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Guinnessmonkey

Guinnessmonkey

Après moi le Déluge
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Feb 27, 2002
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1861 ACW events

Vicky already has a few events included in it that deal with minor ACW situations (burning of Atlanta and the Shanandoah, Unionist resistance in Texas and Tennessee, etc.)

IMHO all these events could use a good tweaking.... I meant them, paricularly the Atlanta nd Shanandoah event, to trigger only if the war lasted long enough to get mean and nasty. If Atlanta falls after a short, nearly bloodless Tennessee campaign in late 1861 then I doubt anyone would have burned it or destroyed much southern rail stock. What's the point of destroying infrastructure if it will soon be yours anyway?

Thing is, I'm not sure how to do this... Is there a good trigger to make sure that the war is nasty beore the events happen?

I believe that the ACW has flag attached to it... Perhaps if we use a flag triggered upon a historical secession (i.e. not the "Early Secession" event) then we should change these events so that they never trigger before 1864.

The resistance events, of course, should happen regardless. :D

Also, are there any ACW events people can think of that should be in? If they're terribly specific to the historical ACW then we can make them '61 only events... Otherwise we'll just add them to regular VIP. :)

BTW, please check to make sure events aren't already in before posting ideas here..... Several, like the above mentioned, as well as "Ben Butler in New Orleans", "The Burning of Lawrence, Kansas", and man other ACW flavor events are already in. :p
 
Oh, and another thing folks need to ponder: Alliances and the ACW

1. Trent Incident

Right now we do have a few events for the Trent Incident.... It give the USA player the option to leave the Trent alone and the UK player a chance to flame the situation into a war.

Should these events be broadened so as to be more complex?


2. Euro pops reaction
Should we have a series of events for European powers to ensure that they won't lightly choose to ally with the Confederacy during the war? A lot of UK pops, for example, would have been infuriated to see their country fighting to support the slaveowning south... An event doing this which would fire upon allying to the South/DOWing the North during the war (perhaps with the oppertunity to quickly get out of the war once you realize your "mistake") might be needed for every major power (or potential major power).

3. Southern Diplomacy
Should there be a series of events allowing the south to try to persuade Euros into the war? IMHO they had just about zero chance of success, but should the player be able to jump through the hoops just right (and cross his fingers) and be successful?

If so, how should these events work?
 
Re: 1861 ACW events

Originally posted by Guinnessmonkey
Vicky already has a few events included in it that deal with minor ACW situations (burning of Atlanta and the Shanandoah, Unionist resistance in Texas and Tennessee, etc.)

IMHO all these events could use a good tweaking.... I meant them, paricularly the Atlanta nd Shanandoah event, to trigger only if the war lasted long enough to get mean and nasty. If Atlanta falls after a short, nearly bloodless Tennessee campaign in late 1861 then I doubt anyone would have burned it or destroyed much southern rail stock. What's the point of destroying infrastructure if it will soon be yours anyway?
Click to expand...

A question: if things can be fixed by tweaking existing events without changing texts, shouldn't they be incorporated in official patches, not in mods?
 
Re: Re: 1861 ACW events

Originally posted by Grosshaus
A question: if things can be fixed by tweaking existing events without changing texts, shouldn't they be incorporated in official patches, not in mods?
Click to expand...

Yhea, but I'd like to use this forum for a good reevaluation of the ACW events... If there's a consensus that an event should be changed to do x, than I'll submit it as a bug in beta. :)

Otherwise it may just be a matter of adding new events. :)
 
Slave culture

I mentioned this several times in other threads...what are everyone's thoughts concerning the fact that every single slave in the Confederacy in 1861 has Dixie as his culture?
 
I think it´s the best solution to have them dixie:

- you miss years of assimiliation in 61 compared to 36.

- only if you decide on "emancipation" in the game event it will make a difference.
 
Perhaps a change to African Minor is more accurate, however:
It would show that the CSA would NOT absorb the slaves or ex-slaves into wider society no matter how long they were around, and furthermore would make the game more interesting in the long term, as there would be an actual risk of slave revolts (granted that that could probably be served by militancy-raising events, but I don't like to be able to promote my emancipated slaves to clerks and capitalists; it makes the game too easy.)
 
