Question regarding Theocratic vassal titles.

[rboetto]

I am playing Iron Man mode in very hard difficulty, so I am unable to test this specific interaction without potentially screwing myself.

I'm in quite a challenging spot but below my domain limit, so I'm looking to do a bit of tyranny and take my theocratic vassal's titles away (there is a castle holding in his county).

However, I am not sure if that automatically destroys the theocratic title, or if I need to do that manually? Will I be able to add the castle holding to my domain?

I've definitely done it before but I'm foggy on details and the stakes are higher now.

 

[majdavlk]

as far as i know, titles do not have government, but characters have

 

[rboetto]

as far as i know, titles do not have government, but characters have

The titles don't have a government per se, but they have capitals. The county capital for Bremen is a temple holding, which I cannot use.

There is a barony there that has a city holding -- Verden. So what I needed to do turn the temple title into barony-level and the castle title into county-level.

(I figured out how to do it btw. Small icon with an up arrow towards a crown in the holding panel)

 

[DiabloDeVille]

The titles don't have a government per se, but they have capitals. The county capital for Bremen is a temple holding, which I cannot use.

There is a barony there that has a city holding -- Verden. So what I needed to do turn the temple title into barony-level and the castle title into county-level.

(I figured out how to do it btw. Small icon with an up arrow towards a crown in the holding panel)

Changing which holding is the county capital can help you determine what gov a person will adopt when granting the county to a courtier

 

[apollo1989vieten]

It would be good if you could create a theocratic vassal. It is what happened historically and why bishoprics have much land associated with them.

 

[Pendables]

It would be good if you could create a theocratic vassal. It is what happened historically and why bishoprics have much land associated with them.

You can but it's basically an exploit and if your religion isn't revocable it's a huge pain.

 

[apollo1989vieten]

You can but it's basically an exploit and if your religion isn't revocable it's a huge pain.

The investiture controversy needs to be added. The emperor making counties run by bishops and abbots and selling the right to have those counties to the highest bidder. The pope won't be happy, which would mean the historical friction between the secular rulers and the pope. Also, for coronations, you could be required to either give or confiscate land and give it to a theocratic vassal in order to please the church.

 

[DiabloDeVille]

You can but it's basically an exploit and if your religion isn't revocable it's a huge pain.

Its not an exploit at all, its how medieval Europe actually worked, which paradox should focus on, instead of meme content

 

[Pendables]

Its not an exploit at all, its how medieval Europe actually worked, which paradox should focus on, instead of meme content

I am talking about the game where you can fire your realm priest and switch a county's capital to the temple then give it to someone to make a theocratic vassal. I call it an exploit because it basically removes all of the gameplay involved with feudal vassals while giving you more money.

 

[DiabloDeVille]

I am talking about the game where you can fire your realm priest and switch a county's capital to the temple then give it to someone to make a theocratic vassal. I call it an exploit because it basically removes all of the gameplay involved with feudal vassals while giving you more money.

You can no longer inherit the land from the vassal, you cant use vassal contracts like minting rights to buff their dev for a university, they can still join factions against you, whats the exploit? Are count tier republics also an exploit?

 

[kgptzac]

You can no longer inherit the land from the vassal, you cant use vassal contracts like minting rights to buff their dev for a university, they can still join factions against you, whats the exploit? Are count tier republics also an exploit?

The exploit is when the game is paused and granting title to a character whom you just fired as your court priest is not properly registered by the game as a "normal character", and granting land to this character which normally should result in a non-theocratic vassal, would instead be causing that character to become a theocratic ruler. Creating new theocratic vassals from granting them a county that already has a capital on a temple holding is not an exploit.

 

[rboetto]

You can no longer inherit the land from the vassal, you cant use vassal contracts like minting rights to buff their dev for a university, they can still join factions against you, whats the exploit? Are count tier republics also an exploit?

Point about factions is only partially correct. Theocratic vassals can't join dissolution factions, and can't be selected for claimant factions. Not sure they can join liberty factions.

 

[apollo1989vieten]

Point about factions is only partially correct. Theocratic vassals can't join dissolution factions, and can't be selected for claimant factions. Not sure they can join liberty factions.

They can join claimant factions but not liberty factions.

 

[rboetto]

They can join claimant factions but not liberty factions.

That's right.

They can't be the claimants though, if I recall correctly. Haven't played in a minute.