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unmerged(74599)

Nexus 6
Apr 17, 2007
4.391
6
Download the patch, here: EIR -- HAGS0608 Create a new copy of Aramgeddon 1.2, and the paste the patch into the "Doomsday Folder", then open the zip file by "extract here".

DO NOT EXTRACT IN YOUR ORIGINAL DOOMSDAY FOLDER.


Reworking the air combat system:

The two main changes are a reduction of the range of Naval Bomber to make their role more realistic, and to make the surface naval fleets more important, and the removal of the fighter unit altogether because in reality what are called "fighters" in the original game, are merely "Interceptors" on long range missions. This can be seen in the air-tech tree, where the difference between an ME-109 fighter wing, and an ME 109 Interceptor wing, is really the difference of a model, and the addition of a drop tank.

No longer will England be able to easily win air superiority over Germany in 1941/42.

Fighters: The fact is that one of the primary reasons that fighters are an absolute necessity in the game for both the Japanese and the US is because of the fact that they can be used to counter the long distance power of the overcharged Navs that exist in the game as it is now. Eliminating this distortion, eliminates much of the game play needs of having the unrealistic ranges of early single engine propeller aircraft. It is highly unrealistic that the air space over Germany is contested strongly by the Allies until at least 1943. So, we can have a steady increase in range for interceptor/fighters over the stretch of the war, if we do not have the long range Navs.

Doctrine: The basic approach I have taken with naval warfare, is one which shortens the range of the Navs (whatever they are equipped with) and to reduce Naval Attack statistics overal for Strats and Tacs, which are then enhanced by researching Naval Doctrines. These Doctrines would be of little interest to the Germans and the Russians for obvious reasons, so they can dispense with them, but for the naval powers, researching the basic plane types, and then the doctrines will slowly enhance their anti-naval hitting power over time.

Aircraft: Research the equpiment, and then the complimentary doctrine to apply the technology. A player can also build shorter range Navs if they like, which only get to their 1938 range of effective operations starting in 1943. I make apoint of saying "effective" operational range, because I think we have to recognize that patroling is a fundamental aspect of this kind of warfare, quite unlike attacking land targets, where you just fly to where you want to go, and then drop your load. So, its reasonable to shorten the "effective" range of Nav's because they have to do a fair amount of hunting, but close to shore they should pack a good punch.

tech4aa2.png
interceptorsminibk5.png


These Doctrines will increase the power of long range Strats and Tacs, so that they can take over more of the burden of long distance deep water scouting, while the more limited Navs will have more punch, they will have less range.



Torpedo Bomber Concept for early short range land based air Naval war:


navalrangessmallmu6.png



Changelog:New with version HAGS

Marines:

Amphibious Assault efficiency for marines I reduced by 5%

Infantry:

All Infantry speeds reduced to vanilla settings

Armour/Lt. Armour/Mech:

Morale dropped by 10 (lt. armour by 5)
Defensiveness dropped by 5
Toughness dropped by 5

Naval surface ships:

Visibility of all surface ship decreased by 20

Events:

Poland enters alliance with England at war, and not before

Canada gets a manpower surge for voting for war

Terrain effects:

Infantry efficiency when attacking against rivers increased
Motorized efficiency when attacking over river increased
Armour efficiency when attacking into forts decreased
Armoured movement in forests reduced by 20%
Cavalry no longer defecient in desert

Air Combat:

Infrastructure damage due to bombing reduced by 50%

Aircraft:

Naval Bombers range generally reduced
Fighter type removed.
Interceptors increase in range by generations.
Rockets get their own model tree, and do not evolve into interceptors
Most Org/Morale bonuses for Navs moved from Tactical Tech Tree to the new Naval bomber Tech Tree
New Tech tree for Naval bombers added with four new techs


Perhaps the first example I showed was not the best, but it was intended to show that Japan can have effective control of the hornets nest of Islands defined by the Guam, Truk Kwalejin triangle, but not dominate the deep Pacific sea zones.

comparativenavalrangesrx1.png

This example, at Kwalejin, actually shows that Navs operating out of the Japanese Marshall Islands, can not do effective operations all the way out to Midway and PH, even in 1943, where in vanilla they can stirke all the way to PH in 1941. Adjusted this way Japan must capture Wake, to make them effective on the approaches to PH. So Island hoping to increase ranges of air operations is a must, not merely optional.

navalrangessaigonxz5.png

Here, for example, the 1940 model Nav has effective range up to the Spratley Sea, but not to the coast of the Phillipines. That would not come for air operating from Saigon until the 1943 model is researched and in operation, with pre-teching that would mean late 1942 at the earliest.

