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May 5, 2002
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Ahhh i finally got people to join one. Anyways 8 player MP starting Tuesday Feb 25 (most likely....maybe earlier). Players are

Loewe-Sweeden
Joro-France
Mr Lifford-Ottomans
Legate-England
Kyran-Spain
Basil-Portugal
Humbelone-Austria
Myself-The wise and powerful Pope

We play Sundays and Tuesdays usually, we may squeeze one or two others in.

Rules

1)Only convert to CRC once
2)2 colonies in development in every area of the world (West Africa, East Africa, India, Far East, North America, Canada, Carribean(islands+SE US), Central America, Brazil, West Coast NA)
3)35BB limit
4)Peace offers must be answered in 1 month
5)limit 5RM with AI
6)limit 3MA with AI
7)15 CC and Naval shipyards(combined)
8)15 manufactories
9) you MAY convert Pagans in ToT
Peace offers you can do anything (force them to disarm, release vassals, limit ships etc....).
 
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The Treaty of Morea:

The Sultan of the Ottoman Empire: His liffordness and the Holliness of the Pope of Rome have agreed on the following split of the Country of Venice:

The his holliness, the rich Italian provinces of Mantua, Veneto and Istria.

The Sultan shall receive the Islands of Ionia, Corfu, Cyprus, Crete as well as the port citys of Ragusa and Dalmatia.

The treaty is only valid if Veneto is annexed by 1540 and is valid up too 1550.
 
Treaty of Tyrol:

The papalcy and Austria have agreed on a permanent fixed border between the 2 countries.

Austria will gain the province of Lombardia.
The Papal states our given rights to all other Italian Provinces.
The papal states will also help support Austria in the keeping of the Austrian Netherlands if Austria asks.
 
Ok, might as well do this also since I did grant some people some land in ToT

The Treaty of Catalonia

The Empire of Spain shall formally grant the lands of Martinique to its sister kingdom Portual as a token of friendship and good will.

ARTICLE ONE:

If the island of Martinique should be threatened or taken by an nation whom is either the agressor or defender will be seen as a direct threat to Spain itself and dealt with in harsh matters.

ARTICLE TWO:

If Portugal fights against Spain the island of Martinique shall be seen as rightfully Spain's and no other nation's.

ARTICLE THREE:

No currency or favors were exchanged for Martinique and should remain so. However, Martinique will never be sold to another nation unless back to Mother Spain.

Would you sign this treaty for the greater benefit of both Portugal and Spain?

- Eternal King of Spain, Kyran
 
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Treaty of Catalonia

Once again we thank our Iberian brethren for granting us this valuable port. We of course ratify all the above articles, God be with the Spainiards for their generousity in granting us this strategic port.

King Manuel of Portugal
 
Opening Session
1492-1502

Well as the ruler of the Papal States I had a rather complicated session.

I prepared for a war that was supposed to kickoff in 1492 (The standard DoWs) but I never got them..well in 1492. This including taking a loan from Austria but that was paid back.

I build my millitary and promoted some tax collectors. I got a random event for a new fort in marche.

France took aggression towards Naples..taking Apulia a move not liked by his holliness but there was nothing I could do.

In 1496 I moved in and Annexed Napoli.

I bought maps off portugal in 1497 and set up 2 TP in Brazil. I looked around for an alliance but nobody entered a formal one...though the Ottomans were quite helpful throughout the whole period.

I did finally get those DoW'd...
Tuscany, Milan, Venice (who was now just a shred of itself, but still had 70K even with just Mantua and veneto)

Milan took Romagna from me (but Austria inherited them and is going to give me it back in 1505)


Tuscany got paid off (all 3D)

Im still at war with Veneto but the Otts are going to step in soon, so I will hopefully get Milan.

The next session I have a few deals to execute so it will be a time of great growth.

I just gotta start up my trade :)
 
opening session

England



Irish rebellions......... free Eire....... Annexed Eire.


