Overpriced DLC

[malkindav]

I will start with a statement that I am a HUGE Paradox fan. I've started playing HOI2 in 2004. Since then I spent in a pre Steam era and Steam era combined something like 2000-2500 hours in PDX games combined. I buy most of PDX games and dlc's and kind of addicted . I think that PDX doing a great job in producing unique and deep games. PDX commitment to keep the games alive for years is outstanding. Let alone the replay-ability. PDX are listening for fan's reviews and adjust the games accordingly.
But over the past years PDX moved to a policy of DLC overloading. Every little aspect is getting it's own DLC priced at least for 10$, plus unit pack and music pack for additional 5$. If god forbid they do a bit deeper change then the DLC is 15$ and in the past year we having 20$ DLC for a improving a certain aspect (managing China and Japan) of one game. In total if one want to keep CK2 and EU4 updated he needs to spend 300$ combned (maybe I'm mistaken by a few bahts). The new kid in the block, Stellaris, was launched less then a year a go and already the sum of all it's DLC's in 75% of the original game cost. Should 8 oversized ships and a story that the chance of launching it is maybe 0.01% (1% if a science ship enters a black hole system) cost 25% of the original's game price?
EU3 was a great game at the end and had 4 DLC's, HOI2 had also 3 or 4 and was outstanding. Why should we pay a yearly fee of 40$ for each game? They don't make a new game every year neither launch a new game engine. They just change some parts and then add some other little parts (sailors) so why are we need to pay 100% of the game's price every year?
I don't like feeling like a walking wallet. I believe that launching 2 20$ DLC with some changes and not a total overhaul of the games in the same date is a bit like someone let the guard down falling asleep in the marketing department and showed us that we are wallets which are being listened to.

 

[Texas_Jack]

You don't need to buy all the DLC. So far, for Stellaris, I've purchased the story pack and Utopia. For a year old 40 dollar game, I don't think that's unfair.

If you've played Paradox games for this long, surely you remember the good old days of manditory expansions. Remember vicky2, and all the anarcholiberals that would spawn at the dawn of the 20th century? That was fixed by the Civil War xpac. Without buying that xpac, you would always get anarcholiberals, and if you install base vicky2 today, you get the same issue. CK2, which was the first game to get the "horrible" dlc treatment, is still being updated to this day. The base game. So you don't need a single piece of dlc to get bug fixes and some game tweaks.

How can you possibly want to go back to manditory xpacs if being a "walking wallet" is your big concern? Why should I be fored to buy an xpac just to get core game fixes? Nothing is making you buy the DLC now, except your desire for all the new shiny extra features added.

I own both eu4 and stellaris. I can only afford one purchase this month, so I made a choice. Life is about making choices. Do I demand a business change to fit what I can afford? No, I accept that this is the state of things, and deal.

 

[Matt714]

They have market specialists. As long there's demand, they're going to keep the supply and price point.

 

[Cpack]

You pay 20$ for a Pizza and 3 beers which give you fun for 60 minutes and takes 5 min to prepare from one person.....nobody complains

You pay 20$ for a DLC/Add-on which give you 100 hours additional fun and takes hundreds of hours to prepare by lots of people.....many people complain


What is overpriced?

 

[aruon]

i can't remember where, but paradox actually has stated how they their DLCs. and it's a fair system. i think it's mostly based on how impacting the content is and the overall work put into it.

 

[Joe-Z]

If you're a huge Paradox fan, why the rant? The reason I answer is, because I noticed you say things about Stellaris that are just not true. For the sake of fairness towards the devs, I'd like to point out some of those things. For example:

The new kid in the block, Stellaris, was launched less then a year a go and already the sum of all it's DLC's in 75% of the original game cost. Should 8 oversized ships and a story that the chance of launching it is maybe 0.01% (1% if a science ship enters a black hole system) cost 25% of the original's game price?

The story you are talking about (Horizon Signal) was free DLC.. Furthermore, if you're talking about Leviathans when you say "8 OS ships", there's also the Conclaves and War In Heaven in addition to the space monsters in that mini-expansion.

I believe that launching 2 20$ DLC with some changes and not a total overhaul of the games in the same date is a bit like someone let the guard down falling asleep in the marketing department and showed us that we are wallets which are being listened to.

To me it seems that Utopia is closer to an a total overhaul than "some changes". The pricing, as PDX have said, correlates with the cost of development, that's cool.

 

[delra]

If $20 is a problem it's probably indication to evaluate life choices rather than company's pricing policies.

 

[Augustus93]

Some people can't afford or don't want to spend 20 bucks for a DLC. That is fine, you would still get a nice patch that is completely free. And the patch includes much more than bugfixes and balancing. And you could always buy the DLC later, for up to -75% cost reduction. And the cosmetic DLC and music DLC does not impact the game in any way and is only eye/ear candy.

 

[CookieMonk]

Just remember the DLC helps "Paradox" to continue with expanding their games for years on in, unlike other company`s who move on to other projects after awhile. I do understand your concern, i am 61yo and not working because of health problems and living off very little income, so in my budget list i have "Paradox" listed as "ENTERTAINMENT" (my only one) and even when there is no new game or dlc, i still put something in that fund "3, 5, 10 dollars or whatever. So what i am saying is, prepare for the releases in advance. I am not talking down to you, just trying to suggest an idea, of course it is up to you. Thank You.

 

[ju44]

Do we need this thread every dlc release?

