Welcome to another development diary about Europa Universalis IV. This time we talk about something that will be in the next major patch we do.

One of the parts of the game that has not changed much since eu1 is the concept of technology groups and technological development around the world. We’ve added concepts like westernising, and tweaked that one, but in the end Europe has a huge advantage from day 1, and lots of fun gameplay options are limited the further away you are.

So this is what will happen in 1.18, when it is released this autumn..

A nation’s technology group no longer affect technology research.

There is now a concept called Institutions, which will affect your technology research. There are seven different institutions that appear over the game, and if you don’t get them to spread into your country and then get embraced by your government, your technology costs will slowly rise.

Each institution will appear in a province fullfilling certain factors, and then slowly spread around the world. The nation owning that province will gain prestige and monarch power.

Every year the penalty for not having embraced an institution will grow by 1%, so there is a gradual process.

When an institution has spread to at least 10% of your development, you can embrace it in your government, removing the penalty permanently, and also giving a bonus to your nation. The cost to embrace depends on the amount of development in your nation without the institution.

All institutions spread over borders (including 1 seazone away), if relations are positive, and the spread is based on development in the province getting it. There are also lots of other factors related to the spread.

So which are the the seven institutions then?

Feudalism
This is present from the start in almost all the world, except among the hordes, new world and sub-saharan africa. It will slowly spread into neighboring lands, but it is not quick.
Bonus: Gives 1 extra free leader.
Penalty: 50%


Renaissance
This appears in Italy after 1450, in either a capital or a 20+ development province. It will spread quickly through high development in europe, particularly through italy, but can only spread into provinces that have feudalism already.
Bonus: 5% Cheaper Development & 5% Cheaper Buildings
Penalty: 20%


Colonialism
Appears after 1500 in a port province in Europe, who’s owner has the Quest of the New World idea, and have discovered the new world. And will spread very quickly through any port in countries with colonies.
Bonus: +10% Provincial Trade Power
Penalty: 20%


Printing Press
This arrives after 1550, most likely in germany, but can happen in any protestant or reformed province. It will spread quickly in Protestant and Reformed territory, but also into capitals with dip tech 15.
Bonus: 5& Cheaper Stability
Penalty: 20%


Global Trade
This arrives after 1600, in a center of trade in the highest value trade node, and will spread quicker into provinces with trade buildings.
Bonus: +1 Merchant
Penalty: 20%

Manufactories
This arrives after 1650 in a province with 30 development and a manufactory, and will spread quicker into provinces with manufactories.
Bonus: +10% Goods Produced
Penalty: 20%

Enlightenment
Arrives after 1700 in a province that either is a seat of a parliament, or is a province in europe owned by a monarch with at least 5 in all stats. Universities & Parliament Seats spread this institution.
Bonus: 25% Cheaper Culture Conversion
Penalty: 30%
​

What does this mean?


The progress of Europe is not guaranteed, but most importantly, a nation in Asia or Africa is no longer crippled from day 1, and forced to avoid spending power on ideas and development.

------

We’re constantly tweaking the spread factors, but here are some screenshots from mid 18th century in a hands-off game from this morning.

This is the institutions mapmode, where green are provinces that have all the enabled institutions, and yellow are don’t have them all.

And here is the technology mapmode, of the same game.

Some other aspects that has changed include the following
- New World Native Reforming will give you all institutions that the one you reform from has.
- Trade Companies are available to all technology groups.
- Lots and lots of triggers on western techgroups have been changed to check for specific relevant institutions.

 

[Sopbucket]

On the other hand, I don't think that westernization should be removed from the game. Maybe it could be reworked. Westernization surely was a very important political, cultural and social force in Modern and Contemporary History.

It's just being simulated a different way. A "westernized" country now is one that has embraced all the institutions. With that there is no need for a separate, vague mechanic that doesn't make any historical sense in the earlier time periods.

 

[camrock19]

Can you make government more important in the game someway?

Also can you make India and the Philippines areas where colonial nations can form?

 

[Usuario cabreado]

Wow, peace man... and have a look here, if you didn't know:
https://forum.paradoxplaza.com/foru...t-your-game-to-a-previous-patch-level.904414/
I also think that you should be able to desable the automatic updates in Steam. Maybe go to the "Technical Support" subforum and ask for help there, if you don't know where to find that option. And: have a nice day, though!

Wow, I feel really embarrassed and sorry about my words. I take it back. I threw you a stone and you gave me back a flower. A perfect portrait for my rudeness and ignorance. I love you devs. I didn't mean it. Please, forgive me.

