Frame loss, not from graphics. And that Decision window slow down.

[Esoteric Rogue]

I see frame loss -- but it's not a graphic issue. I do have a older system, but as the next sentence will state, I usually had no issues. Specifically, even with max graphics, I can almost always hit my max 72 when the game is paused, including when I start a new game in 16.0.2.

Right now, (having rebooted, minimized graphic options, disabled mods -- no change) I'll get 44 fps in a normal zoomed out view

I wat to reiterate that -- I couldn't be more surprised myself that shutting off various graphics didn't help. Shutting of 8xAA usually helps lol, AOC, animated characters (oh, then again, I might be using Nvidia Profile Inspector to force better AA -- still the other settings would have change something if it was graphics slowing me down). I use DX11. Vulcan is consitantly 5% fewer frames on my 3060 system.

This run started as new 16.0.0 run as Temujin. It's now 1223 a.d., and the empire shield reports ruling 622 counties. I noticed it when I ate Byzantium (and I think before I created a lot of new nobles of my culture to dish out titles), but loading up some old saves I now see that it was progressive. Not too bad in 1208 a.d. (over 60fps), worse in 1212 (under 60fps.)

My hardware monitor widget (attached to show model numbers) reports numbers are about:
CPU usage <= 27%
RAM > 3 GB available
GPU usage <= 41%
GPU Memory <45% usage.

Again, I assert I should not be having any frame loss when both my CPU and GPU are under 50%. Something is crazy here, is it me? I am getting older; it was 25 years ago when last I knew how computers worked, lol.

While trouble shooting this, I noticed the decision tree issue -- frames drop from 44 to 17 just by toggling F8 on, even immediately at launch -- I don't think it's a typical leak. I added my experience on this bug thread. https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...ision-ui-in-open-while-playing-nomad.1739575/

So, I would keep playing this at 44 fps but with the sub-windows (Decisions) dropping to a third of that I'll archive this run for later. So this it a fine time to experiment a little bit. Maybe I'll start up a 16.0.2 observer run to see how long it takes to get bad.

I know alot of us have been doing Temujin runs, but I haven't seen anybody explicitly complaining about frame loss *without* significant loads. Thoughts? Thanks.

 

[AndrewT]

Aside from a somewhat lower fps, is this issue having any impact on your game? Slower time passing, jerkiness when scrolling or zooming perhaps?

I might be using Nvidia Profile Inspector to force better AA

If GeForce Experience or the Nvidia app are running, exit them before starting the game. Does that help?


If not Right click on ck3.exe , properties, compatibility. Tick "disable fullScreen optimisations" untick every other box in that dialog, Apply and exit.
Then in the launcher Game Settings menu, select fullScreen display mode, Vsync off, cap refresh rate at 60.

If those don't help:
DXDIAG is a program you run from the Windows search box on the task bar. After running it will open a window and start collecting info with a progress bar in the lower-left corner. When it completes click the 'save all information' button and save it to a file then attach that file here.
IF dxdiag.txt fails to attach here, rename it to dxdiag.log , or zip it up.

Please attach here your Documents/Paradox Interactive/CK3/pdx_settings.txt .
From your Documents/Paradox Interactive/CK3/logs/ folder, attach here system.log , error.log

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

> jerkiness
Time passing and zooming / panning is on par with the frame rate -- when the decision tree is open, zooming is a little bit of a slide show, but relatively smooth. The mouse cursor, however, is at full speed. Game speed also seems proprotionate to frame rate. 43 fps is perhaps 4 day per second, but notably slower at 13 fps -- 1 or 2 days per second. No big issue -- just like playing with a worse video card.

> GeForce Experience or the Nvidia app
Nvidia App is not installed. Experience was not actively running, but the overlay would still open. I disabled it from starting up.

On load, I was running at 45 fps.

> If those don't help:

Disable all startup programs, as far as practical.

Restart. Close a logitech startup app I missed.

Opened Chrome, Explorer, Notepad++; left them running.

Disabled fullscreen optimations and set to fullscreen mode.

Title screen shows between 211 - 232 fps (per Steam overlay)
Load game menu shows 1700+ fps
... which drops to 700+ with the save file selected.

Same issue. 43 - 47 fps with speed paused or running. Escape menu shows about 140 fps. Decision window shows 15 fps.

It's the first time I've looked at error.log. Suppose I could clean that up by removing some saves and disabling the mods again.

