I'm looking for help on some government teams.

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

Hello ladies and gentlemen.
I am looking for help on some government teams, to be precise those of Wales, Scotland, England, Northern Ireland, in the hypothetical case that Britain came out defeated and dismembered by the Great War of 1914. Maybe some Scots, English, Welsh or Northern Irish he has some information or ideas to give to me.

In summary:

- Year of departure around 1918;
- Three types of government (if possible): Left, Center (Democratic) and Right;
- At least one minister for the ten ministries to be assigned.

That's all. Feel free to write all the hypotheses and characters that come into your mind. Thanks in advance to all of you.

See you soon.

 

[aviso]

For Scotland, hope it works for you:
Left:
William Gillies LWR/SD (1865-1932)
John Maclean LE/LWR/SD (1865-1923)
Christopher Murray know as Hugh MacDiarmid LE/LWR/SD (1892-1978)
Jack Leckie LE/LWR (¿-?) he was active from 1905 to 1935
Alec Geddes LE/LWR (1878-?) active until 1935
Robert Cunninghame SL (1852-1936)

Center:
Lewis Spence ML (1874-1955)
Compton Mackenzie ML (1883-1972)
William Speirs Bruce ML (1867-1921)
Wendy Wood ML (1892-1981)

Right:
Ruaraidh Erskine PA/FA (1869-1960)
Graham Seton Hutchison FA/NS (1890-1946)

 

[Tera Brandford]

For England: (leftist)

Henry Hyndman 1842-1921

Henry Hyde Champion 1859 1928

Tom Mann 1856-1943

Beatrice Webb 1858-1943

Robert Blatchford 1851-1943

John Ward 1866-1934 This one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ward_(trade_unionist)

Cecil L'Estrange Malone 1890-1956

Those are some ideas. Tell me if you need more.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

For Scotland, hope it works for you:
Left:
William Gillies LWR/SD (1865-1932)
John Maclean LE/LWR/SD (1865-1923)
Christopher Murray know as Hugh MacDiarmid LE/LWR/SD (1892-1978)
Jack Leckie LE/LWR (¿-?) he was active from 1905 to 1935
Alec Geddes LE/LWR (1878-?) active until 1935
Robert Cunninghame SL (1852-1936)

Center:
Lewis Spence ML (1874-1955)
Compton Mackenzie ML (1883-1972)
William Speirs Bruce ML (1867-1921)
Wendy Wood ML (1892-1981)

Right:
Ruaraidh Erskine PA/FA (1869-1960)
Graham Seton Hutchison FA/NS (1890-1946)

Thanks so much. This is the left-wing government for Scotland that I created.
Year 1914.

*Edited, thank you all for the suggestions.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

For Scotland, hope it works for you:
Left:
William Gillies LWR/SD (1865-1932)
John Maclean LE/LWR/SD (1865-1923)
Christopher Murray know as Hugh MacDiarmid LE/LWR/SD (1892-1978)
Jack Leckie LE/LWR (¿-?) he was active from 1905 to 1935
Alec Geddes LE/LWR (1878-?) active until 1935
Robert Cunninghame SL (1852-1936)

Center:
Lewis Spence ML (1874-1955)
Compton Mackenzie ML (1883-1972)
William Speirs Bruce ML (1867-1921)
Wendy Wood ML (1892-1981)

Right:
Ruaraidh Erskine PA/FA (1869-1960)
Graham Seton Hutchison FA/NS (1890-1946)

Democratic government for Scotland.

 

[Francis E. Dec]

Point of divergence is 1918, but are you looking for 1918 cabinets or for a later more traditional start date?

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

For England: (leftist)

Henry Hyndman 1842-1921

Henry Hyde Champion 1859 1928

Tom Mann 1856-1943

Beatrice Webb 1858-1943

Robert Blatchford 1851-1943

John Ward 1866-1934 This one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ward_(trade_unionist)

Cecil L'Estrange Malone 1890-1956

Those are some ideas. Tell me if you need more.

Thanks so much. Here is the result:

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

Point of divergence is 1918, but are you looking for 1918 cabinets or for a later more traditional start date?

