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If you create the latin empire then what is the purpose of the HRE?

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Vapiritapiri

Vapiritapiri

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Aug 4, 2021
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Or rather vice versa, what's the point of the title of the latin empire when the holy roman empire already exists? How can both exist at the same time? I am trying to roleplay and i am unsure if i should create the latin empire or not. Am i a puppet of the pope and thus should suck up to him? Should i join the HRE?
 
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Vapiritapiri said:
what's the point of the title of the latin empire when the holy roman empire already exists? How can both exist at the same time?
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Portrait_of_Ferdinand_II,_Holy_Roman_Emperor_(Kunsthistorisches_Museum,_Wien).jpg


(This is Ferdinand II, emperor of HRE in 1200)
 
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Vapiritapiri said:
Sexy armour but i still don't understand what's the canon lore?
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The Latin "Empire" existed during the time period of Crusader Kings (obviously simultaneously with the HRE), recreating it in EU4 is fantasy.
 
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Vapiritapiri said:
Well yeah but what's the long term plan? Absorption of the latin empire into the HRE?
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Not really. It was really awkward, and they themselves didn't know what to do. The Latin emperor used different titles of himself when addressing different people, so as to not offend anyone.

Ultimately, they didn't have time for long term plans, they never managed to stabilize their regime, and it began to collapse almost immediately.

And just like Byzantium was never called that, the Latin empire is also a later fabrication. They didn't consider themselves to be a new state, but rather a new government for Romanía, as it's people called it.
 
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KaiserWilhelmI said:
Not really. It was really awkward, and they themselves didn't know what to do. The Latin emperor used different titles of himself when addressing different people, so as to not offend anyone.

Ultimately, they didn't have time for long term plans, they never managed to stabilize their regime, and it began to collapse almost immediately.

And just like Byzantium was never called that, the Latin empire is also a later fabrication. They didn't consider themselves to be a new state, but rather a new government for Romanía, as it's people called it.
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Ah so we do not really know then?
 
The HRE is the Western Empire. The Byxantine/Latin is claiming the Eastern Empire.

This is still pretty flimsy. There was always an undercurrent of rivalry between them, and the Latin Empire, totally beholden to western powers, definitely would have had to prove its reason for existing if it had continued to. But it's not inherently contradictory with the HRE. There were two Romes long before Charlemagne.
 
WJLIII3 said:
The HRE is the Western Empire. The Byxantine/Latin is claiming the Eastern Empire.

This is still pretty flimsy. There was always an undercurrent of rivalry between them, and the Latin Empire, totally beholden to western powers, definitely would have had to prove its reason for existing if it had continued to. But it's not inherently contradictory with the HRE. There were two Romes long before Charlemagne.
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What about a vassal state of the papal states? I still feel the problem of two emperors one rome otherwise.
 
Vapiritapiri said:
Ah so we do not really know then?
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Huh?

The histories tells us these empires all claimed to be successor states to the Roman Empire, to one degree or another. The various claimants to the title “Roman Empire” did exist at the same time.

The various rulers, basically, agreed to disagree on which realm was the “true” reincarnation of the old Empire. The “Byzantine empire” and the “Latin empire” are post hoc titles that were never used by the people living at the time. Future writers needed a way to distinguish between all the states claiming the same title, so we have all these different versions today. It’s all translated into English today, so none of these titles is the one used at the time anyway… :p

If you want to form them all, I’m not sure how you would want to role play it. Make sure your Roman Empire is the only one, extinguishing all opposition? Collect them together to have a super duper unquestionable mandate? I’d say it’s up to you, really. :cool:
 
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The Byzantine Empire reaching an agreement with the Pope is a fun counterfactual. But them suddenly renaming themselves to the "Latin Empire", the same empire that sacked their captial and was responsible for the their dire state, is ridiculous. If Paradox announced tomorrow that the final update to EU4 would be the removal of that name change and nothing else, I would be happy.
 
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Mid Ocean Ridge Basalt said:
The Byzantine Empire reaching an agreement with the Pope is a fun counterfactual. But them suddenly renaming themselves to the "Latin Empire", the same empire that sacked their captial and was responsible for the their dire state, is ridiculous. If Paradox announced tomorrow that the final update to EU4 would be the removal of that name change and nothing else, I would be happy.
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I’m guessing the tag switch happens to make the requirements to end the Union of Churches privilege simpler to execute.
 
Alyosha said:
I’m guessing the tag switch happens to make the requirements to end the Union of Churches privilege simpler to execute.
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What i find odd is that you cannot really play with union of churches. It'd be cool if it removed some negative relation modifiers with catholic nations or something to make it viable, with drawbacks.
 
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