When are we going to see harder difficulty levels?

[Adonnus]

I'm not the only one I think who really desires this. The game is fun and all, but it wears off after a short while... it's just still too easy. What I would really want to see are options when setting up the game for the following:

- More aggressive AI behaviour - levels of treachery and backstabbiness
- An option for those who desire it for flat buffs for the AI and maluses for the player, customisable buff by buff like in Kaisserreich options
- Options for more difficult claims and succession. As a feudal ruler this is by far the easiest part of the game compared to Ck2.
- The option to disable or at least severely gimp lifestyle focuses. You can basically get anything you want with them provided you wait a while. It would be interesting to have a gameplay mode where you can only gain traits and skills from education and life experiences, not from just deciding to be good at something one day.

As a nobody loser in Ck2 I had to spend sometimes several lifetimes arranging marriages and setting up the perfect claim war, and it was very satisfying to pull off. Now there are so many ways to claim titles, especially your liege's title it feels trivial.

Well, comment if you agree or if you have any other ideas for what you would like to see re difficulty.

 

[El-Tapicero]

Allow me to step in as the self-proclaimed expert that I am xd.

The main issue with difficulty is balance. And the main issue with balance is war. Once balance is fixed, then we can talk about increasing difficulty through other means.

Any attempt to make the game harder without tackling the root problem (balance) will just lead to more mess and side effects

 

[SMD115]

vassal who will lost title for liege‘s war should join the war,just like a tributary state should join his war to protect his title, not just depend suzerain, it's very important to All Under Heaven, because sometime emperor very weak(even have not any soldier) ,and vassal very strong(even contorl half of empire), when enemy attack from out of empire,vassal have to protect themselves.Vassals to Arms is a good mod to refer.

 

[Torredebelem]

You'll see the game taking a turn in order to increase difficulty when Paradox thinks it will bring more profits than the present state of affairs.

As much as I personally think the game, as a design, would gain immensely by being harder to beat, thus providing a longer lasting appeal, I also personally think an harder game would bring lesser profits to Paradox.

 

[Hellua]

I'm not the only one I think who really desires this. The game is fun and all, but it wears off after a short while... it's just still too easy. What I would really want to see are options when setting up the game for the following:

- More aggressive AI behaviour - levels of treachery and backstabbiness
- An option for those who desire it for flat buffs for the AI and maluses for the player, customisable buff by buff like in Kaisserreich options
- Options for more difficult claims and succession. As a feudal ruler this is by far the easiest part of the game compared to Ck2.
- The option to disable or at least severely gimp lifestyle focuses. You can basically get anything you want with them provided you wait a while. It would be interesting to have a gameplay mode where you can only gain traits and skills from education and life experiences, not from just deciding to be good at something one day.

As a nobody loser in Ck2 I had to spend sometimes several lifetimes arranging marriages and setting up the perfect claim war, and it was very satisfying to pull off. Now there are so many ways to claim titles, especially your liege's title it feels trivial.

Well, comment if you agree or if you have any other ideas for what you would like to see re difficulty.

I would not mind events that see you lose attributes. I always start with a pretty 'okay' character and end-up with a god character. Even when roleplaying you will get so many bonus attributes that at the end of your life you are always way better then you started. Losing attributes or reducing the amount of events and abilities to gain attributes would be good.

Edit: What would work for me, is an option that you can toggle on, where you get 'hardcore' (negative) events. Events that do not need to be new. Just more negative or/and the bonus less 'good'.

 

[naq29]

I'm not the only one I think who really desires this. The game is fun and all, but it wears off after a short while... it's just still too easy. What I would really want to see are options when setting up the game for the following:

- More aggressive AI behaviour - levels of treachery and backstabbiness
- An option for those who desire it for flat buffs for the AI and maluses for the player, customisable buff by buff like in Kaisserreich options
- Options for more difficult claims and succession. As a feudal ruler this is by far the easiest part of the game compared to Ck2.
- The option to disable or at least severely gimp lifestyle focuses. You can basically get anything you want with them provided you wait a while. It would be interesting to have a gameplay mode where you can only gain traits and skills from education and life experiences, not from just deciding to be good at something one day.

As a nobody loser in Ck2 I had to spend sometimes several lifetimes arranging marriages and setting up the perfect claim war, and it was very satisfying to pull off. Now there are so many ways to claim titles, especially your liege's title it feels trivial.

Well, comment if you agree or if you have any other ideas for what you would like to see re difficulty.

Well since you just want the AI to cheat, then I suggest: giving the conqueror trait to everyone and their mom, except the player.

