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CO Word of the Week #15

Let’s discuss the status of the modding support today. The Editor has been in the works and we have shared versions of it with a closed group of a few selected modders for feedback. We are very fortunate to have this dedicated group of people eager to try experimental solutions and voice their opinions on them. Their feedback helps us understand how tools are used and how we can improve them. We have been surprised by the modders so many times in Cities in Motion and Cities: Skylines that we have stopped trying to guess what you might want to do or achieve. It’s much more helpful for us to just ask directly how to support those efforts instead.

Collaboration with the closed group has been going on behind the scenes for months now. Together, we have put a lot of effort towards the beta version of the modding tools, and we really can’t wait to share them with you! We believe modding is a pivotal part of the experience with a Cities: Skylines game and we want to encourage everyone to be as creative as possible.

As we’re preparing for the public release with support for Code Modding and the Map Editor, Paradox is running a broader Early Access for modders and creators chosen from the sign-up earlier this year. This gives creators the early opportunity to give the team direct feedback on using Paradox Mods, the new Modding Toolchain, and the Map Editor. We’re looking forward to seeing their feedback, and having the first Code Mods, Maps, and Savegames uploaded to the platform and ready for you on its release! This is all to support the quest of making sure we have a robust start when the tools are released, and this is a good opportunity to test Paradox Mods as well. We’ll be sharing more information on each part: Paradox Mods, Code Modding, and Map Editing later on so you’ll know what to expect.

I would like to emphasize again that there is still a lot of work still to be done: Asset editing is not in a shape or form to be used as-is. We’ll still need more time to make importing the assets work. The Region Packs teased at the end of last year are bundles of assets of varying sizes and content made by some of your favorite creators from the community. These assets rely on us finalizing the asset editor to a point where we are happy that the import pipeline and saving will be in a future-proof state. This is an ongoing effort, alongside improving the Code Modding and Map Editing based on the feedback we’ll receive from the Early Access and eventually from all of you. We have dedicated devs working on the modding support, eager to tackle bugs and implement improvements, so we’ll keep patching the tools throughout the public Beta phase until we have Modding 1.0 available. Naturally, the work will continue even past that as we receive more feedback and suggestions from you.

The creators and modders of Cities: Skylines brought so much cool and innovative content to the game, and we can’t wait to see what you come up with for Cities: Skylines II. There are already some exciting mods and beautiful maps out there (yes, we see you!) and it will be very exciting to see what you create with the added support!

Sincerely,
Mariina
 
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Honestly, I feel like the community does have to chill a bit.

At this point, it is obvious the devs have heard our complaints and are actively working on it. Development takes time, so now all we can do is just wait for the work to come out when it does. I have faith that the game as not been abandoned.

Can we all just chill a bit? It honestly does sound a little childish how demanding everyone is being. No one can possibly meet all expectations that the community seems to have placed.
I would definitely chill out better if I have my money back in my pocket so I can spend it in something else while waiting.
 
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Honestly, I feel like the community does have to chill a bit.

At this point, it is obvious the devs have heard our complaints and are actively working on it. Development takes time, so now all we can do is just wait for the work to come out when it does. I have faith that the game as not been abandoned.

Can we all just chill a bit? It honestly does sound a little childish how demanding everyone is being. No one can possibly meet all expectations that the community seems to have placed.
With all due respect, we paid money for a product and have been waiting for about 5 months now to get this said product fixed. We've been asked to have patience and CO still hasn't shown any sign of actual remorse and that they take full responsibility. We are all aware that changes etc. will take a second. We're also aware that Modding was never promised to be a part of the core product. But why is the land value and other simulation breaking bugs not fixed yet? A hot fix would be enough for now. But there's none. Instead it seems like CO is trying to finally publish Mod support so that Modders can fix/improve the game.

So no, the community is not childish (well some comments are unnecessary, I agree). There's no room anymore for these kind of announcements, especially after they were hyped up two weeks before.
 
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No one can possibly meet all expectations that the community seems to have placed.
These expectations are the result of official communication. In WotW #5, Nov 27, 2023:

The Editor will be released early next year, so until then don’t let that stop you, just be aware that you may need to rework some things later on.
(...)
We would like to invite all mod, map, and asset creators to join early access to the Editor for a few weeks before its release so you can see what it is like, test out your already created mods, and share your feedback with us. If you have experience creating mods for Cities: Skylines please sign up here.

* The editor still isn't there.
* The closed EA hasn't even begun and it'll run "a few weeks" (which makes sense).

So instead of having the editor "early this year", which is already the past, we'll have some crippled (no assets) mod support in beta form in... when? June? July? When will it be out of beta? November?

I'm sick of these "expectations" excuses.
 
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I still don not get why nobody at CO or Paradox just honestly says: "Ok, we made a huge mistake, we overestimated ourselves and advertised misleading. Lets move this game to "Early Access" and make it 30 USD. Everybody who bought the standard edition will get a free upgrade to ultimate. And everyone who bought the ultimate edition will get an upgrade to Supporter Edition which includes other free stuff, like two additonal DLCs or something."

Players are angry not because your game is extremely bad, in my opinion it is playable and a really nice early access game but because you lay to them and it feels like a fraud.
 
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So we all need a bit more patience.

It is unacceptable that CO is condescending to players who have paid $50-90 for this game and are frustrated about the poor communication surrounding the modding support that was promised to us months ago. You hyped up today's WotW a week ago like you had something concrete to announce and then rug pulled everyone by reiterating the same exact information we already know.

