Loss of Strength attacking Low Infra Provinces?

[M@drox]

Playing as Germany in 1.06, I was attacking several of the low infrastructure provinces east of Moscow. I noticed that if the battle is in process during a day change, I lose 50 strength points on my armies. If the battle last two days, I lose the entire army. Is this a bug or WAD?

Thanks

 

[unmerged(17928)]

If you move units into provinces with less than 34 infra they loose strength constantly.
Exceptions: You own that province and can trace a direct supply path overland to your capitol. (So the russian units don't loose strenght, but German units in russia do!)
Furthermore it takes a lot of time to move units in low infra provinces, especially if they are very large. Ever heard of the infamous AI death marches through the Sahara desert?

Solution: Just try to go for the provinces with victory points and ignore those low infra provinces entirely. . .

Regards

Ps. The loss you mentioned seems to be a bit high nevertheless, must be because of the fighting . . .

 

[unmerged(23238)]

Furthermore, retreating from these provinces takes much longer time and your units are very vulnerable during retreat.


Using paras/paradrops could be something to try if you absolutely want to take low infra provinces. I have used that with some local success, but as paradrops are expensive, I tend to use them for provinces with some defending force in them or possibly for extra important provinces with special strategical value.
For an undefended province, you could send in a single fast unit to 'tag' the province and than quickly get out of there. Be sure of choosing the quickest way out. If you can't allow any unit losses, be sure to monitor the units moving in or out of these provinces and be ready to re-strength them more than once during their slow travel. No big problem if you got the manpower anyway and instant max org isn't a tactical requirement.

There could be situations that you need to get a few low infra provinces for theatre/local strategical reasons, but as a rule of thumb, avoid them when possible.

 

[unmerged(3221)]

Storms and frozen can also make any attack into low infra very dangerous. Whole div can get wiped out quickly and lose the battle and then disappear before they retreat back.

Without a screen shot of the combat modifiers or a saved game, I doubt that anyone can be more specific. If you encounter bad weather in a low infrastructure province, get out immediately. I lost 3 Advanced Medium 80 Pz in a low infra when I didn't pay attention to the battle until it was too late to pull them out and save them.

I do, however, frequently attack into low infra provinces so that I can reduce the front line or get to some of the nasty VP provinces like Alma-Ata or Semipalatinsk. Para are the best to take these, but sometimes ground troops have to do the job.

If you get into a battle, keep an eye on it as your troops can quickly die in battle or when retreatng in bad weather situations in low infra provinces.

 

[jdrou]

Ps. The loss you mentioned seems to be a bit high nevertheless, must be because of the fighting . . .

For some possible explanation of this see Math Guy's AAR Winter War Diaries especially the analysis of the battle of Sortavala on pages 3-4.

EDIT: Also see this bug report.

 

[M@drox]

Thank you for these replies but I do not think that they apply like this. I was not retreating. I was winning an easy battle. I was attacking in clear weather with panzers. Losing 45 stength a day does not occur even in a zero infra province. I think that the normal loss would be 15 strength per 24hours based on expeditionary forces to Finland. I reloaded and tried it again for the same and another province with the same result. I even won once within the 24 hours against militia but finished with 44 strength. I think this is the first time I didn't play on Furious/VH. I am using Normal/VH. I do have the saved game. This is the first time that I enountered this in all the patches from 1.04.

 

[unmerged(23946)]

You lose strength based on the amount of men in your corps. I'm not completely sure, but I could have sworn I've seen a stack of 12 divisions lose more strength than a single division in a province. I do know for a fact that this happens in Victoria though, the more divisions you have under a corps, the more attrition you take (if you split the corps into seperate divisions their attrition rates go way down, which doesn't make any sense to me at all).

 

[GrimReaper]

One solution could be to use the Logistics Wizard, they prevent the attrition of just being stationed in a below-34-province.

I beleive that they only work down to 20 infra; if a province has less than this value, it does not matter what special traits the leader has.

I am not 100 percent sure however, can someone confirm this?

 

[Ghost_dk]

One solution could be to use the Logistics Wizard, they prevent the attrition of just being stationed in a below-34-province.

I beleive that they only work down to 20 infra; if a province has less than this value, it does not matter what special traits the leader has.

I am not 100 percent sure however, can someone confirm this?

Nope only one effect of Logistic Wizard

From Leaders FAQ

Logistic Wizard
Oil and supplies consumption -25%

Ghost_dk

 

[unmerged(12303)]

The provinces are bugged or something like that at 0:00 you lose strenght even if you have a direct line to your capital (berlin in my case). It was pretty irritating as I could not station troops there as they would dissapear...

F

 

[GrimReaper]

Nope only one effect of Logistic Wizard

Ghost_dk

Ok, thanks.

 

[unmerged(15561)]

The provinces are bugged or something like that at 0:00 you lose strenght even if you have a direct line to your capital (berlin in my case). It was pretty irritating as I could not station troops there as they would dissapear...

F

This a problem with 106?

 

[M@drox]

I don't know if it isolated to 1.06. I have been playing since 1.04 (year ago) and its the first time I noticed it.

 

[unmerged(12303)]

yea it has been up since quite some time IIRC. I dont know why it happens..

F

 

[boromir]

yea it has been up since quite some time IIRC. I dont know why it happens..

F

But the losses happen only during battle is that not the case? ie. you fight in a low infra province, that has a land connection with your capital, and at 0:00 the attacker loses lots of strenght due to attrition ...

 

[unmerged(12303)]

IIRC I was losing troops even if I was not fighting.. I dont have a save so dont remember.. and it was a very "nervous" game so I might have not noticed that I only lost troops at 0:00 if they were in combat.

F