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Tusade

Second Lieutenant
62 Badges
Feb 14, 2012
143
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The big problem with adding China to the game is the performance. More characters, more provinces, more mechanics, etc. A lot of burden to the computers.

So, here my solution: split the the world map in two.

One world map would be like now: from Moroco to Burma.

The other world map will be from Japan to Persia.

What do you think?
 
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The big problem with adding China to the game is the performance. More characters, more provinces, more mechanics, etc. A lot of burden to the computers.

So, here my solution: split the the world map in two.

One world map would be like now: from Moroco to Burma.

The other world map will be from Japan to Persia.

What do you think?
I think splitting the map in two is the most ham-fisted approach, and I'm confident there would be *some* better way to do it, such as abstracting different realms and giving them fewer courtiers and the like.
 
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All the other PDX games manage. CK3 is the only current PDX mainline game without China.

V3 even has pops which are notoriously performance heavy.

I think they just need to optimize some calculations under the hood, especially with admin government which is currently the most performance intensive thing in the game.
 
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The china mods run fine. This is a non problem.

EDIT: Why are these false premises always pushed forward for China DLC in particular? China is not a sacrifice to implement, it's a boon for the entire eastern map and bureaucratic governments.
 
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You just dont add china and then you dont have to solve anything major. Easy.
You could just remove all mechanics from the game, remove the graphics, uninstall, go outside, and play with stick figurines in the back yard pretending they're historical figures. Then you don't even need computer. Just use your imagination. Easy.

Why didn't I think of that?
 
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You could just remove all mechanics from the game, remove the graphics, uninstall, go outside, and play with stick figurines in the back yard pretending they're historical figures. Then you don't even need computer. Just use your imagination. Easy.

Why didn't I think of that?
I wasn't advocating for removing anything though.
 
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the game spawns in more characters than it strictly has to and doesnt clean them up quick enough. when you unland a character, their entire court is flung to the other side of the map and when you land a new person in their place, a bevy of lowborns is created to act as courtiers instead of reusing those wandering characters that already exist. events are constantly generating characters that dont get pruned when you dont recruit them, and even when useless characters are killed, they clog up the save as corpses for far longer than they need to. many events that generate characters also lack a cooldown, so not only are they generating useless characters that impact performance, theyre also common enough that you get sick of seeing them constantly (hedge knight travel event comes to mind)

there is a lot you could fix in this game that would help with performance without arbitrarily dividing the map. we could have all of china and have it running smooth as butter, theyd just have to clean a bunch of shit up first
 
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My solution is just don't add China and focus on the hundreds of people's, cultures and regions already in the map that have no flavor or content, not that I have anything against a Chinese expansion I just don't trust paradox to add a huge new swath of land, cultures, religions and governments in a DLC and have it you know, work. Don't know why people are so excited for china when landless and rtp already tanked performance on most machines and administrative government is still unbalanced and broken.
 
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there is a lot you could fix in this game that would help with performance without arbitrarily dividing the map. we could have all of china and have it running smooth as butter, theyd just have to clean a bunch of shit up first
They would haveto clean A LOT of shit up first.
 
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My solution is just don't add China and focus on the hundreds of people's, cultures and regions already in the map that have no flavor or content, not that I have anything against a Chinese expansion I just don't trust paradox to add a huge new swath of land, cultures, religions and governments in a DLC and have it you know, work. Don't know why people are so excited for china when landless and rtp already tanked performance on most machines and administrative government is still unbalanced and broken.
Extremely based take. We have massive devoid of content chunks such as africa and india (steppe is being adressed, sure). And honestly it's not like there's much content for, say, france or italy.
People equally as often ask for republics or theocracies (or landless if you go back to before RtP), which also never made sense to me when even feudals are kinda lackluster in terms of content.... But surely adding another technically functional government type or expanding the map will make everything else way better!!!
 
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Extremely based take. We have massive devoid of content chunks such as africa and india (steppe is being adressed, sure). And honestly it's not like there's much content for, say, france or italy.
People equally as often ask for republics or theocracies (or landless if you go back to before RtP), which also never made sense to me when even feudals are kinda lackluster in terms of content.... But surely adding another technically functional government type or expanding the map will make everything else way better!!!
I think people are too focused on expanding the map to include China, Africa, and even the Americas rather than prioritizing depth. Many argue for adding China by saying it was crucial for trade routes from east to west, as if simulating a Silk Road economy would be impossible without physically including China on the map. But Western, Central, Eastern Europe, The Middle East weren’t trading with China directly, they traded with their nearest neighbors, and goods moved eastward through intermediaries.