 

[Diskianterezh]

Difficulty modes are the worst : it essentially is a failure of the system, where you have to cheat to offer a simulation of difficulty.

The game needs progressive difficulty : right now the difficulty is on point IF you are a count/duke that have to manage the bigger power around him.
As soon as you get the critical mass, you start to roll on the neighbors and so on.
The game must offer internal strife and challenges to very big empires, emulate their corruption and decadence, to avoid players blobbing without limits.

Any "difficulty mode" is a very very poor bandage on a open wound, it would be an ugly and messy admission of failure.

 

[Adonnus]

You'll see the game taking a turn in order to increase difficulty when Paradox thinks it will bring more profits than the present state of affairs.

As much as I personally think the game, as a design, would gain immensely by being harder to beat, thus providing a longer lasting appeal, I also personally think an harder game would bring lesser profits to Paradox.

But I'm just talking about giving the player the options to do it if they want to when starting the game.

It's pretty sad though if the real reason they aren't doing this is if they think just making it simple will get more money. Why not cater to all different kinds of people instead of just one kind?

 

[Adonnus]

Difficulty modes are the worst : it essentially is a failure of the system, where you have to cheat to offer a simulation of difficulty.

The game needs progressive difficulty : right now the difficulty is on point IF you are a count/duke that have to manage the bigger power around him.
As soon as you get the critical mass, you start to roll on the neighbors and so on.
The game must offer internal strife and challenges to very big empires, emulate their corruption and decadence, to avoid players blobbing without limits.

Any "difficulty mode" is a very very poor bandage on a open wound, it would be an ugly and messy admission of failure.

Again, there is nothing wrong with a difficulty mode which enables those options. But the option to go without them should also still be available to the player. I feel like people didn't even read my first post.

 

[Torredebelem]

But I'm just talking about giving the player the options to do it if they want to when starting the game.

It's pretty sad though if the real reason they aren't doing this is if they think just making it simple will get more money. Why not cater to all different kinds of people instead of just one kind?

If you want some hamfisted modifiers, you can play right now using vanilla game rules at -3 domain limit, increased cost for claims, much increased time to conver religion and culture, plague frequency on Doomsday, conquerors all the way up, among many other game rules... so I guess in your particular case vanilla delivers.

 

[klopkr]

The game isn't easy because the AI doesn't have enough modifiers. It's easy because the AI can't make use of the most blatantly over powered parts of the game like modifier stacking and alliances.

Alliances need to be seriously re thought. Or war in general so not every war is everyones max stack against everyone else's max stack.
Stackable modifiers the AI can't use properly like knights accolades, stationing, and culture buffs need to be straight up removed from the game and reenvisioned. It doesn't help that accolades and stationing are the two most repetitive and click heavy mechanics in the game too.

 

[Adonnus]

It seems getting people to agree on this issue is harder than I anticipated.

 

[Herennius]

As stated multiple times in the past, I would be happy just to be able to play (optionally!) a fair game vs. the AI - fair in the way that the AI doesn't get disadvantaged by design (or me as human player getting an unfair protection). Examples needed?

Why only a single AI murder plot at the same time vs. my character?
Why I'm not affected by the dread AI characters radiate?
Why I'm not obliged (or just only allowed) to fight in my lieges army as knight?
Why is the human player character to a large extend exempted from pregnancy complications (plus having other strange rules around the number of children)?
Why does the game by default hides the opinion of my characters on NPCs, making roleplaying unnecessarily hard?
...

It can be argued that all those special rules are in to avoid frustration. I respect that and I don't want to take it away from anyone. However, for me CK3 is most fun, if the game shows its ugly side...in terms of the game and the AI seriously interfering with my plans. So I just want to be able to play without getting extra-pampered all the time.

 

[Ikatosh]

As stated multiple times in the past, I would be happy just to be able to play (optionally!) a fair game vs. the AI - fair in the way that the AI doesn't get disadvantaged by design (or me as human player getting an unfair protection). Examples needed?

Why only a single AI murder plot at the same time vs. my character?
Why I'm not affected by the dread AI characters radiate?
Why I'm not obliged (or just only allowed) to fight in my lieges army as knight?
Why is the human player character to a large extend exempted from pregnancy complications plus having (among other strange rules around the number of children)?
Why does the game by default hides the opinion of my characters on NPCs, making roleplaying unnecessarily hard?
...