Sold Calais to france for reasonable peace in the hopes of a bigger purse and peaceful relations.


Tax Collectors Promoted in all English cores.



War against Scotland...... Peace, Scotland is left poor and with only their capital left.


Exploration..... Eastern Coast of North America discovered, settlement is ongoing.
 
The Treaties of Catalonia

The Empire of Spain shall formally grant the lands of Martinique to its sister kingdom Portual as a token of friendship and good will.

ARTICLE ONE:

If the island of Martinique should be threatened or taken by an nation whom is either the agressor or defender will be seen as a direct threat to Spain itself and dealt with in harsh matters.

ARTICLE TWO:

If Portugal fights against Spain the island of Martinique shall be seen as rightfully Spain's and no other nation's.

ARTICLE THREE:

No currency or favors were exchanged for Martinique and should remain so. However, Martinique will never be sold to another nation unless back to Mother Spain.

AMENDMENT I:

Barbados will be given to Papal States under the same conditions.


El imperio de España 1492 - 1502

1492 -

After finally pushing the Moors from our coasts and burning their corpses Spain is clean. Many revolts resulted but were justly put down by El Capitan. Surely, these are great times for Spain.
A crazy man who claims the world is round came to the court late last year. He wants the King and Queen to give him ships to prove it is round. Many think he's insane but the King and Queen say different. He now sails toward the horizon for Spain.

1493 -

The insane one returns. Word is he found land, possibly the forign lands of Chipango or Cathay. We now send others to colonize and bring forth riches.

1497 -

The Spanish army under command of El Capitan have brought Navarra, a small kingdom in the north under our soverignty. There is no other nation to the east neighboring us but France now. We wish them many peaceful years with mother Spain.

1501 -

Santo Dominigo, once a small colony now thrives as the epicenter of our ever expanding Empire in the new world. We now name this land the new world ever since Amerigo Vespuci realized that it was neither Cathay nor the Spice Islands. There are peoples in this new land but are weaker and know nothing. All they do is attack and act as a torn in our side when is comes to colonization.
 
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Austria keeps a wary eye on the heathen powers

Not to much happened, I picked up milan through an event. Along the way I also picked up Romagna as it had been taken by Milan for the Pope. I will turn over the Romagna territory back to the Pope in 1505 as specified by our mutual border treaties. I would love to keep it but I have a treaty and will give it back.
 
Notes of the Court Stenographer

Herein are excerpts from the royal meetings anno dominae 1503

Manuel: So then, proceed with your assessments on the state of the realm.

Lord Sérgio Luís Marques Postiga (Foreign Advisor): Our policy of friendly neutrality has so far proven a success, my king. By keeping ourselves free from continental entanglements, through avoiding alliances and binding ourselves in marriage and treaty to the major houses of christendom, we allow ourselves to pursue trade in the great new lands our mighty adventurers have discovered, to bring wealth to ourselves and the blessing of the church to the heathen. I advise we continue with this course of action.

Carlos Alberto Barbosa Castro (Lord of the Admiralty): Still, I must once again express my displeasure at the wanton selling of our priceless maps to the French and Pope. These actions can only weaken our position abroad.

Postiga: We have been over this before. The influx of gold to our coffers has greatly aided in our expansion, buying ships and supplies to build our colonies in brazil and abroad. Furthermore, despite our friendships with the great powers, it is undenyable that others would envy our knowlege and what they could not secure by gold, they might attempt to take by force. Better we show our goodwill and gain something in return, rather than risk disaster...

Manuel: Enough. I have made my decision already on this issue, and Postiga's arguments are sound. We are not Spain who can defend her interests by sheer force of arms; trade and cooperation must be our watchword. What then of developments on the continent?

Postiga: War has been prevalent. England has been active and successful in crushing the gaelic resistance to her dominance of the isles, France and Spain have as well been active, incorporating the smaller realms of Lorraine and Navarra into their respective spheres of influence. Italy has been ablaze, with the Turks making major inroads by humbling the Venetians and annexing most of their possessions. in the north the Scandians and Muscovites each try to assert their dominance of the baltics.

