CO Word of the Week #2

[lork6]

So we paid full price for a Beta. Then bugs became paid DLC. WOW

 

[co_avanya]

@co_martsu

Thanks a lot for the patch 1.0.13

I am still getting a ton of High Rent and Not Enough Customers popups, even after 1.0.13, will be a fix for that?

The cargo train issue will be fixed in the next patch?

If possible, we would like to know a spoiler of what the next issues will be focused on by the team

For complaints of High Rent it's important to look at what is driving up the rent for those homes. It could be high land value and/or high demand for that type of zoning. Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type. Low density residential is also more likely to face issues with rent in areas with high land value as the homes only have one household to cover rent, while higher densities have more people sharing the rent. Additionally, lowering taxes and providing education for your citizens, so they can have a higher income can help alleviate issues with High Rent.

With commercial buildings complaining about Not Enough Customers, it's often also worth looking at how well citizens can get there. Is there good public transportation? Is there good parking nearby? If not, then citizens may end up going to different commercial buildings in your city to do their shopping or fulfill their leisure needs.

As for the issue with cargo trains, we're currently investigating the situation with resource trade in the city. We have identified a few bugs, but it's also worth keeping in mind that the distance goods are transported factor into their cost. In some cases, a cargo train line may be less profitable than transporting resources by truck. It's hard to say if that's the situation your city has run into or if it's affected by one of the bugs we're currently investigating.

 

[∆tlαntic4]

For complaints of High Rent it's important to look at what is driving up the rent for those homes. It could be high land value and/or high demand for that type of zoning. Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type. Low density residential is also more likely to face issues with rent in areas with high land value as the homes only have one household to cover rent, while higher densities have more people sharing the rent. Additionally, lowering taxes and providing education for your citizens, so they can have a higher income can help alleviate issues with High Rent.

With commercial buildings complaining about Not Enough Customers, it's often also worth looking at how well citizens can get there. Is there good public transportation? Is there good parking nearby? If not, then citizens may end up going to different commercial buildings in your city to do their shopping or fulfill their leisure needs.

As for the issue with cargo trains, we're currently investigating the situation with resource trade in the city. We have identified a few bugs, but it's also worth keeping in mind that the distance goods are transported factor into their cost. In some cases, a cargo train line may be less profitable than transporting resources by truck. It's hard to say if that's the situation your city has run into or if it's affected by one of the bugs we're currently investigating.

Thank you for your thoughtful response. Your insights into the factors affecting high rent helped a lot.

Your update on the ongoing investigation into cargo train operations is much appreciated.

We are grateful for your dedication to making our community a better place

Thank you once again for your valuable input.

Suggestion: It would be interesting to know which issues the team is solving for the next patch

 

[MTO35]

For complaints of High Rent it's important to look at what is driving up the rent for those homes. It could be high land value and/or high demand for that type of zoning. Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type. Low density residential is also more likely to face issues with rent in areas with high land value as the homes only have one household to cover rent, while higher densities have more people sharing the rent. Additionally, lowering taxes and providing education for your citizens, so they can have a higher income can help alleviate issues with High Rent.

With commercial buildings complaining about Not Enough Customers, it's often also worth looking at how well citizens can get there. Is there good public transportation? Is there good parking nearby? If not, then citizens may end up going to different commercial buildings in your city to do their shopping or fulfill their leisure needs.

As for the issue with cargo trains, we're currently investigating the situation with resource trade in the city. We have identified a few bugs, but it's also worth keeping in mind that the distance goods are transported factor into their cost. In some cases, a cargo train line may be less profitable than transporting resources by truck. It's hard to say if that's the situation your city has run into or if it's affected by one of the bugs we're currently investigating.

Would have found it better if the taxation system had been different, divided into 3 categories (poor, middle, wealthy/rich) instead of according to the respective level of education, which fits back into this class system (poor, middle, rich) anyway, just making it unnecessarily complicated is.

You could have simply made three columns (poor, middle class, rich) for taxation, each with the densities included, which in turn could also be taxed individually.

Example Of Residential Areas

Poor/low earner class (regulator that taxes all densities of the respective class equally)

Poor/low-income densities: low, middle, high with controls to tax each individual density

The same goes for the middle class/normal earners and the rich/wealthy.

 

[Animaze]

Any ETA on fixing the Mail bug ? Its my 3rd city where I get -15 due to bad mail. Tried rebuilding all hubs, mail, more post boxes, more mail buildings, distribution centre etc.

For now stopped playing till it gets fixed.

BUMP

 

[TheMax85]

For complaints of High Rent it's important to look at what is driving up the rent for those homes. It could be high land value and/or high demand for that type of zoning. Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type. Low density residential is also more likely to face issues with rent in areas with high land value as the homes only have one household to cover rent, while higher densities have more people sharing the rent. Additionally, lowering taxes and providing education for your citizens, so they can have a higher income can help alleviate issues with High Rent.

With commercial buildings complaining about Not Enough Customers, it's often also worth looking at how well citizens can get there. Is there good public transportation? Is there good parking nearby? If not, then citizens may end up going to different commercial buildings in your city to do their shopping or fulfill their leisure needs.

As for the issue with cargo trains, we're currently investigating the situation with resource trade in the city. We have identified a few bugs, but it's also worth keeping in mind that the distance goods are transported factor into their cost. In some cases, a cargo train line may be less profitable than transporting resources by truck. It's hard to say if that's the situation your city has run into or if it's affected by one of the bugs we're currently investigating.

