Hearts of Iron V Suggestion

[zohaltopallasofrada]

lI played about 17 thousand hours of hoi4 with multiple accounts. I share my experiences here and I hope the next game is really good. I think the developers know the game's shortcomings because Paradox employees are smart people. The current game engine would be negatively affected by such developments for HOI4, so I'm writing for HOI5.

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Project Proposal for Hearts of Iron V​

"Redefining Grand Strategy Gaming"

---

1. Vision: Why HOI5 Needs Evolution​

Hearts of Iron IV is a great strategy game, but it has fundamental limitations:

• Infinite army building without economic consequences.
• Lack of real-world market, debt, and financial warfare.
• Static internal stability, no domestic collapse risks.
• Only player hardware limits the army, not realistic state factors.

Our goal:
Create a deeper, richer, more realistic world where military actions, economy, and internal stability are intertwined — offering the ultimate grand strategy experience.

---

2. Core Innovations​

2.1. War Economy System​

Features:

• War Taxes: Automatic tax increases during wartime.
• Government Bonds: Ability to borrow money with postwar risks.
• Weapon Sales: Selling arms for profit.
• Hyperinflation: Risk of hyperinflation if loans are abused.

2.2. Army Maintenance and Collapse​

Features:

• Daily army maintenance costs (food, salary, equipment).
• Mass armies cause severe financial strain.
• Unpaid armies desert or rebel.

2.3. Global Market System​

Features:

• Dynamic buying and selling of resources.
• Price fluctuations based on supply and demand.
• Black Market possibilities for illegal deals.

2.4. Internal Stability and Civil Unrest​

Features:

• War exhaustion affects public morale.
• High taxes or defeats cause unrest.
• Civil wars possible if the situation is not managed properly.

---

3. Scenario Diversity​

Instead of only focusing on WWII, HOI5 should feature multiple starting points:

1. Victoria Era (Industrial Age) - Starting Year: 1836
   • Industrialization and the colonial race begins.
2. 1st World War (WW1) - Starting Year: 1914
   • The Great War, trench warfare, new diplomacy.
3. Interwar Period - Starting Year: 1936
   • Pre-WW2 tensions, global depression.
4. 2nd World War (WW2) - Starting Year: 1939
   • Classic WWII start, Blitzkrieg tactics.
5. Cold War Period - Starting Year: 1947
   • USA vs USSR, nuclear tension, proxy wars.
6. Modern World - Starting Year: 2000
   • A new era, featuring globalized economics, terrorism, cyber warfare, and modern political tensions. Players can influence global markets, manage technological innovations, and navigate modern-day conflicts.

---

4. Technical Considerations​

• Economy, army, and stability mechanics designed to be CPU/GPU-friendly.
• Scaling options available for lower-end systems.
• Background calculations optimized for smooth performance.

---

5. Gameplay Longevity​

To ensure a long and enjoyable gameplay experience:

• Dynamic Events and Randomized Storylines: Random events and geopolitical shifts will keep the player engaged and make each playthrough unique.
• Multi-Year Campaigns: Allow players to play through extended timelines, with the ability to engage in long-term economic, military, and political strategies.
• Endgame Content: Add post-conflict scenarios, allowing players to rebuild, manage global peace, or continue with new technological advancements.
• AI Improvements: Ensure AI nations have dynamic strategies that evolve over time, preventing stagnation and encouraging ongoing interaction.

---

6. Conclusion: Hearts of Iron V's Opportunity​

Combining HOI4’s smooth warfare, Victoria's deep economy, and EU4’s political management will create a masterpiece that dominates the grand strategy genre for years to come.

---

END OF PROPOSAL

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Thank you for reading me

 

[BeauNiddle]

HOI is a series about Total War. Not a series about empire building. Any talk about global peace, rebuilding or long-term economic strategies is missing the point of the game.

There are some people who would love the mega-game you suggested, but the majority would find it a too unfocused. Look at all the complaints on this forum about designers and MIOs - attempts to deepen the logistics and economy but that some feel get in the way of moving their soldiers around.

It will be interesting to see how the players react to Project Caesar once they get their hands on it. It sells itself as the ultimate masterpiece of current Paradox games. Will the players appreciate the scale in practice?