Manuel: The Turks seem unstoppable. It is troubling that they occupy our holiest lands with no sign of relief. Still, if the great powers stand aside, certainly our small land cannot be expected to act. We have troubles aplenty with these moors on our doorstep.

José Fernando Correia Lima Loureiro (High Marshal of the Realm) :
Just so my Lord! Let us smite the foolish Moroccans in the name of our most glorious Lord Christ!

Manuel: A noble goal of course, Lourerio. But their alliance with Algiers places them in a strong position. Any war with them would be long and costly, and its success difficult to guarantee. They will have to wait until a more propitious moment. No. We will continue to pursue peace in Europe. What, though, is the news of our new colonial enterprises?

Cristóvão Guimarães (High Merchant and Head of the Mercantile Guilds): My Lord, our investments in Brazil have begun to pay back the massive sums we have invested. Cargoes of sugar and this strangely compelling herb 'tobacco' now arrive in Lisbon on a regular basis. Traders from England, Spain, France, and the mediterrean call regularly in our capitol to bring these luxuries back to their lands, and the associated taxes aid our cause significantly. Our main base in Bahia has grown rapidly, as converted natives have lent their strength as laborers, producing cigars and rum for the glory of God and Portugal!

Manuel: This is good news. But what of our efforts to find India and China?

Guimarães: Evidently progress has been made, but these lands are farther off than we initially believed. I do have a report from the valiant Duke of Alberquerque that has just arrived.

Manuel: Yes? Well present it! This news should not have been delayed, it is of utmost interest to Portugal.

Guimarães: My apologies, great one. I will read it to all.

Alberquerque, Jan. 22nd, 1502:

With the skillful navigation of the wise da Gama, we have rounded the horn of Africa and headed once more north in search of India. The natives on the coast have proven extremely numerous and hateful, with no concept of the glory of our Lord Jesus. We have been forced to proceed north without risking landfall to refresh our supplies. As we have proceeded we found the seas to the east of Africa dominated by trading ships of a strange land of infidels known as 'Oman'. Our efforts to trade with them were greeted with haughty words of rebuff and threats of death if we tried to interfere with their monopolies of local trade. My liege, I must say their actions indicate they prefer war with us rather than trade. Something must be done, we cannot sail safely further east with these dogs at our backs. Great and fierce was my anger at the arrogance of these fools, but I was forced to swallow my hate at the sight of their numerous flotillas, though of a crude make and lacking our powerful cannons. I plead with your majesty for the permission to smite these unbelievers! Send me ships with reinforcements so that I may lead us to Glory and force these dogs to accept the overlordship of Jesus the savior!

Silence ensues for a long moment

Manuel: This is troublesome news. It appears that if we wish to realize our dreams of trade with the east, we will perforce come into conflict with these heathens. Still, we must have a greater idea of what we are up against. Our superior valor and strength of arms will not avail to ensure victory if we are greatly outnumbered so far from home. Loureiro, we must press forth with these new firearms the Spainish engineers have described to us. If these 'Omanis' do not exhibit too great a strength, let us send our valiant explorers ships filled with men equipped with these new firearms to teach them a lesson and secure our trade routes. We shall meet again when De Gama and Alberquerque can give us a clearer picture of this matter and make fitting plans.
Now then, let us sample these 'cigars' brought back so recently from Bahia...
 
wine, women, sex and glory ...

France started off as usual ... quick attack on Lorraine, vassalization and invitation to the alliance. Then it was time to do what French citizens do best -- sex! In the process it was discovered that some illegitimate child was born in Naples and off the French troops went! Afterall, what is a king that does not defend its citizens?

In a dozen years or so, the government of Brattany decided the French were a lot more cultured and better educated, so they joined our fine realm. In the meantime, Calais was obtained from the Brits.