A plausible government team that can start from the years 1914-1918.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

For England: (leftist)

Henry Hyndman 1842-1921

Henry Hyde Champion 1859 1928

Tom Mann 1856-1943

Beatrice Webb 1858-1943

Robert Blatchford 1851-1943

John Ward 1866-1934 This one https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_Ward_(trade_unionist)

Cecil L'Estrange Malone 1890-1956

Those are some ideas. Tell me if you need more.

Corrected the flag of the English Republic.

This is the source:
https://www.crwflags.com/fotw/flags/gb}rep.html

 

[Ahearne]

Hello ladies and gentlemen.
I am looking for help on some government teams, to be precise those of Wales, Scotland, England, Northern Ireland, in the hypothetical case that Britain came out defeated and dismembered by the Great War of 1914. Maybe some Scots, English, Welsh or Northern Irish he has some information or ideas to give to me.

In summary:

- Year of departure around 1918;
- Three types of government (if possible): Left, Center (Democratic) and Right;
- At least one minister for the ten ministries to be assigned.

That's all. Feel free to write all the hypotheses and characters that come into your mind. Thanks in advance to all of you.

See you soon.

As someone said in the other thread Northern Ireland (which also didn't exist until 1921 when Ireland became independent) would most likely be given to the Irish, especially as Irish nationalists were very pro-German while Ulster Loyalists were anti-German and control of Ireland would make a great base for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe for threatening and keeping Britain in line. An independent Northern Irish nation wouldn't be feasible without large amounts of ethnic cleansing, there's simply too many Irish Catholics there especially west of the River Bann.

Prince Joachim of Prussia would become the King of Ireland, as IRB leaders Patrick Pearse and Joseph Plunkett proposed during the Easter Rising: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Joachim_of_Prussia

Irish ministers:

Left:
James Connolly - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Michael Mallin - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
James Larkin - LE (1876 - 1947)
Jack White - LWR (1879 - 1946)
Constance Markievicz - LWR (1868 - 1927)
Peadar O'Donnell - LWR (1893 - 1986)
Seán McLoughlin - LE (1895 - 1960)
Frank Ryan - LWR (1902 - 1944)
George Gilmore - LWR (1898 - 1985)
Sean Murray - LE (1898 - 1961)

Centre:
Gheoachím I von Hohenzollern (Prince Joachim of Prussia) - SC (1890 - ?) (committed suicide due to the fall of the Hohenzollerns OTL)
Cathal Proinsias I von Hohenzollern (Prince Karl Franz of Prussia) - SC (1916 - 1975)
Patrick Pearse - SC (1879 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Joseph Plunkett - SC (1887 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Éamon de Valera - ML (1882 - 1975)
Roger Casement - SL (1864 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Eoin MacNeill - SC (1867 - 1945)
Cathal Brugha - SL (1874 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Richard Mulcahy - SC (1886 - 1971)
Sean T. O'Kelly - ML (1882 - 1966)
Austin Stack - SL (1879 - 1929)
Desmond Fitzgerald - SC (1888 - 1947)

Right:
Michael Collins - PA (1890 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Eoin O'Duffy - FA (1890 - 1944)
Ernest Blythe - FA (1889 - 1975)
Gearóid Ó Cuinneagáin - NS (1910 - 1975)
Liam de Róiste - NS (1882 - 1959)
Dan Breen - FA (1894 - 1969)
James Walsh - FA (1880 - 1948)
John A. Costello - PA (1891 - 1976)
Denis Fahey - FA (1883 - 1954)
Oliver J. Flanagan - FA (1920 - 1987)

Thanks so much. This is the left-wing government for Scotland that I created.
Year 1914.

View attachment 363290

James Connolly should probably be in Ireland (he was born in Scotland to Irish parents and was an Irish nationalist) unless he fled the country due to anti-left repression by the new Irish government.

 

[Francis E. Dec]

Here's an alternative take on a 1914-1918 LWR Scotland if you're interested. Attached a few pictures for the more obscure folk making up the military staff.

