Fiddling with initiative...

[EmptyPepsiCan]

Has anybody tried modding the game so that initiative is based on weight, rather than on class? I've been debating trying it, but I'm questioning just how far I should go.

If I go by sort of typicalish movement profiles then it seems like, more or less, 6/9 or faster is a light, 8/5 is a medium, 4/6 is a heavy, and 3/5 is assault. Unfortunately that means that the Panther, Hunchback, Orion, and Cyclops are all mediums, and the Urbanmech is an assault. That could also lead to a lot of unintended consequences, such as the game hitting me with a lot of fast assaults (Victor, Zeus, Battlemaster, Cyclops and Banshee) in the mid game, and lot of Urbies when I'm running an assault lance.

I was thinking that maybe a more limited change, like making the Cicada a light and the Dragon and Quickdraw mediums, then calling it good. I suppose I could go a bit further and make the Victor, Zeus and Battlemaster into heavies, but that might mean that the endgame shows me nothing but Stalkers, Highlanders, Atlases, and King Crabs. That would be a bit much.

Anybody try this? Any thoughts or interesting experiences?

 

[Pode]

I did this all the way and enjoy it. The OPFOR is spawned based on the tags, not the class, so if you change the classes of appropriate mechs based on speed all that happens is they show up in the list filters based on speed not tonnage.

 

[unclecid]

didnt someone make a mod like this over on nexus?

 

[unclecid]

sure did...Adjusted weight classes
from nexus -
The guidelines are (based on tabletop speeds):

1. Any mech with walk speed 7 (190m) or above is classified no heavier than light.
2. Any mech with walk speed 5 (150m) or above is classified no heavier than medium.
3. Any mech with walk speed 4 (120m) or above is classified no heavier than heavy.

Note this doesn't go the other way. A Panther is not now a heavy mech, and an Urbanmech is not now an assault mech!

The reason for these guidelines is that mechs with these speeds and above these weight classes generally have no more or even less tonnage available, so are actually comparable in firepower to their lighter cousins.

Based on these guidelines, the following changes have been made:

1. Cicada: Medium -> Light
2. Dragon + Quickdraw: Heavy -> Medium
3. Banshee + Battlemaster + Victor + Zeus: Assault -> Heavy

All stability thresholds for these mechs have been reduced to their new weight class, except for the Cicada-2A, which, with less free space for armour and weapons than a Locust, I thought needed all the help it could get. Generally speaking though the increased initiative will more than compensate for the reduced stability I suspect. In addition, mediums and lights are harder to hit, so mechs moved into these categories get further bonuses to compensate for a stability loss.

Note I haven't been able to change the Cyclops as being a DLC mech it doesn't seem to appear as an XML file in the "chassis" directory. Arguably the battle computer variant shouldn't get a boost as it already gives itself an initiative boost but probably the non battle computer variant could use some help.

These changes do not affect how mechs spawn in the OpFor, with two exceptions: Cicadas will now be classed as lights for spawn purposes and Quickdraws as mediums. This is as both of these are designs with low melee damage and their stock designs are outclassed by other mechs in the weight class below them.

 

[EmptyPepsiCan]

I'm not quite sure I'm following you. What do you mean by 'tags'?

Actually, I'll tell you what I did and what I expect to see as the campaign progresses. Maybe you can tell me if I'm right or where I'm wrong.

I went ahead and made the Cicada a light and the Dragon and Quickdraw mediums. That means that they will all act on an earlier initiative phase, thus making them, if not necessarily good, at least better.

I'm expecting that I'll also start seeing Cicadas more often in light lances, and Quickdraws and Dragons in medium lances - so basically all of those mechs should be showing up earlier in the campaign. Is that correct?

I was thinking of going all the way and changing everything but the poor Urbie. If I'm understanding things right that would mean that if I defined "heavy" as anything with a 6/4/X movement rate then "heavy" lances would start spawning with Hunchbacks, Centurions, Enforcers, Victors, Zeuses, Battlemasters, Cyclopses, and Banshees, in addition to the usual Thunderbolts, Orion's, and so forth. Is that accurate?

Thanks

 

[EmptyPepsiCan]

Thanks unclesid. That actually sounds perfect. I hadn't thought of stability. That leaves 2 questions:

1) Does anybody know where the chassis info for all the expansion mechs is stored, or if it's even accessible? It's not that big a deal - it's easy to figure out the mechdef info to add new mechs to a custom lance - but it would be nice to be able to access them.

2) It's not clear to me whether or not the changes would directly impact the composition of OpFor units. Anyone know for sure?

 

[ronhatch]

1) Does anybody know where the chassis info for all the expansion mechs is stored, or if it's even accessible? It's not that big a deal - it's easy to figure out the mechdef info to add new mechs to a custom lance - but it would be nice to be able to access them.

They are in asset bundles.

To do anything with them, you need to first extract them from the asset bundle. It's a standard Unity file format, and there are tools available that work with those files. Once you've pulled the data out of the bundle, it should be possible to mod them just like any other mech (but I have not attempted it myself). As far as I know, nobody has written up instructions for this... hopefully this is enough information to get you started, anyway.

 

[ronhatch]

Oh, and this thread may help point you in the right direction:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/index.php?threads/is-it-possible-to-mod-dlc-mechs.1186005/

Not much more detail yet than what I mentioned, but there's an open question of what tools the OP used... so if that gets answered...

 

[Pode]

OK, trying again. In the chassisdef, there is a weight class that governs initiative and what gets shown when you press the light button in the mech storage tab. in the mechdef there is a set of tags that mark a mech as jumpcapable, indirect fire specialist, and a bunch of other things, including as a light for lance spawning purposes. You can change these two to not agree with each other. My Urbies are weight class ASSAULT, tagged as unit_light, spawn in half skull missions, move in phase 1, as are the last assault listed in the assault tab. Their AI is unaffected.

 

[ClintonM]

sure did...Adjusted weight classes
from nexus -
The guidelines are (based on tabletop speeds):

1. Any mech with walk speed 7 (190m) or above is classified no heavier than light.
2. Any mech with walk speed 5 (150m) or above is classified no heavier than medium.
3. Any mech with walk speed 4 (120m) or above is classified no heavier than heavy.

That's my mod! Glad to see some others using it. I don't think it needs updates for Urban Warfare. Checked the banshee, the new slower version should be classed as Assault which is right.

 

[EmptyPepsiCan]

OK, trying again. In the chassisdef, there is a weight class that governs initiative and what gets shown when you press the light button in the mech storage tab. in the mechdef there is a set of tags that mark a mech as jumpcapable, indirect fire specialist, and a bunch of other things, including as a light for lance spawning purposes. You can change these two to not agree with each other. My Urbies are weight class ASSAULT, tagged as unit_light, spawn in half skull missions, move in phase 1, as are the last assault listed in the assault tab. Their AI is unaffected.

Got it. Thanks.