In exchange for sexy models and plain old cash, some fine maps were obtained from the king of Portugal. Turns out he shared the same maps with the Pope ... oh, since the conversation started about the Pope, here is some scoop on him.

The Pope has very liberally used his power. First, he excommunicates the French king and cancels the alliance between the two nations. Then he goes and threatens the French king during his crusade against Naples. Why, is a total mystery! Afterall, the Pope got Naples itself thanks to the French king. Yet, that's not where the Pope stopped! He goes as far as to invite the heathens from the south into Italy!

But that is still not all! The Pope is a colonizing madhouse! He starts by asking for two provinces in Africa! Who am I to give him any provinces there? As if I own them ... I tell him no deal. Then he comes back with a better deal! He now wants 5 provinces! And not just normal provinces, he wants the rich provinces! Funny guy our Pope is! Makes you wonder whether we should remain Catholics ....

France's colonial policy has been, well, non-existent. Although we have the maps, our populace is too drunk most of the time, and gets fucked up by all the natives. As a result, no provinces have been colonized succesfully outside of the friendly region of Africa ... The king is contemplating whether or not to ban alcohol as the means to encourage sobber colonization ...

Austria is still holding onto French territory, which is never nice. So is Spain ... Hmmm, those will need to be given back to their mother lode ....
 
The Treaty of North America

His holliness the Pope and his majesty, King Legate of England have agreed on how to share there intrests in North America.

The Pope of Rome is allowed to annex the weak pagan nation of Lenape while the King of England is then granted all lands North of Lenape as well as all the lands of the Huron tribe and all lands inbetween there and the coast to the Atlantic.
 
Session II 1503-1525

An ugly time for the Pope.

It started out great, took money from Venice. Bought Apulia, was given Romagna back and annexed Siena. Corsica went independent, and I put a T.C. in Romagna. I even started expanding in Africa with Lougo and Ovambo.

But in 1514..my goverment fell...mass revolts..grrr.

Siena and naples went independent. I did annex Siena again in 1517 (with the war factory)

I needed alot of loans..from Austria and OE (combined 330)...so pay back the bank so my inflation is pretty high and my techs are pretty low. I did pay Austria and the bank but OE is still outstanding.


But our exploations went though the roof.
We setup trade posts in:
Santee, Carolina, Bahamas, Bermuda, Curango, Muni, Casa, ovambo, Lougo in order of newest-oldest.

Then Denmark DoW'd..in 1424 I had to give up Romagna (again)

i stil havn't taken lenape

Im about to get a lvl 4 colony in Barbados (thanks for pumping it france :) )

I still havn't improved my economy..but i sent out my first few traders.


Just gotta clean up the dirt...
 
The Sultan has power, but not riches. That goes to the great Western colonization nations, sadly, but never to the Ottoman Empire. What I lack in that department though is made up for by high manpower, equivalent land tech, and superior tactics. I've succeeded in converting several provinces, and many more are in-process and quite likely to succeed. With monthly cash flow exceeding 100 ducats or so, I can afford to keep my manpower down to 0. Which I'll probably be doing for the next year or so until I can secure the annexation of Krain and a few other provinces from Hungary. Krain, of course, being the last Slavonic-cultured province not under my control, aside from Ragusa, but they'll fall shortly too. Austria of course wants to save her Hungarian inheritance . . . . but I doubt she'll be able to. She has one higher land tech, 12, but that doesn't have superior stats to 11, really. And I probably have 50% higher cash flow and twice the manpower. Same CRT level, and I probably have significantly higher morale to boot, with my DP settings and close to free subjects. It will be an interesting war, one that I'm far more prepared for than Austria. For those interested, what prompted this war was an arrogant quip from the Austrian player that he wouldn't deal with subs. My goal is to teach him that he should deal with someone who can ruin him utterly. By the way, I'm allied to the Papal States & Spain, both of whom have joined in the war.