 

[Sunspawn]

Wow, I feel really embarrassed and sorry about my words. I take it back. I threw you a stone and you gave me back a flower. A perfect portrait for my rudeness and ignorance. I love you devs. I didn't mean it. Please, forgive me.

He is a user just like you.

 

[camrock19]

Also can nations break into a civil war like say France broke into civil war over government type, it could be Kingdom of France and French Republic and whoever wins can reunite France or something like that. If the war ends in a status quo or something else then the 2 Frances will stay the same. Please add this

 

[BritNavFan]

This looks like a nice change.

 

[Habrakos]

Looks nice, would certain events cause institutions to appear elsewhere? For example; if Constantinople does not fall in 1453, would Renaissance appear somewhere else (or not at all)? - assuming that the fall of Constantinople caused or strengthened the Renaissance.

 

[ENDrain]

Looks like I have till autumn to try and westernise Iroquois Empire one last time...

 

[IdiotsOpposite]

Looks nice, would certain events cause institutions to appear elsewhere? For example; if Constantinople does not fall in 1453, would Renaissance appear somewhere else (or not at all)? - assuming that the fall of Constantinople caused or strengthened the Renaissance.

It did not.

 

[The_Meme_Man]

I think what would be neat would be to tie some of the geolocked institutions to religion, monarch power, and government rather than region. For example, due to Protestant faiths being less fundamental than Catholicism at the time, it was more favorable for scientific development.

For Rennaissance, since it was based on cultural and historical identity, should spawn in any land with over some amount of development that is Catholic, Orthodox, Sunni, Shia, Hindu, Theravada, and Confucius (due to development, it can spawn in multiple and plausible places like Italy, Constantinople, Alexandria, Delhi, Andhra, Bengal, Bangkok, Beijing, Seoul, etc).

Colonialism should be for any nation with the most colonial territory in the new world. It allows the odd colonial Japan or something to spawn it, and it will most likely spawn in Europe anyways because Asians don't go for colonization as AI.

Printing Revolution should spawn in any Protestant or Reformed land (allowing Scandinavia or Britain to spawn it), Shia, Confucian, and Sikh (theme being more "rebellious" cultures), and only spawn of the province holder either has a king of certain skill limit, or level 2 theologian for a certain period of time.

 

[The_Meme_Man]

I think another thing to point out is the difference between this and westernization. Westernization was poorly simulated in game, but this isn't westernization. This is more in tune to just modernization, as most of the developments now seem gradual and home grown. There are even opportunities now for Westerners to "Easternize" if Asia dies well (and it still really isn't Easternization rather than modernization).

There is now no rapid modernization process that is akin to Westernization. Even the Ming, you can violently westernized in around 20 to 30 years, which is faster than even industrial China. Though that begs a new question of whether Westernization is really historical, in the way we know it (i.e Industrial Westernization) for the pre industrial setting. I'm wondering if we even should have rapid westernization back, since it is tied to industrialization (and this game is pre industrial).

That being said, I still think there should be dissent for modernizing because you are revoking privileges (tied to estates perhaps). Less dissent the more modern you are compared to the world (top tech China should be more willing to advance than fallen China is to catch up, because people are more inclined to progress if they KNOW they are the best, and know that they are INVENTING the future rather than forfeiting the past for someone else's future)

 

[Lemont Elwood]

I think another thing to point out is the difference between this and westernization. Westernization was poorly simulated in game, but this isn't westernization. This is more in tune to just modernization, as most of the developments now seem gradual and home grown. There are even opportunities now for Westerners to "Easternize" if Asia dies well (and it still really isn't Easternization rather than modernization).

There is now no rapid modernization process that is akin to Westernization. Even the Ming, you can violently westernized in around 20 to 30 years, which is faster than even industrial China. Though that begs a new question of whether Westernization is really historical, in the way we know it (i.e Industrial Westernization) for the pre industrial setting. I'm wondering if we even should have rapid westernization back, since it is tied to industrialization (and this game is pre industrial).

That being said, I still think there should be dissent for modernizing because you are revoking privileges (tied to estates perhaps). Less dissent the more modern you are compared to the world (top tech China should be more willing to advance than fallen China is to catch up, because people are more inclined to progress if they KNOW they are the best, and know that they are INVENTING the future rather than forfeiting the past for someone else's future)

As I suggested earlier in this thread, the penalty to early modernization should not be a higher cost, but general unrest, with special rebels being available that want to roll back your adoption of that Institution.

For that matter, provinces that do have the Institution but are under a government that hasn't adopted it should get unrest too.

