Why Is This Game Good?

[AWittyName]

Hi folks,

One thing I've noticed since coming to the forums is that this game seems to be a textbook cult classic, with some even going as far as to imply that it is one of the best-designed and most innovative PDX games. My only knowledge of the game is that there was a bumpy launch, an update that seemed to fix a lot of the issues, and the game sadly never recovered from it's poorly-received launch.

I consider myself a PDX enjoyer, so I'd love to hear from fellow nerds about why this game is so good and if I ought to pick it up

Thanks!

 

[myrt]

If you get it, also get the Invictus mod. It includes a lot of essential mechanical tweaks, as well as lots of content for nations not covered by vanilla.

I've played most of my games in the Hellenic world. The Diadochi power struggle is a really interesting and dynamic start. Playing as one of the successor states, or as a Greek city state trying to survive and reclaim glory in the violent power struggle of Alexander's empire. Building up and preparing for the inevitable Roman invasion is also fun. I like the peace-time management much more than e.g. EU4. Most buildings are available from the start. Building roads in your territories and upgrading cities is satisfying. Very little of the game is dictated by mana, there is only one abstract currency (political power). Trade and character systems are a tad weak, but otherwise I like the game's mechanics a lot.

 

[DukeLeto42]

Pick it up. Explanation to follow:


First up, the province system is fantastic. Take EUIV's States, but instead of ~3/state each province contains something on the order of a dozen territories. This means you can have small cities with massive populations with fairly low-pop hinterlands. This also feeds into the map, which ends up looking lovely with its scattered urban centers across a map that evokes all my Rome: Total War nostalgia (and music equal to the challenge).

Next, in place of EUIV's fairly static development values you have pops. This also helps with the cities part above, as a rural settlement might have on the order of 12-24 pops, while Rome or Alexandria will probably have a couple hundred by the end of the game. Each pop has a social stratum they belong to (slave/freeman/citizen/noble), a culture, a faith, and a value for their happiness. This means your capitol will end up continuously converting the piles of pops taken from your conquests, and that conversion isn't a switch flipped by your limited Wololo count but the result of converting pops one by one.

As myrt notes, the trade is a bit weak, but while as a whole it could have used the second pass other systems got before development ceased, it does support something fantastic: food. Each province has a limited food store, and it runs out your pops will start to stave. This means that a massive capitol will require significant development of its hinterland as well as imports to maintain, which is fantastic. Additionally, your armies require food, taking quite little attrition by PDX standards until it runs out. This means you need to ensure that the armies on sieges actually are ready to maintain the siege, and you can absolutely exhaust a province's food stores while campaigning there, causing starvation for territories and the army.


I'll throw in my 2 cents for Pandya (nation in southern India) with the Invictus mod. You have a lot of local powers to fight and feed on, just enough strength to take them on if you play smart, and a final boss in the form of Maurya. Plus, Invictus adds a host of decisions to improve resource exploitation and some fun missions to turn your home region into a thriving area.

 

[AWittyName]

Bet, thanks for the answers folks! I'll pick it up this afternoon after work and get the Invictus mod as well. I had thought the scale was more akin to the original Total War: Rome, so I'm surprised to hear about India being playable @DukeLeto42, as well as the game having pops somewhat akin to vicky.

Sounds like a good time, if I join the cult y'all'll see more of me

Thanks again!

 

[myrt]

Bet, thanks for the answers folks! I'll pick it up this afternoon after work and get the Invictus mod as well. I had thought the scale was more akin to the original Total War: Rome, so I'm surprised to hear about India being playable @DukeLeto42, as well as the game having pops somewhat akin to vicky.

Sounds like a good time, if I join the cult y'all'll see more of me

Thanks again!

Invictus is getting updated tomorrow btw, so don't commit to a full playthrough right away

 

[olivenkranz]

Invictus is getting updated tomorrow btw, so don't commit to a full playthrough right away

A vanilla playthrough to familiarise with the machanics could be useful.

 

[Gurkhal]

I couldn't resist this post. Please accept my pardon and I shall do penance...

Because its a relatively new Paradox game with an engaging warfare system.

 

[myrt]

A vanilla playthrough to familiarise with the machanics could be useful.