Discussions going on here: EIR HAGS discussion at Lord Ederon's
 
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This looks very interresting.

If i understand it correctly, in effect you have the Vanilla combined long range Naval patrol bomber + Short ranged Naval dive/torpedo bomber split of into the short ranged Dive/torpedo bomber as the Naval bomber and then you have the tac/strat bombers simulating the Long Range Naval Patrol Aircrafts.

One thing though, about the short ranged fighters/interceptors have you controlled that they actually are able to take of from all islands in the pacific.
Some of these Islands has pretty long range req. to get to the nearest seaarea ?
 
Well, as far as the interceptors go, no. At least not the early models. Once they get up to level IV they should. And, that is pretty historical. For example, the small squadron at Wake only did local area patrol around the Island while it was being invaded by the Japanese.
 
Hosts and anyone wanting to run this game through Danzig will need to DL and unzip the "HAGSdanzigpatch2" file in the Doomsday folder in order to replace the corrected events files. The trigger for the Danzig event is incorrect.
 
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There has often been discussion about how the Danzig war date is too rigid, and skews game play because it allows all players, especially the Soviet and Allied players the opportunity to prepare for a specific schedule of events, and give the Axis little strategic lattitude. Good arguement for sure, however, it is hard to know how to balance the game outside of this simple rule.

Moreso, it's Hitler's 1938/39 diplomatic offensive (Anschlaus, Munich and the Fall of Czech repulic) that are essential to the German strategic hopes overall, so there are problems in allowing for an early German DOW.

I have put some thoughts into this and hit upon a system that might work, with a little tweaking. Rather than having the main events for Hitler's Diplomatic Offensive tied to their historical date, it might be possible to actually have the German player have some control over triggering the events.

1) Anschlaus with Austria: Anschlaus could occur at the point where Germany has spent enough time influencing Austria that he is in a position to ally it. When he actually gets Austria to ally with Germany the Anschlaus event fires. This would simulate the Nazi coup in Austria.

2) Munich: When the Anschlaus event fires Germany immediatly gets the core provinces for Sudentenland. When the German army outnumbers the Czech army by a margin of 2 to 1, then there is an AI switch for Czechoslovakia that makes it far more suceptible to "Demand Claims". Germany must continue to Demand Claims from Czecholslovakia, until the time that they give in. When Germany owns these provinces the Munich event will fire.

3) Fall of Czech Republic: As part of the Munich agreement, Germany gets the main Czech cores, and again needs to demand them and get them in order to get the Fall of Czech Republic event to fire.

4) Molotov/Ribbentrop will be keyed to fire within the 6 month period after both the Fall of Czechoslovakia and Anschlaus have fired. The German NAP with Poland will then expire, and Germany can DOW Poland or the Allies as it likes.

Basically, if Germany wants to rush the war, they can spend a lot of money influencing and demanding, while they can prolong the lead up to the war, simply by refusing to make the necessary demands. Either way, no side could predict precisely what period the war would begin.

Possibly the conditions could be set so that the war could start between August 1938 and August 1940.
 
1) The start chance to ally Austria are 46% percent in vanilla so if you do this you should change Austria's Neutrality or reduce relations.

Instead you could tie the Anschluss to Germany's overall military capacity.
Both towards Austria but also towards the Allies, to scare them off from intervening Germany need some minimum lvl of Military force. Making it a percentage of france's Army would be nice but very exploitative.

A French player could mass produce Military and thereby preventing Anschluss. This could be countered by events that makes the French people go berserk if France starts to heavy rearmament in 1936-1938 or something. Another possibility would be to remove French manpower and give it back when Germany get Anschluss.

If Germany wants to rush the war, it would make more sense imo to have it tied to relative heavy rearmament than to influencing.
 