Also worth to note that it makes sense to lower taxes for higher education levels as this attracts educated people to move into the city and also motivates the existing citizens to continue school or study.

 

[meda2207]

The dev diaries have been written by us, the devs, and we approve the messaging there even with the marketing department wanting to make everything sounds like it's the best thing ever. And I get it, it's their job to sell the features and the game even with the risk that expectations will run high. With that said we do think Cities: Skylines II is a better game than its predecessor. It has issues, but we are working on them.
It's unfortunate that the simulation didn't answer to your expectations and I fully respect and appreciate your feedback. It also sounds like there is room for improvement on the player feedback in the game, since some things might be left unexplained. I can only hope that with the upcoming bugfixes the game is something you can enjoy despite this initial disappointment.

I am definitely on of the players who would appreciate if C:S2 had been more challenging... I think there are good mechanics in the simulation but it seems to me that these so-called "fail safe" features are quite strong so it takes out the possibility to enjoy all the aspects of simulation (and possible failure ). Adding of a difficulty settings would be a great improvement for players whom like to have a bigger management challenge.

Another issue is that a lot of information and rules of the simulation is not very well communicated to the player (I actually wrote a small bug post about it )... For example we should see more details about cims, businesses, what is their storage, profitability, how close it is to bankrupt etc. I think that lack of info provided to players can make some to think that simulation is "fudged" which is quite a pity because I do think that despite some balance issues it can offer a lot. I actually play with enabled dev tools just because then I can see more info about household and companies etc and then everything makes more sense and become more captivating to play.

TBH, I was really hyped about C:S2 which also led to being bit dissapointed after the release (I really hoped to have some TMPE features in base game ) ... but I really appriciate open discussion about game issues and that you listen the community... I belive that C:S2 can become from a good game to a great game Good Luck!

 

[WaffleCheesebread]

Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type.

Are you telling me that the endless demand for low density residential actually DOES affect the city negatively if you don't zone it, even though every sigle other game in this genre treats demand as a resource and not a requirement, and your game will quickly become drowned in low density residential if you DO try to empty the demand bar?

What a surprise, another complete failure in game balance.

 

[tamsi99]

I agree that the demand balance is completely off at the moment. I have a 90k city with mostly low density residential (which is already quite unrealistic but the simulation drove me into this). But the demand for low residential is still at max, no matter how much more I build. At the same time, there is a lot of "High Rent" complaints for low density houses. That does not make any sense to me at all.

Talking about "does not make sense":

1. Even "Rich" households complain about "High Rent". So if not even "Rich" people can afford it, who do you expect to live there then?
2. If not even "Rich" households seem to have sufficient money for that, how do all those very poor households survive in these low density houses? Does not make sense at all
3. For all these households complaining about "High Rent" in low density houses, why aren't they just moving out to cheaper apartments? I don't see that happening. Instead, all these complaining households stay in their low density houses and continue complaining forever. The more expensive those low density houses get, the lower the demand should be and only "Rich" households should even be candidates to live there.

 

[RA1981]

Well, I think that's where individual taxes come into the game. But for the rich households complaining about high rents, has anyone checked if those who are complaining are maybe singles? I mean, if a household can have e.g. four people, but only one person is living there the rent might be too high for a single person even if it's rich.

 

[GrumpyBeagle]

For complaints of High Rent it's important to look at what is driving up the rent for those homes. It could be high land value and/or high demand for that type of zoning. Just like in real life, if lots of people want to live in a specific type of housing and there aren't enough available, this drives up the prices for that type.

I really hope demand doesn't actually play a part in this... because demand is an endless thing, isn't it? It can never actually be satisfied (it's something that always increases), meaning that your city is eventually doomed to high rent for all types of residential zones when you choose not to fill out any more of those types.

I also remember hearing multiple times on streams and such that demand was not something you have to actually act on... but that it is more like a resource you can use when you feel like it, which goes directly against comments like this.

 

[Amon72]

About the high rent complain, seems logical to build low rent apartments in the area but these always become abandoned or don't even start to be built, it's puzzling how the demand for these work.

 

[circuitfarmer]

About the high rent complain, seems logical to build low rent apartments in the area but these always become abandoned or don't even start to be built, it's puzzling how the demand for these work.

This matches my experience too. A ton of high rent notifications across the city. I build low rent housing and instantly it gets populated. Wait a few minutes and bam, most of them are abandoned. The high rent notifications seem unaffected.

One more instance where a LOT more feedback to the player is needed to actually understand what is going on (or it's just broken). So much of the simulation feels like a black box at the moment.

 

[TheMax85]

I could manage to balance the high rent issue quite well with a combination of good education and a quite large mixed zone. But it’s really weird that mostly rich guys live in my low rent buildings…

 

[Lucododosor]

First, my message is polite. It's not because you're unhappy and express your anger that you're not being polite. There is no insult or rude word / expression here. Just clear disappointment.
Second, NO, I didn't manage to get through censorship. My message above is empty because I could not develop the argumentation I prepared. Unfortunately, they know very well what they don't want people to read here, questions that should not be asked, truth that should not be told.
It's ok, I'll share my thoughts (politely as always) where they won't censor it. That's too bad, I really wanted a discution about the most important concern expressed by the players besides the bugs that will be quickly taken care of. We (the community) could have helped work through that issue. Now I know what to expect.

The forum has an anti-spam measure for users with few posts (<5), which makes it hard sometimes to post messages. I'd advise you to inform yourself before jumping to erroneous conclusions like that