I went straight into Invictus without playing vanilla, either is fine imo. Invictus doesn't add a lot of new mechanics, so I don't find it harder to get into.

 

[Decius]

I would also strongly recommend the "2.0 Better UI" mod! So with the Better UI mod and the Invictus mod you're doing nothing wrong!



Addition: And to me I:R is still the best paradox grand strategy game until today, after Victoria III still requires several more updates and some refinement until it's good. CK III has a very engaging and great character system/RPG elements, events (event chains) and the religion and culture "management" is good too, but everything else is a bit lackluster - simple land warfare, no naval warfare at all, pretty simple realm and province management and economy, same about technology, etc.

I:R would need some further updates aswell. The biggest potentials would be a trade system overhaul, more diplomatic options and some tweaks to the different government types, especially tribes. But even now it offers many great mechanics like the (land) warfare system or the population and province management incl. building. I also like the tech trees and the character interaction (only downside is the late game, when it can get repetitive designating lots of characters to offices after the former office bearers die, if you rule a large realm). Also many mechanics impact others and are intertwined like your army depends on your population, where the latter is impacted by many other factors, which again can be influenced in many ways by the player aswell.

 

[MohawkWolfo98]

I would also strongly recommend the "2.0 Better UI" mod! So with the Better UI mod and the Invictus mod you're doing nothing wrong!



Addition: And to me I:R is still the best paradox grand strategy game until today, after Victoria III still requires several more updates and some refinement until it's good. CK III has a very engaging and great character system/RPG elements, events (event chains) and the religion and culture "management" is good too, but everything else is a bit lackluster - simple land warfare, no naval warfare at all, pretty simple realm and province management and economy, same about technology, etc.

I:R would need some further updates aswell. The biggest potentials would be a trade system overhaul, more diplomatic options and some tweaks to the different government types, especially tribes. But even now it offers many great mechanics like the (land) warfare system or the population and province management incl. building. I also like the tech trees and the character interaction (only downside is the late game, when it can get repetitive designating lots of characters to offices after the former office bearers die, if you rule a large realm). Also many mechanics impact others and are intertwined like your army depends on your population, where the latter is impacted by many other factors, which again can be influenced in many ways by the player aswell.

I love the buildings rework, I actually feel like I’m building an empire, reworking my empire to my image. It felt so dynamic and alive watching all the slaves convert to citizens etc.

And the map, oh my goodness the map. Just plain freaking gorgeous. The sea sloshing on the coast, the farm plains, the desert, the way the terrain seeps into the map colour… everything seemed to pop out alive. It’s the best of any paradox game by far, nothing comes close with maybe Vic III. Not to mention the tilted globe effect is so unique among Paradox Games.

The warfare system is too one the best of any paradox games imo. With food mechanics, nice levy system etc, it was real interesting. It’s such a shame they botched the launch so badly

 

[Fede92]

I really like the functioning of the population system. It makes me feel like I am really dealing with a real population, and that it takes time to integrate in an empire newly conquered territories and people.
Moreover, I like the fact that logistics matters in war. If you do not feed your armies and carefully plan your campaigns, you are beaten.

 

[Nirn]

I really like pondering where a new city should be established in connection to existing or future road networks. I look for a position that "makes sense" given the climate, the rivers, the trade goods, the terrain type, future expansion plans, road networks, etc, but also for a position which is aesthetically pleasing.

As others have already said, the map is both beautiful and somehow immersion-inducing (for me, at least). In my opinion, the large wasteland areas, creating natural boundaries, are very important in this respect.

In terms of warfare, I like the high importance of provincial capitals in fighting wars and how they are tied to the food system (~logistics) of armies.

 

[Lord Finnish]

The big thing for me is the graduality. Most things happen over time. Investments pay off in the long term and consequences of bad decisions can sometimes take a while before they blow up.

Also the tech/innovation system is something I highly enjoy. Going for different 'builds', long term vs. short term choices.

Also just the empire building. Founding a city, watching it grow. Another city, and a road between them. Make the pops happy. Watch my culture expand in far away provinces. The moment when your once hostile province finally has positive loyalty growth. That feels great.

I must also mention the general atmosphere. The visuals and music are both excellent in my opinion. This game really makes me feel like I'm there.