Early medieval christianity?

[Gaen]

With the new religious system what variations would we expect to find in an early start like priest in certain regions not practicing celibacy?

 

[Patriarch of Bub]

That might be, but usually in game "priests" are bishops, whom were celibate.

 

[Mackus]

There were at least two popes within game's timeframe who were married (Adrian II and John XVII).
Several bishops in Iceland were married, some were even succeeded by their sons.
And those are the ones I've found in less than one minute, with zero effort.

Considering that:
- rules regarding celibacy were often ignored by bishops.
- some churches didn't ever practice it, Assyrian Church of East for example.
- Gregorian reforms took place after 1066 startdate.
I'd say that abolishing clerical celibacy should be among easiest religion reforms for player to push, and one among few that even AI would pursue with semi-regularity.

 

[Khelder]

The enforcement of celibacy on priests is quite recent thing as long as I know until high middle ages it was common place for Catholic priests marry.

The rules were in place earlier,since 11th centurey as far as I know but weren´t enforced succesfully. Up to 15th century about half the priests were married, and then the reformation hit after 4 centuries of trying to enforce celibacy. Maybe there was some link there? As Protestant priests were then again allowed to marry.

 

[Patriarch of Bub]

There were at least two popes within game's timeframe who were married (Adrian II and John XVII).
Several bishops in Iceland were married, some were even succeeded by their sons.
And those are the ones I've found in less than one minute, with zero effort.

Considering that:
- rules regarding celibacy were often ignored by bishops.
- some churches didn't ever practice it, Assyrian Church of East for example.
- Gregorian reforms took place after 1066 startdate.
I'd say that abolishing clerical celibacy should be among easiest religion reforms for player to push, and one among few that even AI would pursue with semi-regularity.

I was wrong in making such a generic statement about the whole of Christianity for such a long time span.

Could this lead the way to dynastic /playable theocracies

 

[Gaen]

Celibacy the obvious example, point was if people know of any other?

 

[treb]

Celibacy the obvious example, point was if people know of any other?

Tonsure and Easter date calucations played a large part in the differences of insular Christianity also Catholicisms form of monasticism was and adopted from the insular traditions. Though it predates the game it does show how local traditional Christianity could effect the the doctrine of the church itself.

 

[wtrmute]

There were at least two popes within game's timeframe who were married (Adrian II and John XVII).
Several bishops in Iceland were married, some were even succeeded by their sons.
And those are the ones I've found in less than one minute, with zero effort.

Considering that:
- rules regarding celibacy were often ignored by bishops.
- some churches didn't ever practice it, Assyrian Church of East for example.
- Gregorian reforms took place after 1066 startdate.
I'd say that abolishing clerical celibacy should be among easiest religion reforms for player to push, and one among few that even AI would pursue with semi-regularity.

https://catholicherald.co.uk/issues/august-19th-2016/the-true-history-of-celibacy/

While it is the case that some priests flouted the ancient custom of the Church — and here i mean not to practice continence if they were, in fact, married before being ordained to major orders — it was the case that the Councils and the Patriarchs have always held the ideal of continence, particularly for the Princes of the Church (i.e., the Bishops). That said, if you had a bishop who was married and had children, they would probably be better treated by some mechanic like "bad priests" in CK2, rather than treating it as some ahystorical norm.

Later, of course, you can go and use the heresy mechanics to force Catholicism or Orthodoxy into an early Reformation-style relaxation of celibacy for priests, but it should definitely not be treated as the "standard" in the early Church; rather, for the early Church, even if you could place a married man into a diocese, that would mean something functionally equivalent to a divorce, so you still couldn't have a (Christian) theocratic dynasty.

 

[Mackus]

even if you could place a married man into a diocese, that would mean something functionally equivalent to a divorce, so you still couldn't have a (Christian) theocratic dynasty.

Patriarchate of the East was at several points hereditary from father to son.

 

[treb]

Prehaps the better way to resolve the issue it to have a number of doctrines for the matter of marriage and succession


succession
Secular-subject to realms succession laws. only applicable if marriage is allowed.
State appointed
Church appointed
Church elected

Marriage
allowed
incest-option for Xwedodah religions
not allowed

its not a perfect solution but it gives the flexibility to allow for patriarch of the east type situation