XXXXX1;Head of State;John Maclean;1914;1924;1924;LWR;Die-hard Reformer;High;SCO John Maclean;X
XXXXX2;Head of Government;Willie Gallacher;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Ambitious Union Boss;High;SCO Willie Gallacher;X
XXXXX3;Foreign Minister;Tom Bell;1914;1944;1944;LWR;Biased Intellectual;High;SCO Tom Bell;X
XXXXX4;Minister of Armament;David Kirkwood;1914;1955;1955;LWR;Resource Industrialist;High;SCO David Kirkwood;X
XXXXX5;Minister of Security;Arthur MacManus;1914;1927;1927;LWR;Man of the People;High;SCO Arthur MacManus;X
XXXXX6;Head of Military Intelligence;James Maxton;1914;1946;1946;LWR;Political Specialist;High;SCO James Maxton;X
XXXXX7;Chief of Staff;George Sutherland Aitken;1914;1964;1999;LWR;School of Mass Combat;High;SCO George Sutherland Aitken;X
XXXXX8;Chief of Army;John Leith Walke;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Decisive Battle Doctrine;High;SCO John Leith Walke;X
XXXXX9;Chief of Navy;William John Crawford;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Base Control Doctrine;High;SCO William John Crawford;X
XXXX10;Chief of Air Force;Charles C. Watt;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Naval Aviation Doctrine;High;SCO Charles C. Watt;X

 

[Francis E. Dec]

Also a heads up with regards to LWR England, Malone was, up until 1918, vehemently opposed to socialism.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

Also a heads up with regards to LWR England, Malone was, up until 1918, vehemently opposed to socialism.

Do you have any suggestions on who I can put in his place?

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

As someone said in the other thread Northern Ireland (which also didn't exist until 1921 when Ireland became independent) would most likely be given to the Irish, especially as Irish nationalists were very pro-German while Ulster Loyalists were anti-German and control of Ireland would make a great base for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe for threatening and keeping Britain in line. An independent Northern Irish nation wouldn't be feasible without large amounts of ethnic cleansing, there's simply too many Irish Catholics there especially west of the River Bann.

Prince Joachim of Prussia would become the King of Ireland, as IRB leaders Patrick Pearse and Joseph Plunkett proposed during the Easter Rising: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Joachim_of_Prussia

Irish ministers:

Left:
James Connolly - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Michael Mallin - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
James Larkin - LE (1876 - 1947)
Jack White - LWR (1879 - 1946)
Constance Markievicz - LWR (1868 - 1927)
Peadar O'Donnell - LWR (1893 - 1986)
Seán McLoughlin - LE (1895 - 1960)
Frank Ryan - LWR (1902 - 1944)
George Gilmore - LWR (1898 - 1985)
Sean Murray - LE (1898 - 1961)

Centre:
Gheoachím I von Hohenzollern (Prince Joachim of Prussia) - SC (1890 - ?) (committed suicide due to the fall of the Hohenzollerns OTL)
Cathal Proinsias I von Hohenzollern (Prince Karl Franz of Prussia) - SC (1916 - 1975)
Patrick Pearse - SC (1879 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Joseph Plunkett - SC (1887 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Éamon de Valera - ML (1882 - 1975)
Roger Casement - SL (1864 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Eoin MacNeill - SC (1867 - 1945)
Cathal Brugha - SL (1874 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Richard Mulcahy - SC (1886 - 1971)
Sean T. O'Kelly - ML (1882 - 1966)
Austin Stack - SL (1879 - 1929)
Desmond Fitzgerald - SC (1888 - 1947)

Right:
Michael Collins - PA (1890 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Eoin O'Duffy - FA (1890 - 1944)
Ernest Blythe - FA (1889 - 1975)
Gearóid Ó Cuinneagáin - NS (1910 - 1975)
Liam de Róiste - NS (1882 - 1959)
Dan Breen - FA (1894 - 1969)
James Walsh - FA (1880 - 1948)
John A. Costello - PA (1891 - 1976)
Denis Fahey - FA (1883 - 1954)
Oliver J. Flanagan - FA (1920 - 1987)



James Connolly should probably be in Ireland (he was born in Scotland to Irish parents and was an Irish nationalist) unless he fled the country due to anti-left repression by the new Irish government.