It can be argued that all those special rules are in to avoid frustration. I respect that and I don't want to take it away from anyone. However, for me CK3 is most fun, if the game shows its ugly side...in terms of the game and the AI seriously interfering with my plans. So I just want to be able to play without getting extra-pampered all the

I completely agree with your point of view. Personally, there have been very few times when I felt threatened by the AI. In fact, my best games—and I think this applies to other players as well—were the ones where I had to deal with more challenges.
Unfortunately, in my opinion, the game becomes boring because it gets too easy after a certain point.
As mentioned in other threads, the difficulty should increase. Being an emperor should be a very challenging role. You should have to keep your vassals in check and prevent them from usurping the throne—maybe by kidnapping your heir and triggering a war?
I’m glad about the direction the new DLCs are taking, but they should focus on offering adjustable difficulty for the player, so that newcomers can learn the game and more experienced players don’t get bored while playing.

 

[Fenris_SE]

It seems getting people to agree on this issue is harder than I anticipated.

A number of people do agree. Some of what you said is in this thread https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/this-game-is-fundamentally-broken.1661745/ that has been going on for over a year. Having options in the game to make for a more challenging playthrough is a subject that has been brought up several times. I can't speak for others, but for me I just believe that is something Paradox is not interested in doing that and feel like I would be beating a dead horse if I keep bringing it up, so I don't.

And because of the issues in this thread and the one I linked, I have not played in over a year. Which means I don't feel any input I would have on the current state of the game would be valid, as there is a very good chance my input is now outdated or just flat out wrong. And from the other thread I believe others feel the same, which may be why your thread is not getting the traction it deserves.

 

[Adonnus]

A number of people do agree. Some of what you said is in this thread https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/forum/threads/this-game-is-fundamentally-broken.1661745/ that has been going on for over a year. Having options in the game to make for a more challenging playthrough is a subject that has been brought up several times. I can't speak for others, but for me I just believe that is something Paradox is not interested in doing that and feel like I would be beating a dead horse if I keep bringing it up, so I don't.

And because of the issues in this thread and the one I linked, I have not played in over a year. Which means I don't feel any input I would have on the current state of the game would be valid, as there is a very good chance my input is now outdated or just flat out wrong. And from the other thread I believe others feel the same, which may be why your thread is not getting the traction it deserves.

This is indeed a doomer pessimist take. Well I hope you are wrong, but maybe you are not.

 

[Adonnus]

Alliances need to be seriously re thought. Or war in general so not every war is everyones max stack against everyone else's max stack.
Stackable modifiers the AI can't use properly like knights accolades, stationing, and culture buffs need to be straight up removed from the game and reenvisioned. It doesn't help that accolades and stationing are the two most repetitive and click heavy mechanics in the game too.

I very much agree re the click heaviness of the latter two. I have long argued that the stationing is just plain dumb, it adds nothing to the game but a chore of more clicking. As for the accolades I don't mind them but it would be better if there was a toggle to automate them, and if the AI of course could use them.

 

[Adonnus]

If you want some hamfisted modifiers, you can play right now using vanilla game rules at -3 domain limit, increased cost for claims, much increased time to conver religion and culture, plague frequency on Doomsday, conquerors all the way up, among many other game rules... so I guess in your particular case vanilla delivers.

Most of those don't only make it harder for the player though. The domain limit for example applies to the AI too.

I don't actually want to play with hamfisted modifiers personally, I'm just spitballing ways the game could have options to be harder.

 

[Fenris_SE]

This is indeed a doomer pessimist take. Well I hope you are wrong, but maybe you are not.

Oh, I hope I'm wrong too. If my statement came off as being pessimistic, it wasn't intended to be that way. In fact one of the devs (maybe more, I haven't seen) said that a lot of the stuff that bothers the players, bothers him as well.

Hopefully in the future CK III will get difficulty sliders/options. But I believe DLC and bug fixes are their main priority right now so I don't expect to see difficulty options happening anytime soon if at all.

But who knows, maybe if people keep asking, those options could happen sooner.

 

[Adonnus]

Oh, I hope I'm wrong too. If my statement came off as being pessimistic, it wasn't intended to be that way. In fact one of the devs (maybe more, I haven't seen) said that a lot of the stuff that bothers the players, bothers him as well.

Hopefully in the future CK III will get difficulty sliders/options. But I believe DLC and bug fixes are their main priority right now so I don't expect to see difficulty options happening anytime soon if at all.

But who knows, maybe if people keep asking, those options could happen sooner.

Well I asked a question of the devs and in their q and a video got a one word answer, "No" with no explanation or justification. So as far as I can tell they don't really care about the players