Requested 2 files attached. system.log exists but is indeed a literal 0 byte file which cannot be attached. Thank you.

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

n.b. My observer game from 1178 was still running fast at max (72) fps in year 1231 (a few years later than my campaign) with my mods.

I disabled mods. Delete a few saves.

Saved a couple frames? 44-47 normally. Decision window at 17.

attaching the new logs. System.log has data now. Thanks.

oops. I'd forgotten settings.txt.

 

[AndrewT]

Then in the launcher Game Settings menu, select fullScreen display mode, Vsync off, cap refresh rate at 60.

I was wanting to cap the frame rate at 60, which ought to be adequate for a non-action game like this, thinking that might help smooth the general game graphics performance. Did you try setting it like that but it didn't 'take'?

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

Looking now, the launcher settings refresh rate was and is set to 60, but that wouldn't cap frame rate limit unless vsync is on.

Steams trying to force me to update.

I can update to latest, set my monitor and game settings to 60 and turn vsynch on and share the logs again if you'd like.

Ya, I think I'll go ahead and do that.

Actually, I'll leave vsync off, and use the Maximum FPS setting of 60 in game.

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

I updated the game to 1.16.1.0
I changed my monitor to 60. Set the Maxiumum FPS to 60 in the game settings.
I disabled the Nvidia Profile Inspector by removing it's association to ck3.exe
reboot.
no change. 43-45 normally frames normal zoomed out. Decision windows about 18.

 

[ourg]

the decision tab is a bug confirmed. If we reduce one or more decision group on the ui tab the fps drop disapear

and it's much more noticeable when playing on vulkan


60 fps (sorry fps no shown but i've checked them with the steam overlay):

80 fps (i'm locking fps at 80 max) :

The only thing i've made is reducing the "adventurer decision" group that have only one decision displayed

 

[AndrewT]

the decision tab is a bug confirmed. If we reduce one or more decision group on the ui tab the fps drop disapear

Thanks for that info - this is reported and confirmed in the Bug Reports forum?

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

Yes, that was the thread I linked in my first post. Nontheless, my overall issue -- frame loss in general, not only in decision or other tabs -- is not one I've found another case of.

I'm certainly hopefull that it's all the same issue and will be fixed. But nonetheless if all my symptoms are the same issue as the confirmed decision menu, then there should also be other people experiencing my overall symptoms.

 

[ourg]

Thanks for that info - this is reported and confirmed in the Bug Reports forum?

Yes i've already exchange with a QA tester on the subject

and i've made some research and the issue on the decision icon is when too much icon are in and some are not displayed :

I4ve modified the gui window decision to reduce the heigh of the icon to test :

Before 40 fps :

after 80 fps at my max cap :

It's obviously an hardcoded issue

 

[ourg]

I've managed to fix the bug for the decision tab. by replacing the fixedgridbox by a dynamicgridbox in the window_decisions.ui and the decision still looks the same

I've made a mod : https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3478668605

 

[Esoteric Rogue]

I've managed to fix the bug for the decision tab. by replacing the fixedgridbox by a dynamicgridbox in the window_decisions.ui and the decision still looks the same

I've made a mod : https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3478668605

Nice but that does little for my issue. It does cut the frameloss in half for the decision window but it's still there, and overall all loss in every other aspect of the game.

Using your mod there is minor improvement, 45-48 map view is 5% better -- instead of a a solid 72. And 27-28 in decision is alot better than 18. That's' Nice that your mod has found a few players with somewhat similar issues. Good job @ourg for what it's worth.

But if they only fixed the decision window, my game -- and apparently some others' -- would still be trashed. There's a deeper issue the devs need to address.

 

[ourg]

I have a powerfull pc and I lock my framerate to 80 for saving power. So I probably only see major bugs like the one i've found. Probably there is some other issues I don't notice.

But to add to the subject, the fix I've found is not supposed to happen and is illogical, and to be honest I've found it by accident :


To display the decision button the default UI use a fixedgridbox and i've replaced it by a dynamicgridbox. But, normaly, a fixedgridbox is supposed to be better for performance, like said in tyhe CK3 modding wiki :

dynamicgridbox

• Can become laggy with very long lists.

fixedgridbox

• Much better for performance with long lists.

So i'ts not logical. I suspect a backend issue with the game and this function. And probably other similar situations can create a fps drop