Survey Results?

[HFY]

It looks like the survey threads aren't sticky anymore, so I assume the surveys are finished.

Have the results been tallied anywhere?

I'm curious to see the stats.

 

[Losttruppen]

I think we know the results of the Trade one; too bad, considering all the news lately. Trade War DLC with international Trade Routes and some backstabing themes; blockades, embargoes, grey/black markets.

I would have preferred them figuring out a pathfinding method that doesn't murder CPUs considering this is also a huge problem with Fleets and all the AI civilian ships.

 

[permeakra]

I think we know the results of the Trade one; too bad, considering all the news lately. Trade War DLC with international Trade Routes and some backstabing themes; blockades, embargoes, grey/black markets.

I would have preferred them figuring out a pathfinding method that doesn't murder CPUs considering this is also a huge problem with Fleets and all the AI civilian ships.

I recall that in some comm one of the developers said that it's not pathfinding that is a problem, but how often it has to be done with different restrictions.

 

[Nyrael]

I think we know the results of the Trade one; too bad, considering all the news lately. Trade War DLC with international Trade Routes and some backstabing themes; blockades, embargoes, grey/black markets.

I would have preferred them figuring out a pathfinding method that doesn't murder CPUs considering this is also a huge problem with Fleets and all the AI civilian ships.

I am pretty sure this change has been planned before the surveys, Eldrain even hinted at what will be changed before 2024 was over.
The surveys are for what comes after 2025. For now, it is being changed to something that is less annoying and less inconsequential (and I expect something that can be built upon later on). Currently the problem isn't in performance as much as that it affects performance and gives basically nothing back. Worst is, the current system doesn't even feel like a trade system.

And some things like Trade being a resource that affects your trade purchases makes a lot of sense. Eldrain also hinted that it will be connected to logistics, which should make this system a lot more significant than what we have now... which is just an icon with a number that generates Energy Credits.

 

[Losttruppen]

something that can be built upon later on

What was Trade 1.0 then?

The Galaxy Map interaction was the only interesting thing it did, and I feel is the only thing worth building on. I was hoping since they first added it that it would be used to actually move the resources I produce, instead of them magically appearing in my empire's bank at the end of the month like Crypto-Minerals. Taking that away does not fill me with hope for logistics to be tagged on, that just sounds like Naval Capacity by another name.

I agree the current Trade system has a high cost for almost no benefit, but scrapping it after we have dealt with this negative performance hit for 6 years assuming it would be built upon, it's a bit annoying to hear they will just dumb it down and we need to keep waiting; this could have been done in 2019 and saved the players and Paradox a lot of trouble.

The Surveys asked what would be a dealbreaker to remove from these systems, I guess I'm just a little salty I assumed they wouldn't remove the system altogether. It's the only aspect of the economy that interacts with the Galaxy Map and the Micro-side of the Military system(aside from Bombardment), I was hoping they might build on that.

 

[ladydzra]

It looks like the survey threads aren't sticky anymore, so I assume the surveys are finished.

Have the results been tallied anywhere?

I'm curious to see the stats.

We got SO MUCH feedback that it's going to take us a bit to parse it into meaningful bits. We'll share insights when we can!

 

[HFY]

We got SO MUCH feedback that it's going to take us a bit to parse it into meaningful bits. We'll share insights when we can!

Yay!

Thanks for the update.

 

[Ikael]

I think we know the results of the Trade one; too bad, considering all the news lately. Trade War DLC with international Trade Routes and some backstabing themes; blockades, embargoes, grey/black markets.

I would have preferred them figuring out a pathfinding method that doesn't murder CPUs considering this is also a huge problem with Fleets and all the AI civilian ships.

Wow, when was that info about the trade stuff revealed? I thought it was going to be addressed in this week's Thursday Dev Diary (!)

 

[M@ni@c]

I liked the fact that the existence of a trade system forced you to be more proactive in war. You couldn't just sit safely on your fortress worlds, and let the AI control some unpopulated (by them) unclaimed systems, as that could tank your trade income and economy.

As a partial compensation, I hope the devs enact the following:
If the starbase of the system of a planet is controlled by the enemy, it reduces the productivity of all trade jobs in that system by 100%, multiplicatively.
If the starbase of the system of a sector capital is controlled by the enemy, it reduces the productivity of all trade jobs in that sector by 50%, multiplicatively.
If the starbase of your capital system is controlled by the enemy, it reduces the productivity of all trade jobs in your empire by 50%, multiplicatively.

That would still somewhat encourage you to retain control over your territory during a war.

 

[Imp0815]

I am pretty sure this change has been planned before the surveys, Eldrain even hinted at what will be changed before 2024 was over.
The surveys are for what comes after 2025. For now, it is being changed to something that is less annoying and less inconsequential (and I expect something that can be built upon later on). Currently the problem isn't in performance as much as that it affects performance and gives basically nothing back. Worst is, the current system doesn't even feel like a trade system.

And some things like Trade being a resource that affects your trade purchases makes a lot of sense. Eldrain also hinted that it will be connected to logistics, which should make this system a lot more significant than what we have now... which is just an icon with a number that generates Energy Credits.

I also got this information or understanding about this whole spiel. But I find it questionable as we might have many different issues after one year. Maybe they just remain the same if the upcoming changes don’t solve any of them or introduce new ones that overshadow the current issues. But we will see…

 

[Losttruppen]

Wow, when was that info about the trade stuff revealed? I thought it was going to be addressed in this week's Thursday Dev Diary (!)

From DD #366

Trade
The current Trade system, with its constant calculations around pathing and pirate generation, is another that has a disproportionately high impact on performance compared to the benefit. We’re simplifying that one significantly and making Trade act as a standard resource. Trade will also be used to represent general logistics capability and as such, will likely become available to gestalt empires for these logistical purposes. Again, we’ll cover this in a future dev diary.

More info on Trade is coming in Thursday's DD, but I took "act as a standard resource" to mean it would now follow the instant gratification omni-availability of all the others, which is probably the worst part of the 2.2 economy/Market and something I find quite immersion breaking and gamey. I felt a bit of hope back in 2018 that the Trade Route system might be used to further ground the entire economic system into the tangible space of the Galaxy Map instead of just nebulous digital currencies. Logistics and refinement should take into account distances and volume in my opinion, and not have Resources available immediately everywhere in your Empire or the whole Galaxy.

Interconnection between mechanics has also been a major complaint since Utopia set such a high bar, particularly over the last few DLC, so removing it here is a bit sad.

We'll see on Thursday what the plan is; I may have misinterpreted the statement, but I was disheartened by that paragraph.

 

[Ikael]

From DD #366


More info on Trade is coming in Thursday's DD, but I took "act as a standard resource" to mean it would now follow the instant gratification omni-availability of all the others, which is probably the worst part of the 2.2 economy/Market and something I find quite immersion breaking and gamey. I felt a bit of hope back in 2018 that the Trade Route system might be used to further ground the entire economic system into the tangible space of the Galaxy Map instead of just nebulous digital currencies. Logistics and refinement should take into account distances and volume in my opinion, and not have Resources available immediately everywhere in your Empire or the whole Galaxy.

Interconnection between mechanics has also been a major complaint since Utopia set such a high bar, particularly over the last few DLC, so removing it here is a bit sad.

We'll see on Thursday what the plan is; I may have misinterpreted the statement, but I was disheartened by that paragraph.

What a pity. Even if I have little love for the current trade system, I too, would have liked a trade route-based system instead. But it seems that we won't have one since it takes too much of a performance hit. Well, we will have our answer today, one way or the other.