Those are good ideas about the Anschlaus thing. The Czech thing works pretty well. I have tested it a fair amount now. But I am far less secure about the Anschlaus thing overall.

Its interesting though, even if, in the case proposed above considering relative military power. If France massed armies to prevent Anschlaus, would that actually work to their favour in the long run, since they would like have to build dated units as opposed to nice new 39 infantry for the war.

Just a thought.

Of course the reason I don't want to just tie Anschlaus into a territorial demand like Czechslovakia, is beczue Germany inherits all those armies, though I suppose that could be fixed somehow.
 
I have finished up with the prototype of the floating Danzig date, and it works more or less on the principles I discussed with Sherman, Gormadoc, Fernando Durruti and others, (thanks for the help) except that the "Diplomatic Offensive" event is triggered by the rapid expansion of the German army.

After the point where Germany has raised enough divisions that the critical mass of power begins to shift in comparison to the UK and France (not Czechoslovakia as I originally proposed), the German player will get the first of two "diplomatic offensive" events, which will trigger in its turn an event for the UK's response. The options for UK increase the higher its interventionism, and if it is at 6 interventionism or above it will have the option to ally Czechoslovakia, which will cost it a fair chunk of dissent. If it's interventionism is low, then it will only have the "Peace in Our Times" option, where the UK ends its guarantee on CZE.

The more aggressive Allied options cause more dissent. And as I said, some are not available at all if the UK's interventionism slider is not 6 or more. If UK wants to spend his free slider moves getting to this point, in an effort to screw up Germany, I suggest this would be a dubious tactic, but one that has yet to be tested.

Stalin also gets a response if the UK declines to be forceful and goes with "Peace in Our Times" but will suffer severely should he act on it, and the M/R pact will be made inoperative. Special note: Poland will not be drawn into the Allies should Germany strike west first and not east, if M/R has not be agreed to. Should either the UK or the USSR continue to guarantee the Independence of CZE, there is still a fair chance that the German demand will succeed eventually, however, these guarantees should slow the process down and make it cost more for the Germans to get the Munich event to fire by demand. But they should be able to do it – Demand! Demand! Demand!

In any case, the intended rule is that Germany will be able to DOW any allied country that it does not have a NAP with after the "Diplomatic Offensive" event fires, and the British (or Russians make their response). Germany's NAP with Czech will end with the first "Diplomatic Offensive" event.

Another process will take place. After more German build up another "Diplomatic Offensive" event will happen, giving Germany more of the Czech cores, and eventually it will be able to demand the rest of CZE, and it should fall. Note that the FOC event will fire, if Germany invades CZE and captures these cores, as well. At this point Germany will lose its NAP with Poland.

Molotov Ribbentrop will have a 10% chance of firing every month after the FOC event, regardless if Germany has invaded Poland or not.

The main game dynamic that has been set up here is one of an arms race (credible threat) between the Allies and Germany. Essentially I have tried to set it up so that this event train can be followed roughly in a historical path, if Germany commits itself to 2 runs of IC, before expanding its army, (I tested this against an “ai” build -- only). Germany could push the event train, by limiting itself to one run of IC, and then producing units, with the obvious long term drawback associated with that. Likewise Germany could draw out the pre-war period by going for a longer IC build and building units later and trying to force the situation in central Europe later -- I am hoping that this would be about 1940 or so -- Goering's delay.

It is an arms race: It's important to note that Allies can affect this process as well, not just by their reactions to the German "Diplomatic Offensive" events but also by building armies sooner. Early expansion of Allied forces will also delay Germany getting the critical mass of power it needs to make the "Diplomatic Offensive" events fire. That said, they have to be careful here, since early production is expensive, and if Germany is following the long path with a three IC run, then there could be serious trouble.

Note: though I have worked out a schedule for the cancellation of the Soviet/German NAP, I have not fully integrated all of the subsequent events that are tied into the M/R train. For example I am going to have to come up with some changes to the Winter War timeline, to set it forward or back to make coincide with the flexible Danzig timeline. Its a prototype, and I think it is pretty rock solid up to Poland, and we can patch to accommodate smaller issues over the next week.