Government team for Ireland allied with the German Empire.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

Here's an alternative take on a 1914-1918 LWR Scotland if you're interested. Attached a few pictures for the more obscure folk making up the military staff.

XXXXX1;Head of State;John Maclean;1914;1924;1924;LWR;Die-hard Reformer;High;SCO John Maclean;X
XXXXX2;Head of Government;Willie Gallacher;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Ambitious Union Boss;High;SCO Willie Gallacher;X
XXXXX3;Foreign Minister;Tom Bell;1914;1944;1944;LWR;Biased Intellectual;High;SCO Tom Bell;X
XXXXX4;Minister of Armament;David Kirkwood;1914;1955;1955;LWR;Resource Industrialist;High;SCO David Kirkwood;X
XXXXX5;Minister of Security;Arthur MacManus;1914;1927;1927;LWR;Man of the People;High;SCO Arthur MacManus;X
XXXXX6;Head of Military Intelligence;James Maxton;1914;1946;1946;LWR;Political Specialist;High;SCO James Maxton;X
XXXXX7;Chief of Staff;George Sutherland Aitken;1914;1964;1999;LWR;School of Mass Combat;High;SCO George Sutherland Aitken;X
XXXXX8;Chief of Army;John Leith Walke;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Decisive Battle Doctrine;High;SCO John Leith Walke;X
XXXXX9;Chief of Navy;William John Crawford;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Base Control Doctrine;High;SCO William John Crawford;X
XXXX10;Chief of Air Force;Charles C. Watt;1914;1964;1999;LWR;Naval Aviation Doctrine;High;SCO Charles C. Watt;X

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

As someone said in the other thread Northern Ireland (which also didn't exist until 1921 when Ireland became independent) would most likely be given to the Irish, especially as Irish nationalists were very pro-German while Ulster Loyalists were anti-German and control of Ireland would make a great base for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe for threatening and keeping Britain in line. An independent Northern Irish nation wouldn't be feasible without large amounts of ethnic cleansing, there's simply too many Irish Catholics there especially west of the River Bann.

Prince Joachim of Prussia would become the King of Ireland, as IRB leaders Patrick Pearse and Joseph Plunkett proposed during the Easter Rising: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Joachim_of_Prussia

Irish ministers:

Left:
James Connolly - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Michael Mallin - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
James Larkin - LE (1876 - 1947)
Jack White - LWR (1879 - 1946)
Constance Markievicz - LWR (1868 - 1927)
Peadar O'Donnell - LWR (1893 - 1986)
Seán McLoughlin - LE (1895 - 1960)
Frank Ryan - LWR (1902 - 1944)
George Gilmore - LWR (1898 - 1985)
Sean Murray - LE (1898 - 1961)

Centre:
Gheoachím I von Hohenzollern (Prince Joachim of Prussia) - SC (1890 - ?) (committed suicide due to the fall of the Hohenzollerns OTL)
Cathal Proinsias I von Hohenzollern (Prince Karl Franz of Prussia) - SC (1916 - 1975)
Patrick Pearse - SC (1879 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Joseph Plunkett - SC (1887 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Éamon de Valera - ML (1882 - 1975)
Roger Casement - SL (1864 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Eoin MacNeill - SC (1867 - 1945)
Cathal Brugha - SL (1874 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Richard Mulcahy - SC (1886 - 1971)
Sean T. O'Kelly - ML (1882 - 1966)
Austin Stack - SL (1879 - 1929)
Desmond Fitzgerald - SC (1888 - 1947)

Right:
Michael Collins - PA (1890 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Eoin O'Duffy - FA (1890 - 1944)
Ernest Blythe - FA (1889 - 1975)
Gearóid Ó Cuinneagáin - NS (1910 - 1975)
Liam de Róiste - NS (1882 - 1959)
Dan Breen - FA (1894 - 1969)
James Walsh - FA (1880 - 1948)
John A. Costello - PA (1891 - 1976)
Denis Fahey - FA (1883 - 1954)
Oliver J. Flanagan - FA (1920 - 1987)



James Connolly should probably be in Ireland (he was born in Scotland to Irish parents and was an Irish nationalist) unless he fled the country due to anti-left repression by the new Irish government.

