Problems/bugs v2.5b59

[Zemurin]

Here' is the list of stuff I found so far, feel free to add your own.

1. The melee disparity is not fixed yet. Lvl 25 knight with a hammer+shield does about 200-260 damage, same lvl warlock does 1.3K. Monsters are about 4k big, so, melee damage (even crits) are irrelevant - you can't actually kill anything via melee when the same monsters can crit my knight through almost 1k DR for cca 1.8k damage (50/50 hp/mana).

2. I noticed this while loading the game: Party was in Red Wastes, and when I clicked on the shop icon I got the Chest inventory. Confused (chest isn't available there) I closed it and clicked shop again. Again Chest showed up. Then I closed it and clicked active quests, and when I closed those only then shop came up as expected after clicking the icon for the third time. Afterwards I couldn't reproduce this.

3. In dungeons debuffs can linger: Big room, event order was trap - combat - sarcophagus. Trap dealt 4 bleeding debuffs, which were all healed during subsequent combat. When I opened the sarcophagus, the guardian came out and all 4 bleeding debuffs returned upon combat start.

Will keep posting when I find more. Thanx for listening.

 

[Zemurin]

4. Blue wind devil still doesn't appear in the bestiary. Needs checking if it's been thrown out instead of the greater doppelganger (vis a vis VR quest requirements).

 

[Zemurin]

Points 1-4 are still open in v2.5b61

5. Crystal Shriek deals double damage to enemies (200 vs 100)

6. Crystal Shriek is not blocked by anything than Dwarven innate DR, which is calculated wrong - it removes 40% instead of flat 40.

7. Damage multipliers from Broken Balance are still calculated as additions rather as multipliers. Ninja doing triple attack with 58% in a Broken Balance room will deal 58-50 = 8% damage instead of 58% * 50% = 29% damage.

8. Same issue is probably affecting weakness debuff on players.

10. Flaming skull damage-after-death shares same problem as Crystal shriek - it deals 300 to players flat, regardless of DR, while dwarves get 180.

 

[AndrewT]

I've now logged bugs on 1, 3, 7/8. I confess I don't understand 4, 5, 6 or 10 well enough to log a coherent bug report.

I won't log one for 2 unless it can be reproduced.

 

[Zemurin]

Please allow me to elaborate in detail. Also pardon me using wrong terminology, I've fixed the wrong names in this post.

4. Greater Doppelganger and VR:

Virtual Reality series of quests requires the player to kill mobs in order to fill every page of the bestiary to 100%. Once done they get to fight a special VR battle against only boss-lvl mobs.

This quest used to require the player to kill, among all other mobs, doppelgangers and swamp bandits, which appear nowhere on the main map and can only be found in the Back to the Source dungeons as random fights. Because finding them was insanely frustrating, they got removed from both the bestiary and requirements for the VR series of quests.

The Greater doppelganger was not removed. Greater doppelganger can in fact be found in the High School boss room but farming them is also very frustrating because they have insanely high initiative and they need to be killed within the first round in order to count as "Greater doppelganger kills" instead of "random monster they shapeshift to kills".

This would not be an issue (normally) but melee nerf means only spellcasters or a SD ninja can kill them (within the first round) and chances of getting 2 spellcasters (mage/psion/warlock) before the doppelgangers are slim. Thus the grinding is frustrating and requires a lot of fleeing and reloading the boss room.

This is more of a balance issue than a bug.

5. Shattering Shrill

Screenshot from v61:

See the description for "10 damage"? It has not been updated after rebalance. This is a typo.

This effect causes players to receive 100 damage and enemies to receive 200 damage. The disparity 100-200 is a bug.

6. Dwarven Fortitude and incoming unblockable damage

Damage from shattering shrill is not blocked by anything *except* Dwarven Fortitude (passive).

This may or may not be working as intended. What is *not* intended is that Fortitude removes 40% of the incoming damage instead of a flat 40 damage reduction.

The end result is the same: 100 DMG - 40% DMG = 100 DMG - 40 DMG, however the issue becomes apparent with Flaming Skulls:

10. Flaming Skulls vs Fortitude

Flaming skulls throw themselves at the players once killed and do a bomb-type damage to adjacent players for 300 damage. Dwarves receive 40% less damage (180 DMG) instead of 260.

This is a separate entry that demonstrates why previous bug is in fact a bug (which is not readily apparent on its own).

11. Monsters and DR

Enter humble Ice Troll, a lvl 35 monster that sports 5010 Health and damage reduction of 3. 3 DR is negligible since players now do up to 1.5k damage via various means. In fact no monsters had their DR updated.

Gauntlets of Strength (blue dragon kill reward), which grant DR bypass are thus meaningless.