 

[SeraphimZero]

I can only speak for Stellaris and HoI4 but I, too, think the DLCs are overpriced. I did preorder both games and knew that a lot DLCs would follow (and that especally Stellaris wasn't really finish). But the Prices for all DLCs are to high. I know I dont need to buy them and I get free stuff etc. But for me these two games where the last preorders from Paradox.
I thought the Leviathan and Plantoid DLCs where a bit overpriced but now you want 20€ for Utopia? Thats half the price of the base game and for this hasn't enough content.
Sadly overpriced DLCs seems to be the new standard in games not only at Paradox.
And at least HoI4 had an Expansion Pass, but the first DLC was a bit overpriced, too.

 

[Ingros]

I have 1500 hours of ck2 and around the same for eu4... and stellaris also has already couple of 100... i would say that the price per hour is fantastic ... for other games like witcher or mass effect im around 1 euro per hour of gaming...

BUT: this time i also was turned down due to the price... i still bought utopia because i wanted to play stellaris again... but for mandate of heaven i'll probably wait for a discount... the first time for a major dlc from pdox for me... even though i would still get a decent price per gaming hour

 

[fyrkrans]

i can't remember where, but paradox actually has stated how they their DLCs. and it's a fair system. i think it's mostly based on how impacting the content is and the overall work put into it.

I think this blog entry by Johan is what you mean.

 

[aruon]

I think this blog entry by Johan is what you mean.

well the post i'm thinking of is from 2015 or early 2016 i think, but yeah.

 

[Axe99]

well the post i'm thinking of is from 2015 or early 2016 i think, but yeah.

Aye, I remember a post in 2015 or 2016 as well - I think it was in response to pricing discontent about one of the EU4 expansions (Common Sense maybe? Might have been another).

On topic, the whole DLC/free patch system works very well - I've got a pretty small 'fun' budget, and it's very hard to go past the value in Paradox expansions for me personally (obviously, when it comes to entertainment, different people will get different value from different things) and find the price at launch to be more than fair (I also do a little modding, and have done some coding in the past - enough to know that there's a fair bit involved in what gets put out. Of the two that came out last week I've only played Utopia, but there's no doubt that involved some serious work.)

That said, if the price doesn't suit, it's worth keeping in mind Paradox does regular sales. HoI4, released less than a year ago, is 40 per cent off right now (I just swung by the store and the sale is still on). Together for Victory, out less than five months ago is 10 per cent off. Reaper's Due is 33 per cent off, and Conclave and most older expansions for CK2 and EU4 are 50 per cent off, and there are bundles for peeps that want everything that save more. In a year's time, there's a fair chance Utopia and Mandate of Heaven will be 33-50 per cent off.

 

[Buladelu]

Price will only change with the market condition. If they think they can somehow get more money by lowering the price. Maybe if it becomes a universally accepted opinion, repeated everywhere. Even then it will probably only happen if sales go down.

It's not anything anytime soon. In this thread and many others you see people defending their right to pay more.

 

[TotalKnowledge]

I learned to love Paradox Games. I really love them, but...

I live in Brazil, a place where 90% of the people try to piracy everything. I don´t agree with that for two main reasons: 1-) It´s not right, because if you can´t afford a car you don´t steal it (or at least should not). 2-) As a developer, I know how much effort is necessary to build a piece of software and how much it cost.

Anyway, I bought (and keep buying) games that I want to play (Witcher 3, Civilization VI, Stellaris etc). I will keep paying for DLCs that I want to have, but I can´t have it all (at sametime for now), but I need to say it´s very expensive for me. Maybe, just maybe, Paradox could do some kind of Pack, with the old DLCs with a more accessible price.

I know that a lot of people will say "You don´t need all the DLCs to play the Vanilla Game.", but, in true, they add a lot of nice features to play the game.

Just to finish, it´s just my thoughts, and I will keep playing and buying Paradox Games, because they are smart games and I like to spend my time on them and above all, I want to show respect and support for the developers and the amazing work they do with these games.

 

[Ujin]

Personally, I do not like the constant underdevelopment of new DLC, imbalances, new bugs and bugs that have not been corrected for years.

 

[CookieMonk]

Aye, I remember a post in 2015 or 2016 as well - I think it was in response to pricing discontent about one of the EU4 expansions (Common Sense maybe? Might have been another).

On topic, the whole DLC/free patch system works very well - I've got a pretty small 'fun' budget, and it's very hard to go past the value in Paradox expansions for me personally (obviously, when it comes to entertainment, different people will get different value from different things) and find the price at launch to be more than fair (I also do a little modding, and have done some coding in the past - enough to know that there's a fair bit involved in what gets put out. Of the two that came out last week I've only played Utopia, but there's no doubt that involved some serious work.)

That said, if the price doesn't suit, it's worth keeping in mind Paradox does regular sales. HoI4, released less than a year ago, is 40 per cent off right now (I just swung by the store and the sale is still on). Together for Victory, out less than five months ago is 10 per cent off. Reaper's Due is 33 per cent off, and Conclave and most older expansions for CK2 and EU4 are 50 per cent off, and there are bundles for peeps that want everything that save more. In a year's time, there's a fair chance Utopia and Mandate of Heaven will be 33-50 per cent off.

You are absolutely right, could not agree more.

 

[CookieMonk]

Personally, I do not like the constant underdevelopment of new DLC, imbalances, new bugs and bugs that have not been corrected for years.

I hope the community won`t turn on me, remember i am an old man. (61) lol, but i do wonder some time are we (customers) "the bug testers" or do they bug test dlc before release. Yes, i do expect some bugs, some time, but not every time. I love the games and dlc too much to stop buying them. (thought i should say that before someone says it)