 

[Dimmie_Dumm]

2.1. War Economy System

• War Taxes: Automatic tax increases during wartime.
• Government Bonds: Ability to borrow money with postwar risks.
• Weapon Sales: Selling arms for profit.
• Hyperinflation: Risk of hyperinflation if loans are abused.

This latter makes no sense, this is not how [war] economy works. I highly recommend a post-war article by Schwerin von Krosigk who served as the minister of finance of Germany and provided valuable insights on war-time experiences in a form proved very digestible even for layman such as myself.

First of all, any arms trading pays peanuts compared to war expenses during a total war. To give a perspective, all German military expenses on the run-up to WW2 amounted to ~60 Bn RM, and to ~700 Bn RM by the end of the war. So in order to gain 1% of that latter figure, the Germans would have had to sell like 50 Bismarck-class battleships (at double price apiece). While the Germans did export stuff throughout the war (that was one of the few ways to gain currency), the scale of it obviously wasn't even close. Wages of Destruction by Tooze has some nice tables and figures for more elaborate data, which I unfortunately don't remember by heart.

Basically, there are 3 ways to finance one's war:

• taxes
• bonds and loans
• printing press (which is a hidden tax applied specifically to one's monetary posessions, as everyone hopefully understands)

Raising taxes is actually the best (e.g. least harmul) source, but the problems are that it's a) obvious to people and causes political implications and b) at some point high taxes discourage business activity and drop national work efficiency overall. Maybe good enough propaganda can offset that to some extent, but everything obviously has its limits.

The printing press and hyperinflation ain't all that obvious. I.e. the Germans revved up money printing even before the war itself (if I remember correctly, the amount of money in circulation doubled in 1938-1939), but the economy only really started to collapse in Sep 1944, which happened as a result of several factors such as virtually all foreign possessions being lost (e.g. France with its ore) and people starting a mass withdrawal of their bank accounts.

As a sidenote, inflation may rather cause ideological drift :

Ultimately, hyperinflation will surely come around at some point and cause issues, but that may happen well after the war, and it's probably non of the HoI4 player's business then. To give a quote by a man who aside from heavy drinking probably knew a thing or two about driving countries both hostile and one of his own to collapse:

"It is most unfortunate. I shall leave it to my successor".

 

[Timmysoboy]

That's an AI copy-paste if I've ever seen one

 

[GreyOgre]

Basically, there are 3 ways to finance one's war:

• taxes
• bonds and loans
• printing press (which is a hidden tax applied specifically to one's monetary posessions, as everyone hopefully understands)

Wasn't looting, both in occupied territory and among parts of the own population, a major part of the nazi war economy?

 

[marcelo r. r.]

Too much economy, and i'm against dead end's in games.

A circular economy like in hoi2 will be enough to me:
- if you go civil economy/free marketer, you have plenty of money to funds diplo/civil goods/purchase weapons instead of build.
- if you go war economy/autarky, you generate less money/less civil goods/better at produce weapons instead of purchase.

 

[PK_AZ]

There are some people who would love the mega-game you suggested, but the majority would find it a too unfocused. Look at all the complaints on this forum about designers and MIOs - attempts to deepen the logistics and economy but that some feel get in the way of moving their soldiers around.

While I agree with your post, I think designers and MIOs are innocent bystanders here.
Strategy game is always partially about feeling, and partially about math. Concrete feeling-math ratio depends on specific game. Expected ratio depends on specific player. Similarly, each strategy game has some level of granularity.
Its not that MIOs and designers are outside the scope of the game. Its that they went on micro and math hard.

 

[Duke_Dave]

The two core issue for me would be that instead of mini-games for each country there should be deep mechanics with localized flavor. The US is the only country with a mechanic for democracy, Bulgaria has its own power struggle, as does Italy, Germany has a minister system, Soviet Union has an in-depth propaganda system. Mexico has a system representing the struggle between religion and secularism, etc. etc. All these mechanics should exist for most countries. All Middle Eastern Countries should have a religion vs. secularism mechanism for example. All democracies should have a parliament mechanic. All states should have a propaganda mechanic.

