Immigration w/ a reactionary gvt.

[Serek000]

The government of my country became reactionary, which sucks something awful. Darn free and fair elections.

Anyways, the party does have a "full citizenship" position, but no new immigrants are coming in, despite a fairly steady flow before they took power. Am I just stuck with no immigrants until they're out of power, or is there a way to entice immigrants to come even with a reactionary governing party?

 

[doublezero]

The government of my country became reactionary, which sucks something awful. Darn free and fair elections.

Anyways, the party does have a "full citizenship" position, but no new immigrants are coming in, despite a fairly steady flow before they took power. Am I just stuck with no immigrants until they're out of power, or is there a way to entice immigrants to come even with a reactionary governing party?

It's very unlikely that your country will receive immigrants while that reactionary party is in power. Unless of course you are the USA.

I won't repeat how to get immigrants, it's been discussed in thousands of threads here for years. But even if you're doing everything you're supposed to, immigrants prefer countries run by left-of-centre parties, and reactionary is the furthest to the right in the game.

If the USA didn't exist, if it were conquered, immigrants would disperse around the world more evenly. But it's very difficult to completely conquer the USA before the end of the game.

There is a way to make the game think your country is the USA, so you'll get their immigration bonus. But it involves using a hex editor.

 

[unmerged(42174)]

The government of my country became reactionary, which sucks something awful. Darn free and fair elections.

Anyways, the party does have a "full citizenship" position, but no new immigrants are coming in, despite a fairly steady flow before they took power. Am I just stuck with no immigrants until they're out of power, or is there a way to entice immigrants to come even with a reactionary governing party?

It's totally possible for a country to attract immigrants, even with a reactionary government. Ideology itself has little to do with immigration.

There are often some other issues that will prevent reactionary nations from attract immigrants. First of all, the minority policy. In your case, the party has full citizenship as policy. That given, I assume you are playing as Ecuador.

Besides from minority policy, the religious policy also seems important to attract immigrants. They usually go to nations with pluralism or secularized. Moralism is bad for immigration. As the jesiuts are very moralistic, that might be one of the reasons immigration stopped.

One of the most important things to attract immigrants is the plurality in the nation. If you have researched "ideological thought", there will fire some events depending on the ruling party. If you want immigrants, make sure to have a conservative or reactionary government when you discover this tech. Then all the events that lowers the plurality will fire first (usually when it is near 0 anyway and doesn't hurt it). When you get a liberal or socialist government, there will fire new event which raises the pluralism.

One of your problems might be that you had this tech when you had a liberal party in power, fired all "good" events and then when you got the reactionaries the "bad" events fired and put your plurality back to almost 0 again. Such a thing could hurt immigration very much...

 

[doublezero]

It's totally possible for a country to attract immigrants, even with a reactionary government. Ideology itself has little to do with immigration.

It's possible, but less possible than if he had the Liberal or the Socialist party in power. Even a conservative party would be better than the reactionaries.

Immigrants would prefer a full citizenship Liberal party over a full citizenship Reactionary party. With reactionaries in power, even though they are full citizenhip, immigrants are going to look elsewhere.

If he has 100% plurality and other factors have been met then he might get some immigration anyways. But it will be noticeably lower than if he had a left-of-centre full citizenship party in power.

 

[unmerged(42174)]

It's possible, but less possible than if he had the Liberal or the Socialist party in power. Even a conservative party would be better than the reactionaries.

Immigrants would prefer a full citizenship Liberal party over a full citizenship Reactionary party. With reactionaries in power, even though they are full citizenhip, immigrants are going to look elsewhere.

If he has 100% plurality and other factors have been met then he might get some immigration anyways. But it will be noticeably lower than if he had a left-of-centre full citizenship party in power.

I suggest you prove it!

I also thought that ideology would affect immigration, but so far haven't found any real proof of it. So far, all of them seems to be equal if all other factors are the same. But if you prove me wrong, I'll change my opinion.

A quite heavy problem with reactionaries might be that they will turn the country into a dictatorship within a month or so, revoking political reforms. That's bad for immigration off course...

 

[doublezero]

I suggest you prove it!

I also thought that ideology would affect immigration, but so far haven't found any real proof of it. So far, all of them seems to be equal if all other factors are the same. But if you prove me wrong, I'll change my opinion.

A quite heavy problem with reactionaries might be that they will turn the country into a dictatorship within a month or so, revoking political reforms. That's bad for immigration off course...

I've seen it hundreds of times. Not sure how to prove it without starting a game and trying to get all the possible factors lined up again. I guess you haven't noticed it before. When your country has a conservative government, it will attract less immigrants than if it has a liberal government, ceteris paribus. It's a noticeable difference.

And you're right, a reactionary democracy won't last past the end of the month. It will turn into a dictatorship and immigration will dry up if you're not the USA.

 

[unmerged(42174)]

I've seen it hundreds of times. Not sure how to prove it without starting a game and trying to get all the possible factors lined up again. I guess you haven't noticed it before. When your country has a conservative government, it will attract less immigrants than if it has a liberal government, ceteris paribus. It's a noticeable difference.

And you're right, a reactionary democracy won't last past the end of the month. It will turn into a dictatorship and immigration will dry up if you're not the USA.

Yes, I have seen it happen many times. But all those times, the other factors were present (religious policy, minority policy and plurality) and there is still no clear evidence that the ideology itself is the reason for less immigration. However, if you ask me if a limited citizenship party with moralism (which is common for many conservative parties but not for all) will attract immigrants, I would say no.

See my signature. Maybe there is some way to make a better test, and if someone could do it, I will definitely change my opinion about it.

 

[doublezero]

Yes, I have seen it happen many times. But all those times, the other factors were present (religious policy, minority policy and plurality) and there is still no clear evidence that the ideology itself is the reason for less immigration. However, if you ask me if a limited citizenship party with moralism (which is common for many conservative parties but not for all) will attract immigrants, I would say no.

See my signature. Maybe there is some way to make a better test, and if someone could do it, I will definitely change my opinion about it.

Ok, I looked at your experiment. It's a good start for an experiment. I'm not a scientist, but it looks like you've only tested some of the variables that would make it a foolproof experiment.

1) You gave Chile 100% plurality and all the full reforms, and 'The Party' was full citizenship. You didn't give the USA or other countries full citizenship and 100% plurality at the same time to see if immigrants would choose them instead. If Chile's The Party is Conservative, with 100% plurality and full citizenship and all reforms, would another country with the Liberal Party, 100% plurality, full citizenship and all the reforms steal the immigrants?

2) From 1836 to 1840 your experimental Chile was probably the only country with all those immigration friendly factors present. Later, as other countries got some or all of them, it might have made a difference if your party was Conservative or Liberal.

Your experiment showed the Socialists got more immigration than the Liberals and Conservatives. That might mean the further left the party, the more immigration it will attract. Or it might mean something happened elsewhere in the world the 3rd time you ran the experiment which pushed more immigrants to Chile.

I know you can't test for Reactionary or Communist for more than a month because they would overthrow your democracy and change the experiment.

Your experiment may be totally correct; immigrants may not care whether the party is conservative or liberal. I haven't run an experiment to find out exactly what is happening. From memory, I just remember seeing a clear drop in immigration when conservatives get elected over liberals or socialists, even when those conservatives had full citizenship, like those two Brazilian parties (Conservatives and Liberals). Maybe sometimes it made no difference and I didn't notice. Or maybe party religious policy has something to do with it. It says you used 'pluralism' all three times you rant the xperiment. Did you test to see if there was a difference between pluralism, secularized, moralism, etc.?