Perhaps we could include events for specific battles, triggered by the Occupation of Certain provinces.

Ex. If the Federals occupy Fredericksburg, a new trigger comes up that if the Federals LOSE that province, a 'Battle of Fredericksburg' event pops up, which would raise Union War Exhaustion, and decrease Confederate War Exhaustion.


The way i see it, most of our events would deal with raising/decreasing War Exhaustion for the both sides, depending on Succesful/failed battles.

CvM
 
I agree with Maximilian. I think having them as Dixie is actually quite accurate because the US Congress made the importation of African slaves illegal sometime in the 1820's I believe, and although smuggling certainly did continue, just about all of the slaves in America at the start of the Civil War were 2nd generation "Americans" due to regular old reproduction of the Africans already enslaved in the South. Almost none of the slaves maintained their African heritage/culture simply because they were slaves and they lived horrible lives that didn't allow them to do much at all besides eat, work, and sleep. And in reality, slave revolts did not occur often, rather it was the fear of slave revolts that had the greatest effect on fearful Southerners. One possibility is making a way that POPs could slowly assimilate into the dominant culture of the area at the time over a generation or two (25-50 years) because that's usually what happens in real life anyway.
 
I realize this thread is mostly dormant, but I need to add something.

1) The slave trade was abolished in 1808.
2) Slaves ought to start with a mix of African and Dixie cultures, and be assimiated either by event or gradually.

Steele
 
But if you make them all Dixie there will be no way to adress these POPs for events. What if the CSA win their independence and at some point free the slaves? You might want to make events later on that give blacks more or less money, or affect their mil and consc, such as sharecropping or Jim Crow-style events...
 
The slaves never integrated that well into society after they were emancipated, so why not make them african minor culture (or make up an African-American culture is that's possible).
They were clearly not dixie, or else they wouldn't have been slaves...

I wonder what the culture African Minor means, does it just denote the many ethic groups that are too numerous yet relatively insignificant to include as bona fide cultures?
 
I agree with the above. Why not just change a lesser-used unimportant culture to "African-American"? I think that would make the U.S. sound more....United Statian. Even though that isn't a word.

They definitely don't qualify as Dixie, Yankee, and African Minor sounds more like it means a cultures IN Africa. African-American culture was very different from them (any African cultures), just as Yankee/Dixie/Anglo-Candian/French Canadian or whatever it's called in the game.. are different than their more European heritage, as African-American culture is different than any of the named above.
 
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blacks for the south

hey, can we get an event that would allow the south to free the slaves and or to arm the black populace against the northern aggressors. this would gice a couple divisions to the southern cause.

i would like to see a new pop: free and or free slave holding blacks (historically correct).

Also, an event where if x amount of southern territory is lost to northern oppressors, than partisan ranger units would be formed. giving a couple division of cavalry and or dragoons.

just a few thoughts, what you all think?
 
gun1858 said:
hey, can we get an event that would allow the south to free the slaves and or to arm the black populace against the northern aggressors. this would gice a couple divisions to the southern cause.

i would like to see a new pop: free and or free slave holding blacks (historically correct).

Also, an event where if x amount of southern territory is lost to northern oppressors, than partisan ranger units would be formed. giving a couple division of cavalry and or dragoons.

just a few thoughts, what you all think?
Click to expand...
I'd like to pretend that I was actually responding to this post, but really I'm just posting in this thread so that I don't have to see his offensive original name (as it was the last post here) when I open up the VIP subforum...


Not to mention: Entire divisions of "partisan rangers"? That's just silly. The bad guys lost, get over it.
 
Will VIP remain a mod only for the Grand Campaign, or will a VIP scenario starting in 1861 (with the appropriate set up, AIs, and colonisation bans in place) eventually be scripted? I think it would be safe to say that the ACW scenario is the second most popular scenario after the Grand Campaign.
 
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