Decision should have downsides. At the moment every decision is more or less positive. I can be at a full war economy without negative impact on stability, Mobilize women for the workforce without problems, War support can be easily fixed with Mana. I can build up a huge military industry and infrastructure without any maintenance cost. There should be a higher cost to do things.

 

[Lean_XD]

lI played about 17 thousand hours of hoi4 with multiple accounts. I share my experiences here and I hope the next game is really good. I think the developers know the game's shortcomings because Paradox employees are smart people. The current game engine would be negatively affected by such developments for HOI4, so I'm writing for HOI5.

---

Project Proposal for Hearts of Iron V​

"Redefining Grand Strategy Gaming"

---

1. Vision: Why HOI5 Needs Evolution​

Hearts of Iron IV is a great strategy game, but it has fundamental limitations:

• Infinite army building without economic consequences.
• Lack of real-world market, debt, and financial warfare.
• Static internal stability, no domestic collapse risks.
• Only player hardware limits the army, not realistic state factors.

Our goal:
Create a deeper, richer, more realistic world where military actions, economy, and internal stability are intertwined — offering the ultimate grand strategy experience.

---

2. Core Innovations​

2.1. War Economy System​

Features:

• War Taxes: Automatic tax increases during wartime.
• Government Bonds: Ability to borrow money with postwar risks.
• Weapon Sales: Selling arms for profit.
• Hyperinflation: Risk of hyperinflation if loans are abused.

2.2. Army Maintenance and Collapse​

Features:

• Daily army maintenance costs (food, salary, equipment).
• Mass armies cause severe financial strain.
• Unpaid armies desert or rebel.

2.3. Global Market System​

Features:

• Dynamic buying and selling of resources.
• Price fluctuations based on supply and demand.
• Black Market possibilities for illegal deals.

2.4. Internal Stability and Civil Unrest​

Features:

• War exhaustion affects public morale.
• High taxes or defeats cause unrest.
• Civil wars possible if the situation is not managed properly.

---

3. Scenario Diversity​

Instead of only focusing on WWII, HOI5 should feature multiple starting points:

1. Victoria Era (Industrial Age) - Starting Year: 1836
   • Industrialization and the colonial race begins.
2. 1st World War (WW1) - Starting Year: 1914
   • The Great War, trench warfare, new diplomacy.
3. Interwar Period - Starting Year: 1936
   • Pre-WW2 tensions, global depression.
4. 2nd World War (WW2) - Starting Year: 1939
   • Classic WWII start, Blitzkrieg tactics.
5. Cold War Period - Starting Year: 1947
   • USA vs USSR, nuclear tension, proxy wars.
6. Modern World - Starting Year: 2000
   • A new era, featuring globalized economics, terrorism, cyber warfare, and modern political tensions. Players can influence global markets, manage technological innovations, and navigate modern-day conflicts.

---

4. Technical Considerations​

• Economy, army, and stability mechanics designed to be CPU/GPU-friendly.
• Scaling options available for lower-end systems.
• Background calculations optimized for smooth performance.

---

5. Gameplay Longevity​

To ensure a long and enjoyable gameplay experience:

• Dynamic Events and Randomized Storylines: Random events and geopolitical shifts will keep the player engaged and make each playthrough unique.
• Multi-Year Campaigns: Allow players to play through extended timelines, with the ability to engage in long-term economic, military, and political strategies.
• Endgame Content: Add post-conflict scenarios, allowing players to rebuild, manage global peace, or continue with new technological advancements.
• AI Improvements: Ensure AI nations have dynamic strategies that evolve over time, preventing stagnation and encouraging ongoing interaction.

---

6. Conclusion: Hearts of Iron V's Opportunity​

Combining HOI4’s smooth warfare, Victoria's deep economy, and EU4’s political management will create a masterpiece that dominates the grand strategy genre for years to come.

---

END OF PROPOSAL

---

Thank you for reading me

I like some of the points, but what you described is what if we made HoI game with Victoria as it's base.

 

[Ashantai]

Please post only in English in this forum. You are welcome to use translation software to help you, but do not post the original version as well.
Thank you.

 

[Jeankazuhiza]

If i would change a start date, it would be as possible as 1934 or 1932, but not more than that and until 1953 (and no more than that)