I included two of my test save, Anschluss I, and Anschluss Munich I, these can be played through to see how the system works, without playing through 1936 and 1936. The first starts prior to Anschluss and the second when the “Diplomatic Offensive" system has kicked in. It is based on a standard two IC run for Germany.

The package for the system comes as an additional scenario to the main EIR II (HAGS) patch, and can be downloaded into the present EIR (HAGS) folder and unzipped there. Here is the patch for the prototype: Goering's Delay
 
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Yes, only MP really.

I did some work on the ai (actually a lot) to make it play more like a person. This was mostly for playtesting. But its not balanced at all for SP. Russia is a cakewalk for Germany, for example, and I simply have not gotten around to making more "I am stupid computer events" for Russia so that it is tougher to take on when run by the ai.

This is partly because I intended for the SU to be one of the hardest countries to play in MP, and as of now, it seems possible a touch harder than Germany even.

I have done nothing to make the standing "ai" compatible with the present mod. But who knows what it will do. I haven't yet run it through as Haiti to even check.
 
floatingdanzigdateeventjk1.jpg
 
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Many: EIR is focussed more on evolving a more flexible diplomatic system, that creates conditions for people to play a-hitorically without unbalancing the game. Primarily it is an effort to hardcode into the events the basics of Hiensen's rules, and the Aussie rules system.

The main diplomatic difference is that Japan can never puppet China, and China may only become an Axis ally if it has been conquered, and Germany is doing well in Barbarossa, and Japan is doing well in the Pacific. This helps prevent distortions like Axis gangbang of Soviet Union, and also encourages Allies to fight in the Pacific, since keeping Japan locked in will prevent China from opening up a new front in Russia.

In order to compensate for this nerfing of overall Axis power Russia has been nerfed considerablly.

At this time, we are working on a flexible Danzig date for the European theater, explained in the flow chart above.

Combatwise it feels simillar, but it is not designed in the same way at all. The EIR approach to GDE is different, and EIR makes defence stronger than offensive by increasing the number of defensive combat effects.

The air model is also different, as you can see by the OP, and the "fighter" unit, has been amalgamated with the "Interceptor" unit. Nav range is much shorter, and has its own Doctrine tree.

Better? Not really, many ideas are borrowed from MEM, but its takes a different approach to many of the game issues, especially diplomatically speaking.
 
Think I have worked out a few of the bugs, and this is semi-functional. I'd like to run another play test for this.

Note I dropped the idea of floating Anschlus, and just went with a variable Muncih and Danzig date. Germany must start the war on there own, there is no Danzig date set to fire, and Soviet Union also triggers the winterwar against Finland by the same means.

Goerings Delay

Anyone wants to DL the latest system and play it out until M/R and let me know the results that would be fine. you can just DL and unzip the patch for QPAR, and it wont interfere with the basic EIR game.

Thanks...

Anyone want to playtest? If so when, need a minimum three people.
 
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I think I have identifed the connectity problem, and it relates to the mod patch and not my iternet connection after all:

Description of the difficulty: When doing some recent edits I may have accidentally allowed for some data files associated with the editor to get included with the download. These cause the system to not properly load the scenario files in the scenario interface when played in Windowed Mode. On a new install no scenarios will appear at all, and over an old version of the EIR patch the scenarios will appear, but the interface is still corrupted.

Identification: A small green "F" appears immediatly below the chesksum code at the top right hand side of the screen.

I do not know, but I think this may very well have caused the frequent lags, and also problems loading the game from the Hosting ingerface. It seems very likely to me.

Solution: Reinstall the EIR patch over a completely new version of the game, and delete the old one. You should probably also make sure you keep any recent saves from ongoing games. The new patch can be found in my signature here or at P-Dox, or this one: New Patch EIR II Goerings Delay -- QPAR
 
Durruti's Map modification:

In order to decrease bottlnecks, the new EIR will incorporate Durrutti's excelent map modification, originally featured in MEM 2.02. The main changes have been made to France and Belgium, adding four new provinces. As well, there are now two provinces on the Spanish Border with France next to Dax. Also, some of the seazones have been rearranged to limit the range of land based air.

eirfrancegv5.jpg


Allied Manpower

The consensus is that the Allies are way too strong in the early game, and various solutions have been proposed, but in the main people seem to think that the UK simply has too much manpower.