Ireland: Left Government.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

As someone said in the other thread Northern Ireland (which also didn't exist until 1921 when Ireland became independent) would most likely be given to the Irish, especially as Irish nationalists were very pro-German while Ulster Loyalists were anti-German and control of Ireland would make a great base for the Kriegsmarine and Luftwaffe for threatening and keeping Britain in line. An independent Northern Irish nation wouldn't be feasible without large amounts of ethnic cleansing, there's simply too many Irish Catholics there especially west of the River Bann.

Prince Joachim of Prussia would become the King of Ireland, as IRB leaders Patrick Pearse and Joseph Plunkett proposed during the Easter Rising: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prince_Joachim_of_Prussia

Irish ministers:

Left:
James Connolly - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Michael Mallin - LWR (1868 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
James Larkin - LE (1876 - 1947)
Jack White - LWR (1879 - 1946)
Constance Markievicz - LWR (1868 - 1927)
Peadar O'Donnell - LWR (1893 - 1986)
Seán McLoughlin - LE (1895 - 1960)
Frank Ryan - LWR (1902 - 1944)
George Gilmore - LWR (1898 - 1985)
Sean Murray - LE (1898 - 1961)

Centre:
Gheoachím I von Hohenzollern (Prince Joachim of Prussia) - SC (1890 - ?) (committed suicide due to the fall of the Hohenzollerns OTL)
Cathal Proinsias I von Hohenzollern (Prince Karl Franz of Prussia) - SC (1916 - 1975)
Patrick Pearse - SC (1879 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Joseph Plunkett - SC (1887 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Éamon de Valera - ML (1882 - 1975)
Roger Casement - SL (1864 - ?) (executed after the Easter Rising OTL)
Eoin MacNeill - SC (1867 - 1945)
Cathal Brugha - SL (1874 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Richard Mulcahy - SC (1886 - 1971)
Sean T. O'Kelly - ML (1882 - 1966)
Austin Stack - SL (1879 - 1929)
Desmond Fitzgerald - SC (1888 - 1947)

Right:
Michael Collins - PA (1890 - ?) (killed in the Irish Civil War OTL)
Eoin O'Duffy - FA (1890 - 1944)
Ernest Blythe - FA (1889 - 1975)
Gearóid Ó Cuinneagáin - NS (1910 - 1975)
Liam de Róiste - NS (1882 - 1959)
Dan Breen - FA (1894 - 1969)
James Walsh - FA (1880 - 1948)
John A. Costello - PA (1891 - 1976)
Denis Fahey - FA (1883 - 1954)
Oliver J. Flanagan - FA (1920 - 1987)



James Connolly should probably be in Ireland (he was born in Scotland to Irish parents and was an Irish nationalist) unless he fled the country due to anti-left repression by the new Irish government.

Right/far right government for Ireland.

 

[Korsteeni]

Left-wing England lacks a separate Chief of Navy right now, so I'll submit two candidates:

- Havelock Wilson (1859-1929)
- Benjamin "Ben" Tillett (1860-1943)

As an addition, I've a picture of John Ward in uniform here.

As for Scotland, how'd Thomas Johnstone Lipton as a possible candidate for Armaments Minister sound - obviously with the Administrative Genius trait?

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

Left-wing England lacks a separate Chief of Navy right now, so I'll submit two candidates:

- Havelock Wilson (1859-1929)
- Benjamin "Ben" Tillett (1860-1943)

As an addition, I've a picture of John Ward in uniform here.

As for Scotland, how'd Thomas Johnstone Lipton as a possible candidate for Armaments Minister sound - obviously with the Administrative Genius trait?

Very well. I will update the csv file.

 

[Quinto Fabio Massimo]

I ask you: any ideas for Wales? (14/18)