1525_MrLifford.JPG
 
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El imperio de España 1503 - 1525

1503 -

With threats of attack by the French for Rousillon the king took the oportunity to gain better relations with the French. Rousillon was given to France for 100 ducats and war was adverted between the French and Spanish peoples.
Many colonies were reduced to mere trading posts as natives made a mad rush against Spanish expansion into the new world.

1516 -

After much colonization the Spanish Empire was ready for taking on the much larger mainland natives. A quick attack into the North American land of the Creek resulted in a large cash bonus and a large section of land. These heathens were safe for the time being.
A conquistador named Hernan Cortez was given the job of taking an expedition into Central America and bringing the populace under Spanish sovereignty. Through the first few months the campaign went well but soon turned ill when Cortez had only a thousand cavalry and was cornered in the Aztek capitol with no way out. Reinforcements never made it, they were turned back by pirates several times. Deciding he'd better take the money and run Cortez drew up a peace treaty wherein they gave him half a thousand ducats. The young conquistador was welcomed back in Havana with open arms and told of his story of fighting off armies thousands of times bigger than the Spanish expeditionary army. Fighting the overwhelming odds gave him and his other thousand comrades a place as heros in the eyes of God and the Spanish peoples.

1524 -

Having finally beaten back the inundation of pirates the reinforcements arrived in Havana to see they were to late. The army stood in Havana waiting for the monarch's next decision. It was to take on the Maya on the Yucatan penninsula. Within less than a year the Maya were beaten into submission and brought under the Spanish crown.
Other political squabbles were being born on the other side of the Caribbean Sea. The French began to expand into the Eastern Antillies causing the Pope to be furious when he was told that the island of Barbados was being colonized by the French. The Treaty of Tordesillas told boldly that the islands the French were colonizing were Spanish by right. Barbados was quickly taken and instructions for taking the others are beind decided.
 
Austrian Dipolmacy is grand

Well 1505 came along, I turned over Romagna to the Pope as our border agreement specified. As well Artois and French Comete was turned over into French hands.

Over the years I was able to dipoannex Bohemia, Helvetia,Wurtemburg,Wurzburg, and Bavaria. My BB score is a low 7 points for these achievements.

Along I way I have fought a couple wars with the OE, they have been basically interested in robbing me of my Hungry inheritance.

Ohh yes as for the sub that is running OE I believe he goes by JohnMK. He has gone out of his way to threaten me and what is that charming quote in his post.

"My goal is to teach him that he should deal with someone who can ruin him utterly"

All this banter because I will not make treaties with subs, hey sub man get over it. Since your just subing for one night perhaps your not in position to accurately judge the situation and make treaties that will out live your involvement.

Since you want to act in the role of teacher, let me suggest a brush up with grade school math. Our BB limit in this game is 35 points, scroll up to the first post in the thread you will find the rest. I had a look OE is at 43 BB now, Dave told he left with less than 5 points. As your plotting my ruin, I suggest you figure out how you will release 8 points of BB away starting next session if you are subing again. Sure you can grab large parts of Hungary, go to it. That will not ruin Austria, you have 1 shield on Austrian land. Hey maybe you can grab it, maybe not.

The question becomes how will you ruin me, since I will not give you peace. That means you will have capture my provinces and force my government to fall. The funny thing is that means you pay 3 BBs for every one province you take from me. Interesting for everyone you take you will have to release 3 provinces in return. Hey, you will ruin OE long before you ruin Austria.

BTW since you kept telling me that Dave gave you full authority you can surely explain to Dave how you single handily destroyed OE's chance to win this game. Considering that OE is all ready well over 35 BB's OE will never expand beyonds its core provinces now. 8 years for one BB point, that means OE will have its BB back to zero in 350 years, good job sub.

I dont appreciate impotent threats, and considering that your at 43 BBs your doing nothing for a very long time. So stick that in your pipe. Oh yeah if your want to threaten me perhaps you should tell me something that I will fear. I got it, tell me you want to sub for me. :) cheers.
 