Speaking as a mod developer: If this is the attitude that CO is going to take towards players then you can expect no participation from me in the modding beta. I'm not fixing your game for you if you're going to treat me like a child for holding you accountable to your promises after I paid you. Kick rocks, Mariina. I'm done.
 
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The publisher will handle all announcements and therefore there will be no timelines in the communication from us devs. The only thing we can say is that we're working on both the modding support and the Ultimate Edition content. I can assure you that we have not abandoned the game and will keep working on it. So we all need a bit more patience.
Could you please supply a link to where Paradox will be making announcements? I would love to also see Paradox's timelines for this game, as well. Where shall we address our questions about Cities: Skylines 2? I can assure you that I would love nothing more than to allow the developers at CO to develop in peace, if only Paradox could take over the announcements and timelines. Thank you!
 
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Honestly, I feel like the community does have to chill a bit.

At this point, it is obvious the devs have heard our complaints and are actively working on it. Development takes time, so now all we can do is just wait for the work to come out when it does. I have faith that the game as not been abandoned.

Can we all just chill a bit? It honestly does sound a little childish how demanding everyone is being. No one can possibly meet all expectations that the community seems to have placed.
I have to respectfully disagree.

No, it is not "obvious the developers (...) are actively working on it". On the contrary, given the lack of tangible information it is not at all "obvious".

CO did have 3 years time for development. If they couldn't manage to achieve their goals in that timeframe they shouldn't have actively advertised things the community is still waiting for.
In addition to that, they did have meanwhile almost five additional months to repair what was wrong. That they haven't achieved either.

And the expectations which have been articulated in the forums (in addition to the disappointment that those expectations have been and are far from being met) have been raised by the ad campaign of which CO was a major contributor.

So, please don't ask others to "chill a bit". If you are fine with what you have got for your money, good for you. Others are not, and rightfully so.
 
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You're right, but I meant on Release Date. They said "soon" unfurtunately that can mean anything. My guess is that they planned to do their risky launch, to then focus on Mod Support and Console Launch but then underestimated the severity of bugs? You can't tell me it takes 5 months to fix a bug like land value. UNLESS your resources are somewhere else, aka the Modding platform (and consoles in the background?). Either way, it's a lose lose situation for CO. They need to bring results. And going all in with Modding makes somewhat sense because then, while continue fixing the game, the community will start creating content.... In the meantime though they're neglecting basic maintenance/bug fixes...
 
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is your vanilla game crashing constantly or have you used un-supported mods or the dev tools to place some extra stuff in your city?
Unfortunately I have similar issues, since the last update. In my case, I don't have any mods or any other witchcraft :) It occurred me roughly the same time, when the concrete tax revenue exploded in my city. I hope the people in charge can filter out this error too by the next update. I can't even tell you how much I'm looking forward to it. Keep up the good work! It will be excellent, at least we hope so...
 
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You're right, but I meant on Release Date. They said "soon" unfurtunately that can mean anything. My guess is that they planned to do their risky launch, to then focus on Mod Support and Console Launch but then underestimated the severity of bugs? You can't tell me it takes 5 months to fix a bug like land value. UNLESS your resources are somewhere else, aka the Modding platform (and consoles in the background?). Either way, it's a lose lose situation for CO. They need to bring results. And going all in with Modding makes somewhat sense because then, while continue fixing the game, the community will start creating content.... In the meantime though they're neglecting basic maintenance/bug fixes...
But, I think that you may agree with me that could be acceptable some delay on modding, but about terrain editor? For a City Builder? It's a must I think. And it looks like they don't know how or they are having problem in adding new content to the game (DLC and the packs are already created). Game shouldn't be released as final product if you promise lots of features and things and then, some of them don't work and other need 6 month at least more to be available.
 
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But, I think that you may agree with me that could be acceptable some delay on modding, but about terrain editor? For a City Builder? It's a must I think. And it looks like they don't know how or they are having problem in adding new content to the game (DLC and the packs are already created). Game shouldn't be released as final product if you promise lots of features and things and then, some of them don't work and other need 6 month at least more to be available.
If it had released as an early access to allow players to play and help with bug reports this would have been acceptible. but what a shocking full launch
 
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The publisher will handle all announcements and therefore there will be no timelines in the communication from us devs. The only thing we can say is that we're working on both the modding support and the Ultimate Edition content. I can assure you that we have not abandoned the game and will keep working on it. So we all need a bit more patience.
Definitive timelines. After tax, I paid $99 for this game and have not received the content I was sold on. A bit more patience? That’s condescension. We’ve been patient for 6 months. At what point during the year should we be patient until? And saying you haven’t abandoned the game and will keep working on it—well that’s comforting. I’d hope you’d keep working on it since it was never completed before being sold to us at AAA price.
 
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No, it wasn't. It clearly states on that post that modding is not a part of the core product. It then goes on to say that modding SUPPORT will be an important part of SC2. That is not the same as being a part of the core product. Let's stick to the facts.
Modding is the single thing that keeps any paradox game alive. without it the comunity would still be the 30k it was 10 years ago. Cities 1 would have become inrelivent and died off aswell. it is THE core mechanic that allows the game to run
 
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Could you please supply a link to where Paradox will be making announcements? I would love to also see Paradox's timelines for this game, as well. Where shall we address our questions about Cities: Skylines 2? I can assure you that I would love nothing more than to allow the developers at CO to develop in peace, if only Paradox could take over the announcements and timelines. Thank you!
Wait, this tab is titled Official Information and Announcements. This is Paradox Forums, right?
 
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