At any rate, that would be the equivalent of Westernization: imposing the Institution when most of your provinces don't have it, and thus having to deal with political struggles.

 

[Elzephor]

Please, for the love of god, make sure this works in the random new world. Also, can we expect another patch between now and 1.18, to fix minor issues? IE, Japan?

 

[Wagonlitz]

Looks like I have till autumn to try and westernise Iroquois Empire one last time...

You can always decide to play on a lower patch level. Doing so is done through beta patches. You can even get achievements (should you care about those) when running a previous patch. Though obviously only the ones which existed when that patch was current. Which also means that if you care about achievements then it can be advantageous to use a previous patch level from time to time since some achievements were easier at certain patch levels.

 

[TurtleShroom]

Also can you make India and the Philippines areas where colonial nations can form?

NEED

 

[Shock360]

What about adding Industrialism as a way to represent the Industrial Age that occurred starting in the 1760s?

It can start in provinces with iron, copper, etc.

Also maybe coal should be a late in-game resource that appears.

When the Vicky3 feels hit you hard but you can't stand Vicky 2 because of graphics, UI, and the way everything moves on your crsppy computer

 

[Sunspawn]

Japan?

Paradox objects to your insinuation that something is wrong with Japan in particular and the Far East in general.

 

[Shock360]

[/QUOTE]

I've just signed in to paradox forum because I cannot believe what devs are doing to people who bought vanilla version... When I bought (I said BOUGHT, not rented) EUIV I never suspected that developers weren't going to let me play it in peace... because that's the fucking reality, you keep on updating and imposing to all of us to erase our saved games and to uninstall then install and wait for updated mods again and again. Can you believe that I've never been able to finish a single game???!!!! Not a single one, I promise.... Because every time you change the rules of this game with your constant updates, our saved games become unestable and buggy and all of our installed mods go shit. Is this how you support modder community? It's been so fucking horrendous this experience to me that I had to explode to tell you. I'm ffed up with you, devs. I hate you. You change things without asking nor considering what players think about those. I preferred previous versions of EUIV. COULD YOU PLEASE STOP IMPOSING CHANGES?.... PLEASE STOP THIS! STOP IT!!, STOP IT!!!, STOOOP IIIIT!!!!!!!!

Wait what? You mean when we buy a game and the game has issues or flaws, instead of forcing us to pay for every single change or bug fix, they do it for free! BLASPHEMY, these infidels should just put everything in a dlc!!!!!!

 

[Wagonlitz]

I've just signed in to paradox forum because I cannot believe what devs are doing to people who bought vanilla version... When I bought (I said BOUGHT, not rented) EUIV I never suspected that developers weren't going to let me play it in peace... because that's the fucking reality, you keep on updating and imposing to all of us to erase our saved games and to uninstall then install and wait for updated mods again and again. Can you believe that I've never been able to finish a single game???!!!! Not a single one, I promise.... Because every time you change the rules of this game with your constant updates, our saved games become unestable and buggy and all of our installed mods go shit. Is this how you support modder community? It's been so fucking horrendous this experience to me that I had to explode to tell you. I'm ffed up with you, devs. I hate you. You change things without asking nor considering what players think about those. I preferred previous versions of EUIV. COULD YOU PLEASE STOP IMPOSING CHANGES?.... PLEASE STOP THIS! STOP IT!!, STOP IT!!!, STOOOP IIIIT!!!!!!!!

You a aware that you can play on 1.3 (or whatever the last vanilla patch was called) by using the beta tab?
Also it is this system or the old one; in the old one you didn't get any patches at all after an expansion had been released unless you bought said expansion. Now you get the patch no matter what and don't need to buy the expansion. Now I buy all expansions so for me personally it doesn't really matter, but I am aware that not all people are willing to do that/can afford that and I think the new system is much greater for them which is why I prefer that to the old one---plus you get more frequent bug fixes too.

I also think that you should be able to desable the automatic updates in Steam.

That's a myth. What autoupdating actually does is prevent it from automatically patching; when you launch the game it will force you to update before launching. The reason for it existing is for people with limited bandwidth not having games they aren't playing eat their bandwidth updating.
Though you can roll back after it having updated.

 

[Prince Ire]

Wait what? You mean when we buy a game and the game has issues or flaws, instead of forcing us to pay for every single change or bug fix, they do it for free! BLASPHEMY, these infidels should just put everything in a dlc!!!!!![/QUOTE] People are fine with bug fixes being free. They are less fine with bug fixes being tied to major changes to how the game plays. Yes, it might not in reality be all that different than only expansions getting patches in olden days, but for many people it feels different.