So there are two major changes:

1) The "Relative Manpower" of all the major Allies (USA included) and the Commonwealth has be reduced to 50% or less, in the scenarios files, more or less in the same way that one does with IC_mod. The manpower efficiency will increase through the normal gearing events, until UK and France are producing normal manpower about the time that the war begins.

2) The entire UK army in India is locked into place, and will only be released at the time of the "Churchill becomes Prime Minister" event.

(No doubt someone will delete them for manpower and make them into tanks) :rolleyes:

Mobilization:

Added I added three new tech trees, one for Democracies, one for Fascist nations, and one for the Communist nations. Most of these techs will only be available to major countries. Pre-war mobilization is available to all.

All countries must first study "Pre-war Mobilization" as prerequisites for their specific ideological tech trees, which become available after they are at war. Here is what "Pre-war" mobilization looks like:

warmobilizationiv2.png


In the following thumbnails you can look at more details:


Tech Tree and a couple of techs


Most of the Soviet system.

Generally speaking the idea is to limit Allied manpower in the pre-war period but give them a boost after war begins. The German and Soviet mobilization events are intended to be used later in the war if they are getting into a manpower crisis.

General Sherman's production system

A while back General Sherman pointed out that one of the problems with the HOI production concept is that it views the creation of divisions purely as a production issue, when in fact it is mostly a training issue. In the vanilla HOI system division production is absurdly fast, and when gearing kicks in we see things such as infantry divisions being pumped out in less than two months. So, the new production system increases the length of time of production but decreases the cost. In effect the IC/Days to produce a unit will not change, but it will take longer but be cheaper.

In general basic units, such as infantry take 6 months to train, while specialized units like Paratroopers, and tank and air divisions take between 7 and 9 months.

Doubtless this will have some impact on strategies dependent on full gearing bonuses.

Interceptors

Interceptor technology is advancing too quickly.

I have adjusted the tech tree for interceptor aircraft so that the new models are a year later. 38/40/42/44/46 as opposed to 37/39/41/43/45. As well, I have increased the research difficulty by about 20%. It will be a more difficult to pre-tech these in time for war.

Naval Bomber system

In addition to the changes to the seazones, which should help keep Naval Bombers mostly to coastal waters. I have dropped the system where Naval Attack factors are increased and just added these directly to the Models themselves.

Air/Naval and Naval

1) I have slightly increased the airdefence factors for the capital ships, and reduced their visibility slightly. They will be better able to defend themselves against attack from the air, and will be harder to find. The decrease in visibility will mean that naval combat will be slightly less frequent than it is now, as well.

2) I have deleted the CVL. CVL's are a good idea, and I really wanted to save them, but they are bugged and give the already powerful British Naval Doctrine way too much power overall.

Armour

I nerffed armour way too much in the last patch, and have increased its defensiveness, and its morale slightly in the new version.

Motorized

The motorized Infantry units were way too powerful overall. I have increased their softness by 5% and decreased their base moral, so that they take more time to reorganized after combat.

Buildings

1) Bases is build queue TC load modifier increased from 100 to 10000 to kill base exploits.

2) Airbases cost increased to 5, but build time reduced to 40.

Events:

1) France will now fall if 60% of Metropolitan France is in Axis hands, regardless of who owns Paris or Vichy.

2) Random events for the democracies have been made less damaging, and dissent hits have been cut in half.

Bugs

1) USA will now get the Blitzkreig "Air bonus" in 1942 with the "Regimental Combat Teams". Previously it only came in 1943 with "Mechanized Offensive" and not with "Combined Arms Defense" at all.

2) The bug which allowed for both Model 2 and 3 Interceptors to be produced at the same time has been fixed.

3) Ghent and Brugge (new province) will be VP provinces. This should ensure that the capital stays in Europe even after Brussels falls, which should eliminate some of the annoying supply problems there when Brussels falls.

I am thinking of doing a few more things, but that is what has been done now, and I am open to suggestions.

Thanks.
 
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Many interesting changes, we will see where all this will lead us at this time.:p

@still nothing about zie atlantic wall, gothic line or soviet fortifications events ;)