 

[AndrewT]

Some feedback from the devs:

1. Plain melee attacks are not meant to be in par with activated skills. Warlock is a DPS class where the Knight is mainly a tank.

4. There is some monsters, such as the Ill Wind (the blue wind devil) and Dragons that don’t appear in Bestiary. They are still in the game.

5. The Shattering Shrill deals 200 to everybody in the room, but character DR reduces it. As DR states, it mitigates maximum of 50% of damage - that’s why characters usually get 100. My Warlock with DR 49 took 151 damage. Thank you for noting the error in the effect description. (Description will be updated in the next patch)

6.Tested this and couldn’t get the received damage go under 100.

7. Damage multipliers are calculated correctly. What might be confusing is that the information text of Ninja’s Shadow Chain shows the damage of the three attacks combined. Also, the displayed damage is not updated to show the effect of Broken Balance. So, to get the damage dealt by a single hit of Shadow Chain one must divide the displayed damage by three, and then divide it by two if Environment Effect Broken Balance is present.

10. The Flaming Skull deals 600 to a target and adjacent characters. DR mitigates the damage normally here (up to the maximum of 50%). There was no difference wether the character was a dwarf or not, the damage didn’t go under 300.

11. Monsters and DR. This is a design decision. We decided to leave monster DR values unchanged as scaling them up would lead to a situation where a player allocates skill points to a new skill and seeing damage one digit damage numbers or even a zero.

 

[Zemurin]

1. If the devs think the current balance is fine, then fine by me. Other builds are now available to work around the minuscule influence Might/lvl has on damage compared to weapon bonus. In essence reddit is seeing nothing but Rapier of DPSing builds. Whether you have 3 might or 11 might makes about 3-5% difference in the final tally.

4. Ill wind was never the problem. Problem is that the Greater Doppelganger is still in the Bestiary and is required to be killed to 100% to unlock VR quest. Lesser doppelganger was removed from both, this one hasn't.

5-6. Your explanation makes sense and I withdraw this issue. Thank you for explaining.

7. No, they are broken. Look:

What we should be seeing is approx 700 damage, divided by half. In reality the ninja always does exactly 0 damage. This is because the damage is multiplied by (0.44 - 0.5) instead of 0.44 * 0.5. Negative damage is (properly) rounded to zero.

When I pump the Shadow chain to 54% I start seeing low double digit damage:

First strike - regular hit, second strike - critical for approx 2x regular damage, third strike was another crit for 45 damage.

If we assume this character does approximately 900 damage on three shadow chain hits, and that each should do about 300 damage, multiply that by (0.54 - 0.5) then the result is what we're looking at. 300 * 0.04 = 12 damage.

I have a strong feeling this issue is present in the same or similar form when you replace Broken Balance with regular Weakness debuff - a weakened ninja doing Shadow Chain also does suspiciously low amounts of damage.

10 - 11. Thank you for clearing these up.

 

[Zemurin]

Good news, I've managed to reproduce 2.

2. Shops display old forms (equipment chest or shop pages) initialized in previous location when there's nothing to sell at current location.

I went to Zeroth, opened equipment, closed it, moved to Plains of NULL, opened shop and all three shop tabs (eq/trinkets/consumables) are displaying my equipment chest.

In another example:

What you're looking at is the last opened form at Reorienting Village shop (notice the fish and rice), which is now loaded in Vault's shop. To reproduce, just open the shop in Origami, close it, travel to vault and open shop again. Clicking on Eq/trinkets/consumables tabs does nothing.

My theory is that old locations that didn't have shops are initialized improperly and probably shouldn't even have shop icon. However the shops in dungeons (which was introduced with the update) properly initialize and sell a subsection of interesting stuff at killer prices.

This issue only occurs in non-dungeon locations that did not have a shop prior to the update - so basically every location other than Spawn Village, Big Town, Zeroth Point, Reorienting Village or Expandria Castle.

 

[Zemurin]

Re: 7 - weakness + broken balance causes players to deal 0 melee damage.

As foreseen by math two posts above, whenever a weakness + broken balance is combined the player will do zero damage. I still haven't managed to test sub 0.5 shadow chain + weakness combo but I suspect it too will show 0 damage.

 

[Zemurin]

9. Scripting issue - the Nameless Horror questline skips to a random location:

After defeating the monsters at the Mountains of Accent, the questgiver (Monk) appears with news. He then teleports to Nameless bridge without explanation and once players go there directs them to the Laboratory to continue the quest.

His quest should (probably) be given there and then at the Mountains of Accent, or if that's not possible, tell the players to meet him at the Nameless bridge - although there is no reason to go there as the quest doesn't require players to do anything at the bridge.