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unmerged(4163)

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Jun 1, 2001
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Here, I don’t know if these are bugs or not, or if they've been mentioned somewhere, but here are my problems.

As England:

(1) I’ve been a long time alliance with Burgundy. Then, around 1470 or so, they decide to attack Geldre, which had been my vassal for about 20 years and was being nice and quiet. Burgundy demands that I honor the alliance. When I said no, I suffered for it and got to sit there and watch my vassal die horridly. When I reloaded the game, the same thing happened around 1470. This time I honored the alliance, maintained my status and watched my old friend Burgundy eat my vassal alive. No CB’s or anything came up for me.

(2) The computer is set on keeping me 100% decentralized, yes? No matter what I do, something always happens to move that slider back down. Most notably is the “Cities Demand Old Rights” event. I’d choose to lose the three stability points, but this event happens every 15 years or so and I’m getting a little tired of it. If I do manage to get the slider up two clicks towards centralization, then the nobles demand old rights (or whatever it is) comes up offering me an option of losing stability or moving 2 points away from centralization. So I’m always 100% decentralized.

(3) Brittany, as a vassal and a military ally (and refusing to be annexed no matter what)

If I take over a province from the enemy that had formally belonged to Brittany, the vassalage is gone. Brittany didn’t cancel it (or, at least, no message pops up), nor did they lose stability. They just stopped being my vassals with no penalties. This is around 1475, so maybe that’s an historical thing? If so, where’s the message telling me what happened? And how come they get to do that without losing stability or making anyone mad?

For example: If Brittany and I go to war with France and France gets Mainz in a seperate peace agreement with Brittany, then I go in five years later after the truce and take Mainz back, Brittany's vassalage status vanishes. Upon reloading, though, I noticed that the vassalage remained intact if I left Mainz alone. This happened each time.
 
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Originally posted by nacho
(1) I’ve been a long time alliance with Burgundy. Then, around 1470 or so, they decide to attack Geldre, which had been my vassal for about 20 years and was being nice and quiet. Burgundy demands that I honor the alliance. When I said no, I suffered for it and got to sit there and watch my vassal die horridly. When I reloaded the game, the same thing happened around 1470. This time I honored the alliance, maintained my status and watched my old friend Burgundy eat my vassal alive. No CB’s or anything came up for me.

This occured in EU1 too. If you leave your vassal outside of your alliance, there is nothing to stop other nations from DOW'ing on it.

Have you tried giving Geldre a guarantee?

(2) The computer is set on keeping me 100% decentralized, yes? No matter what I do, something always happens to move that slider back down. Most notably is the “Cities Demand Old Rights” event. I’d choose to lose the three stability points, but this event happens every 15 years or so and I’m getting a little tired of it. If I do manage to get the slider up two clicks towards centralization, then the nobles demand old rights (or whatever it is) comes up offering me an option of losing stability or moving 2 points away from centralization. So I’m always 100% decentralized.
This would appear to be an unlucky string of events. There are already some comments in the GenII forum about the frequency of random events. It's not restricted to England, and the AI doesn't have it in for you alone :)

(3) Brittany, as a vassal and a military ally (and refusing to be annexed no matter what)
There's no guarantee that a 10 year vassal will ever agree to annexation. If they have a large military, are secure, and have a decent treasury then they may not feel the need for your benevolent rule.

You might want to declare war on Brittany's neighbor and hope their military and treasury suffers as you allow them to be overrun. A good thrashing by France might convince them of your magnificence.
 
Re: Re: Some probs with England

Originally posted by sean9898
There's no guarantee that a 10 year vassal will ever agree to annexation. If they have a large military, are secure, and have a decent treasury then they may not feel the need for your benevolent rule.

You might want to declare war on Brittany's neighbor and hope their military and treasury suffers as you allow them to be overrun. A good thrashing by France might convince them of your magnificence.

Also if they are your vassal for a considerably lengthly amount of time beyond 10 years the odds of them accepting annexation increase dramatically.
 
Okay, the guarantee gave me a bit more freedom to react. That's still annoying, though. "So I know we've had an alliance for 50 years, but we're gonna have to kill your vassal today. Um...sorry?"

Looks like the evil random events problem is being addressed, so I'll hope for changes in future patches. It keeps happening. These cities get their old rights restored once a generation. I hate that one the most.

Brittany remains stubborn, sean. Down to two provinces and what do they do? Each province gets a fine arts academy and they start building a few zillion troops. So that explains that, they're sitting on a fortune. I think that's also being addressed in later patches, yes?
 
Originally posted by nacho
Okay, the guarantee gave me a bit more freedom to react. That's still annoying, though. "So I know we've had an alliance for 50 years, but we're gonna have to kill your vassal today. Um...sorry?"
I agree that this is annoying. I have had to go to war countless times on my own vassal in games, and been unable to come to their aid when attacked. Hopefully the guarantee will prevent your ally from doing the dirty deed, if not let me know and we will add this to the list. While an ally might sometimes decide to still DOW on your guaranteed vassal, it should be a rarity.

Brittany remains stubborn, sean. Down to two provinces and what do they do? Each province gets a fine arts academy and they start building a few zillion troops. So that explains that, they're sitting on a fortune. I think that's also being addressed in later patches, yes?
There have been reports of some free money issues. If these are also happening to the AI then that might explain Brittany's lavish spending.

As well as relations, there is a random factor, I'll check in the Beta forum if anyone is having similar annexation problems.

One last try- I used to always give 250d with a diplomat, then exactly 1 month later offer annexation. Used to work more than if I just asked without giving the money.

I forgot to ask, you do share a common border with Brittany?
 
Originally posted by sean9898
I agree that this is annoying. I have had to go to war countless times on my own vassal in games, and been unable to come to their aid when attacked. Hopefully the guarantee will prevent your ally from doing the dirty deed, if not let me know and we will add this to the list. While an ally might sometimes decide to still DOW on your guaranteed vassal, it should be a rarity.

Well, my allies are behaving themselves... I have noticed, though, that if someone attacks the vassal while the guarantee is in place, I don't get to go after them with total freedom. Royal marriage, same faith, etc. Should the guarantee override the penalties there?

As well as relations, there is a random factor, I'll check in the Beta forum if anyone is having similar annexation problems.

And I had forgotten the other part of my question. When I retook one of Brittany's lost provinces years later, they got a free ticket out of the vassalage. Stability at 3, no longer a vassal -- and loaded with cash. I'm going to go hurt them, I think.

I forgot to ask, you do share a common border with Brittany?

Yes, I do.