Is the seventh star special?

[aino]

All right, here's the deal:

I was playing yesterday my IGC as France, it's like 1660, and England declares war on me (along with their allies Sweden, Iriquois, Pommerania and the Tuetonic Order). I'm annoyed because my ally Venice had already dragged me into a war with the alliance of Spain, Portugal, Austria, Mysore, Morocco and Navarra.

So anyway, I slowly beat up on the continental nations, and I'm allowed the opportunity to let England endure my full wrath. I already control half of England, so I amphibiously assault England, and I take over EVERY English territory left in England - Midlands, Lancashire, Wales, Cornwall, Wessex, Kent, Leinster and Anglia.

So one for every province, plus four for Anglia would make 11 stars.

I'm in the thick of it with England in North America, but eventually I militarily annex the Iriquois (the only nation I've militarily annexed so far this game) and I beat back the English and take a few more of their cities and colonies in North America. I'm also ritualistically burning English trading posts in the Indian area.

After all of this, I go to Offer Peace, and I've only got six stars with England. Hmm... I think maybe they expect their allies to help them, so I launch an assault amphibiously on Sweden, take Svealand and sue for very generous peace, and then do the same for the Teutons and the Pommeranians. Now England is alone, and I've occupied all of the British Isles.

Still six stars. I should have upwards of 15 were they allowed to be shown. I try to annex three specific provinces, and they reject. I take more territories, burn more trading posts, still six stars.

The only reason I couldn't just take all of the English territories is because they've made cities in all of the northern arctic Canadian provinces and put fortresses there. I can't realistically seige these places when their supply limit is only 2, and marching and assaulting 12 of these forts would be a huge drain on resources.

But still, the fact that I occupied all of England should be some form of smashing blow, and I should be allowed to annex three territories. As it is, each time THEY offered peace, they would offer me one territory.

Either way, I stayed at war with them for 10 years, but the War Exhaustion got too much, so I had to only take two provinces. I was annoyed, and very badly wanted to burn Anglia to the ground while it was occupied. Oh well.

So... can anyone tell me what gives?

 

[unmerged(2011)]

I have never gotten a seventh star...six is all I ever get. It seems odd, though, that you didn't get an offer for 3 provinces. Usually the AI will offer 3..even if they aren't the ones you want.

Sometimes, if I'm lucky, I can get them to accept my offer of taking 3. They usually always accept my offer for 2 provinces (especially if I'm kicking butt in the manner you described).

I still don't understand what makes the AI think it is a "good deal" to give up three provinces and I've tried different combinations of three and etc...but it seems random to me. It also seems that you have to wait a few months after you get that sixth star before the AI will even contemplate giving you 3 provinces (which makes some sense)

When I go into a battle, (where annexation is out of the question), I usually end up taking 3 provinces (because the AI offered them to me) or 2 provinces (because I wanted to specifically choose which ones I get and they never seem to accept my demand for 3).

ONe thing I really wish for is that when the AI makes you an offer, it would be really nice to choose whether or not you are acting as the leader of the alliance or not (or whether you want them to act as the leader)

 

[unmerged(1255)]

AFAIK, the seventh star only appears when you have completely conquered a minor nation, and is given the option to militarily annex them. When fighting a major, all you can get is six stars.

 

[unmerged(1645)]

I believe the seventh star only appears when your victory has been so complete that you can annex the loser.

 

[Dark Knight]

They really should alter the star system so that it's possible to get 7 and receive three provinces of your choice.

 

[unmerged(2105)]

Originally posted by pierreluc
I believe the seventh star only appears when your victory has been so complete that you can annex the loser.

I think that's right. I will see 7 stars after I've besieged Navarra (who always seems to vacate Navarra for an adventure in France) with the Spanish. I've stormed one fortress and taken one province but the peace screen shows 7 stars.

I have also noticed that with the Russians I can roll over P-L and occupy all but one of their provinces and they'll insist that two provinces is more than enough. Go figure.

 

[unmerged(2134)]

Originally posted by Dark Knight
They really should alter the star system so that it's possible to get 7 and receive three provinces of your choice.

Based on my experience, the computer AI seems to have the following diplo offers in a war where they are losing:

1) demand 250 ducats from you
2) offer white peace
3) offer the 1st province you conquered
4) offer the first 2 provinces you conquered
5) offer the first 3 provinces you conquered

(Note that they never offer the capital province, but if you occupy it, they are usually more accommodating)

I was in a situation where I had occupied 4 provinces plus the capital, but the third province I wanted was the last one I had occupied, so it wasn't offered to me, and they would not agree to my demands. So I moved my army out of the province I did not want and it was retaken. Since that now reduced me to 4 stars, I had to occupy another province which I did, but now the province I wanted was third in order of date of occupation and the next message offered the 3 provinces that I actually wanted.

 

[unmerged(548)]

So one for every province, plus four for Anglia would make 11 stars.

Too bad it doesn't work this way then

7 starts are only attainable if you controll EVERY city of a nation (YES, that includes Ireland & all those pesky 700+ colonies)

 

[Dark Knight]

Originally posted by rhony2
3) offer the 1st province you conquered
4) offer the first 2 provinces you conquered
5) offer the first 3 provinces you conquered

This isn't true. They often try to often you a less valuable province that you've conquered later in the war instead of a valuable province that you conquered first. For example, in my latest game, I was trying to win control of Mecklenburg from Spain. I took Mecklenburg first and then two of Spain's colonial provinces (city population>700). They offered me first one and then both of the colonial provinces, but never Mecklenburg. Eventually, I managed to get them to accept my peace proposal for just Mecklenburg.

 

[unmerged(2134)]

Originally posted by Dark Knight

This isn't true. They often try to often you a less valuable province that you've conquered later in the war instead of a valuable province that you conquered first. For example, in my latest game, I was trying to win control of Mecklenburg from Spain. I took Mecklenburg first and then two of Spain's colonial provinces (city population>700). They offered me first one and then both of the colonial provinces, but never Mecklenburg. Eventually, I managed to get them to accept my peace proposal for just Mecklenburg.

Hmm, OK, well I have never tried taking colonies as well. When fighting Aden, I only took the capital - the other 3 provinces are level 2-4 colonies. I was given the option to Annex. Of course THEY didn't offer it to me, it came up when I sent a diplomat.
The four provinces I took in my example were from France and I think they were fairly even in population. I wanted Champagne so I could have a territory adjacent to Lorraine that I wanted to Diplo Annex, but to get to Champagne I went through Orleans which I took 3rd (I had taken Normandy and another province I forget as 2 and 1 respectively). The AI wouldn't offer CHampagne until I took my troops out of Orleans and let them take it back. Which of course lowered me to 4 stars so I had to take Orleans over again. Hmm, but shouldn't that have lowered Orleans' population to a point where the would offer Orleans since it would have had a lower population? Argh! This is giving me a headache.

 

[Dark Knight]

I didn't say that the AI will always offer its least valuable provinces first, just that the provinces offered aren't based on the order in which you conquered them. And they often do try to get you to accept less important provinces instead of ones that have important aspects like COTs.