There’s no reason the game couldn’t simulate this with an off-screen trade node representing China, allowing for the same economic influence without dedicating massive resources to adding a huge, content-starved region. Instead of stretching the map further, the focus should be on improving existing regions like India, Central Asia, and the Middle East, areas that already need more depth.

The same argument applies to Mongolia. Instead of physically adding China, why not implement events, decisions, and trade mechanics that simulate its influence on the steppe? China doesn’t need to be in the game world to have a presence in the game’s systems. Expanding the map for the sake of trade mechanics is unnecessary when those same mechanics could be achieved in a much more efficient way.
 
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I think people are too focused on expanding the map to include China, Africa, and even the Americas rather than prioritizing depth. Many argue for adding China by saying it was crucial for trade routes from east to west, as if simulating a Silk Road economy would be impossible without physically including China on the map. But Western, Central, Eastern Europe, The Middle East weren’t trading with China directly, they traded with their nearest neighbors, and goods moved eastward through intermediaries.

There’s no reason the game couldn’t simulate this with an off-screen trade node representing China, allowing for the same economic influence without dedicating massive resources to adding a huge, content-starved region. Instead of stretching the map further, the focus should be on improving existing regions like India, Central Asia, and the Middle East, areas that already need more depth.

The same argument applies to Mongolia. Instead of physically adding China, why not implement events, decisions, and trade mechanics that simulate its influence on the steppe? China doesn’t need to be in the game world to have a presence in the game’s systems. Expanding the map for the sake of trade mechanics is unnecessary when those same mechanics could be achieved in a much more efficient way.
And we should all remember, that CK2 has already done it, an Offmap China is the perfect Solution for this.

There is really no actual reasons to have China on the Map.
 
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There is really no actual reasons to have China on the Map.
One reason could be that some people want actually play as China?

I get the concerns about performance, but let's not pretend that everyone hates China and that nobody wants to play there. It's about personal taste and preference, and I really don't understand why some people feel the need to enforce their personal taste on everyone. It's pointless.
 
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One reason could be that some people want actually play as China?
They already can with mods if they want to. Instead of adding extra land that can be done by modders, paradox should focus on imporoving mechanics, fixing bugs, and making more stuff unhardcoded for more opportunities for modders to work with.
 
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I think people are too focused on expanding the map to include China, Africa, and even the Americas rather than prioritizing depth. Many argue for adding China by saying it was crucial for trade routes from east to west, as if simulating a Silk Road economy would be impossible without physically including China on the map. But Western, Central, Eastern Europe, The Middle East weren’t trading with China directly, they traded with their nearest neighbors, and goods moved eastward through intermediaries.

There’s no reason the game couldn’t simulate this with an off-screen trade node representing China, allowing for the same economic influence without dedicating massive resources to adding a huge, content-starved region. Instead of stretching the map further, the focus should be on improving existing regions like India, Central Asia, and the Middle East, areas that already need more depth.

The same argument applies to Mongolia. Instead of physically adding China, why not implement events, decisions, and trade mechanics that simulate its influence on the steppe? China doesn’t need to be in the game world to have a presence in the game’s systems. Expanding the map for the sake of trade mechanics is unnecessary when those same mechanics could be achieved in a much more efficient way.
Thankfully have never seen anybody advocate America. Might just lose my mind if I do
 
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My solution is just don't add China and focus on the hundreds of people's, cultures and regions already in the map that have no flavor or content

I get your concern, but if we prioritize regions based on the number of surviving written historical sources, then China surpasses Europe by a huge margin. Many of these hundreds of cultures you mentioned simply don’t have enough historical information available, and their impact on history was relatively minor.

And I can’t help but add that a cut-off map hinders gameplay in the regions bordering that empty space. I play in Central Asia, and adding China would be far better than any flavor pack. I imagine players in India feel the same way. To give an example—it’s like if the map had the rest of Europe but completely omitted Britain and Spain.
 
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