Re: Austrian Dipolmacy is grand

Originally posted by HumbleOne
Oh yeah if your want to threaten me perhaps you should tell me something that I will fear. I got it, tell me you want to sub for me. :) cheers.
Click to expand...

This kind of personal tone isn't really necessary. As a sub I was called in the last minute, nobody told me there was a thread, rules, etc., nothing like that. Only in the middle of the game after I'd annexed a few provinces from the Hedjaz, Mamelukes, etc., was I told there was any rule regarding BB points, and after that point I made no further expansion. I'd hope nobody would be this regimented about the rules, that OE is 8 BB over the limit. If it's a problem I can just edit the save such that I never took anything from Hedjaz or Algiers. 8 BB points gone, 4 provinces lost, not a big deal.

It's unfortunate that at the very beginning you took a negative tone with me. Dave/MrLifford made it very clear to me that I had full powers, yet you would barely talk to me. Part of the Eu2 MP-experience is that you will have to learn how to deal with the fact that not every player in a permanent game can make every session. They will be a fact of life. You will have to deal with stand-ins. If your cop out is "I don't deal with subs," that's just not very realistic. The game goes on, it continues, you have to talk and discuss. Justify it any way you wish, i.e. there's a new ruler, the old one's sick for a while, assasinated, his son's in hiding and a regent's in control, etc., whatever it takes.

In any event, I've told you what I wanted for the OE. Who knows what Dave/MrLifford wants. If you want to negotiate a settlement with him that's fine. I'd urge him to take Krain and no less, in return for a totally unmolested Hungary to you. I've offered you as much many times, only to hear "talk to the hand." Well, finally, when the lines of communication are cut, you either relent, or pusue war. Since Hungary is occupying Krain at the moment, that's whom I declared war upon. If I get peace with her, I can get peace with you, so there's no way you can hurt the Ottoman Empire unless a -5 stab truce breakage is in your plans, in which case it'll hurt you more than Dave or me.
 
Diplomacy between Austria and OE 1503 to 1525

Aside from the fact that your subing I did not particulary trust your intentions.

I think it was 1504 when you DOW'ed Hungry, this was my first taste of your diplomacy and it was pretty bitter. After you declared you informed me that we had an agreement that you would only take 1 province from hungry. Lets set aside for the moment that generally agreements like this are made before a DOW. That way people are communicating and are not under fire, land transfer rather than peace deal. So I thought to myself I dont know the quality of this JohnMk character, what can it hurt one province is pretty cheap as a way to test his intentions. I only intervened in hungry after you had half the country under seige. At the end of that little war you took 3 provinces from Hungry, what happened to your promise of one province. Anyways I consider myself quite lucky since my learning your intentions only cost Hungry 3 provinces.

After that little stunt I was not impressed by the quality of your threats or treaty agreements. My personal favorite bit of diplomacy I think happened in 1524, where you graciously told me that you had no intentions on Hungry if I gave (Siebenburgen)Transsylvania to you without a fight. Your right what was I thinking turning down this wonderful offer. Considering that I felt your word was no good because of the 1504 promise of only 1 province. Call me cycnical but I suspected your motives for this offer and all the other offers that preceeded it since 1504. Let me see if I turned over Transsylvania to you, could it be that your intention was to let the vassal go and then bugger my inheritance of Hungry? Really now like I am about to trust you after that bit of skullduggery in 1504.

As for this war you just declared in mid 1525 on Hungry I strongly suspect more of the same. Try to capture Transsylvania quickly then release it, thereby bugger my inheritance. Hey I dont really begrudge you this, it annoys me yes but then I understand the reasons behind it. What does annoy me is superifical argument that your peaceful intentions were rebuffed, I am wondering how many people would trun over Transsylvania in 1524 to a person who already had broken their word once. Please dont hide your sinister intentions behind lack of diplomacy, demanding Transsylvania in 1524 is insulting.
 
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