope you guys find the root of this huge optimization issue. It does appear that I'm not the only one suffering from this, and it doesn't appear to be an AMD exclusive issue either.

My own theory is that this is caused by the AI pathfinding of your armies not being able to find a proper way into impassable terrain, so it uses WAY too much in terms of resources to figure this problem out, which leads to a massively lowered FPS. Hopefully this is the issue and you guys can find a solution for this rather quickly.

Do tell if you need any more info if the team needs it when they're gonna work on fixing this and I'll happily help you guys out in whatever way I can

P.S. If you don't mind. Please reply to my message (Or react to it if that's faster) so that I can see you've read it. I've sadly experienced bug reports having been asked to elaborate further and once they were given this additional info, it was never acknowledged (And sometimes not even fixed). So I just want to be sure that my bug report has been logged into your system (Hopefully as a high priority issue too) and that it will be worked on alongside either 1.3.2 or 1.4.0

 

[Little Ian]

I also want to second the observation that this issue predates 1.3 update, I noticed it on 1.2.2 at least. @lunelune2413 I hadn't realized this was directly related to hovering over impassable terrain; I always encountered it in desert regions and attributed it to the sand shader but it sounds like youve investigated this more thoroughly than i have and I bet youre right. you just find a bunch of impassable terrain in the same places (deserts) you find the sand.

 

[Hanekin]

I also want to second the observation that this issue predates 1.3 update, I noticed it on 1.2.2 at least. @lunelune2413 I hadn't realized this was directly related to hovering over impassable terrain; I always encountered it in desert regions and attributed it to the sand shader but it sounds like youve investigated this more thoroughly than i have and I bet youre right. you just find a bunch of impassable terrain in the same places (deserts) you find the sand.

I had reported this bug back in September just after the game released in this thread https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ur-cursor-over-an-impassible-terrain.1429251/ , received no reply then. I'm glad it's getting attention again now and hopefully they can fix it once and for all.

 

[lunelune2413]

I also want to second the observation that this issue predates 1.3 update, I noticed it on 1.2.2 at least. @lunelune2413 I hadn't realized this was directly related to hovering over impassable terrain; I always encountered it in desert regions and attributed it to the sand shader but it sounds like youve investigated this more thoroughly than i have and I bet youre right. you just find a bunch of impassable terrain in the same places (deserts) you find the sand.

I first thought it was because of the impassable terrain being so massive. Until I was playing Godherja one day and as soon as I hovered over a simple small mountain during a war that I noticed that my FPS went from a relatively smooth 90-144 FPS (The mod is already stretching the engine to it's limits. So dips to maybe even 80 on my specs is not uncommon) it went to a downright unplayable 40ish FPS. I then tried to replicate this without Godherja and noticed that even small lakes or impassable mountains would cause my FPS to go to the 70's without anything going on. Naturally most people won't notice this because the mountains and lakes are so small that it just at worst it will just feel like a small stutter since their mouse never actually stays on the lake/mountain and thus most people will just shrug it off as that and continue playing.

This is why I also see it as a major issue that ABSOLUTELY needs to be fixed since it doesn't matter what size the impassable terrain.

My theory (Which I just edited into my post) is that it's the army trying to find a route into the impassable terrain, which causes the engine to use a lot of resources

I had reported this bug back in September just after the game released in this thread https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ur-cursor-over-an-impassible-terrain.1429251/ , received no reply then. I'm glad it's getting attention again now and hopefully they can fixed it once and for all.

If it's not fixed by 1.4.0 I'll be sure to repost this and from then on in each patch they release until it's fixed.
This is a major bug that's affecting multiple people. I even tried to post it on the main forums, but it was ignored by pretty much everyone and when I rewrote the entire thing and tried to bump it 12 hours later, the bump was deleted due to how new the thread was. I believe this is a major issue for everyone since even if they play on a 60hz monitor, the FPS still goes to around 50 and below once you got a split up your army or the game is running at a speed of 3-4 while fighting in those regions.

 

[Earl Obelus of Brittany]

Hi again!

We're sorry to hear that you're experiencing those difficulties. Thanks a lot for all of your feedback, it will be really helpful when working on this case!
I reported this bug in our database and our team will work on it.

 

[lunelune2413]

Hi again!

We're sorry to hear that you're experiencing those difficulties. Thanks a lot for all of your feedback, it will be really helpful when working on this case!
I reported this bug in our database and our team will work on it.

Awesome! I also changed my original post to be more precise on the issue