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EU4 - Development Diary - 27th of October 2020

Hello everyone! Today we are going to talk about some improvements in some interfaces for how you deal with governing capacity and one new feature that uses a lot of governing capacity but also let you “keep growing” on the land you already own.

First to make it easier to manage your governing capacity we’ve been adding needed information in two places. First we have added so when a building affects governing capacity it will now show that so you can get a sense of where you will get most value out of it in your realm, helping players with larger empires.

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This means buildings such as courthouses will now show how much governing capacity they will remove if built in that specific province.

Next is a little help to everyone who have been amassing a lot of vassals to hold land for them. Previously there was no way to see how much governing capacity a vassal had or how much was being used.

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We’ve now added so that can be viewed under the subject interface when you go into the details window for that subject.


Now to the new feature, for the one that has extra governing capacity, a Switzerland hiding in the mountains wanting to play tall. So in a province that is at least 15 development you can expand its infrastructure to allow for another building and manufactory in it. This increases the governing cost of the province by a flat 200 which can not be reduced by province modifiers.

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Then for every 15 development of the province and further 200 governing capacity you can expand the infrastructure more for more slots of buildings and manufactories.

Hope you’ve enjoyed today's development diary! Next week we’ll be back with a new diary which will be written by Johan!
 
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wkscrombie said:
Oof, good point. Maybe some other modifier to make it more worthwhile, then, like goods produced?
Click to expand...

Well that sort of clashes with manufactories, but I am not opposed to having something more no.
 
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alexaaaar said:
200 GC seems a bit crazy for the early game! A cool idea would be to reduce the governing capacity cost for primary culture land, buffing religious ideas and making culture converting relevant outside of trying for a one culture
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I like that a lot. Maybe economic and/or administrative ideas could reduce the cost, too.
 
Groogy said:
Well that sort of clashes with manufactories, but I am not opposed to having something more no.
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True. Maybe +100% local production efficiency and/or +100% local trade power? That’d synergize nicely with manufactories.
 
You say you try make playing tall more comfort, but right now it seems totaly not enought to "play tall vs play expansive" As tall player you spend 200 GC to get 1 building. As Expansionist you spend 3 GC for same. As tall your investment to deving provinces is still more then conquere lands. You say 5 mana per dev. But conquest can be evenl less then 1 mana for 1 dev.
 
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Romanix90 said:
One suggestion @Groogy could you or someone else in the team rework Russian mission tree. Not in this expansion but sometimes in the future. My suggestion is to rework it so player or ai can procreate borders of Russian empire, conquest of Caucasus and conquest of Central Asia. Also while at it perhaps Russia could have unique government reforms to push.
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They’ve already reworked the mission tree once since the old missions were reformatted with Rule Britannia, and it does already have the Tsardom reform. I’m always happy for more flavor and Muscovy->Russia is probably my favorite tag to play as, but I’m pretty happy with how it is now.
 
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As i see, you`re trying to make using vassals - a way for playing. Maybe there is some sense in Singleplayer for someone, but honestly, i think now annexing is more profitable, but you surely have statistic about it.

A long time ago, then my friends tried to make mode for balance, he added more significant bonuses for military/naval limit + manpower. And even in mp people started to use vassals for a long perspective. But this mode died because in mp were dissyncs. What do you think about making vassals more useful than now?
And even, i think, it really would be cool, if you give some way to control armies of vassals directly, becase, we all know it - AI can`t really help you, even if he tries, and it`s the main cause, why mostly, players annexed AI as soon as possible.
 
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Pale Blue said:
Maybe it's me, but something like a 200% governing would increase gov cost of a 15dev province by 15. For me that's not almost nothing. That's the cost of a 15dev province without giving you manpower, tax, production, trade, force limit. It also gives you less building slots than a 15 Dev province. Sure you can build more buildings in the same province, but the gain of buildings drops, if you can't build multiple of the same building.
Click to expand...
not 200% just 200
 
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So, assuming +1 manufactory is to incentivize people to build the four new manufactories, I can see that optimally, player will need ~800 GC per provinces, so in a full game, we probably will only see 5-6 provinces reach its full potential (and control around 18-20ish provinces) (Though it is just my rough estimate, people with better calculation and experience might bring different number). I can respect that, but I think future balancing and feedback will change the number somewhat (150-175 is my guess).

I suppose my other initial resistance to the number is because you only get +1 building slot, and buildings aren't exactly that powerful (or at least my impression is). So a boost in building efficiency or more building slot plus more building type probably will help with my doubt.

But for now, I am watching with keen interest (because I am interested with the concept).
 
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In order to make managment of GC some what reasonoble, yuo need ither remove the slot reqirement for courthouse so yuo can clikc them through macrobilder or add in macrobilder option to destroy buildings. There is an option also to add a button to destroy some kind of buldings in all country/area (yes templs, i am looking at yuo).
In terms of managment yuor country for WC, those changes do nothing, cause most of the conqest take place in 17-18 centuries, and at this point yuo just build them everyvare, but yuo can not do this via macrobilder cause most of the prov at that point have no building slots. So at some point yuo have to go to every province, manually destroy 1 or 2 building, then and only then build a courhouse, which is REALY anoing. I finished my first WC on 1.3 couple days ago and the ammount of micro in late game is just frostraiting and killed desire to play EU4 in me for atleast couple of months.
 
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I like the extra building for governing capacity feature as it would allow for tall playstile to be viable, although I worry that it will become a bit useless in center of trade provinces as, due to the fact that centers of trade already take up the space of 2 building slots, this feature might become useless once 40/50 development with a lv3 center is achieved, making the whole idea of a tall play obsolete
 
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ABK said:
In order to make managment of GC some what reasonoble, yuo need ither remove the slot reqirement for courthouse so yuo can clikc them through macrobilder or add in macrobilder option to destroy buildings. There is an option also to add a button to destroy some kind of buldings in all country/area (yes templs, i am looking at yuo).
Click to expand...
Also shipyards in every coastal province
 
The 200 gc feature instead of removing the micro by making courthouses free building slots really shows me where the priorities are for eu4 future.

As most have said, 200 is in the area of I will never touch this and it’s worthless, even 50 would be way too expensive.
 
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It seems like most people here find the cost of infrastructure way too high (and rightfully so in my opinion) but the developers don't seem the share in this concern

So instead of lowering the base cost, I'd suggest to implement ways of reducing this cost, and add an infrastructure expansion cost reduction modifier to the game.

Perhaps a modifier in the economic ideas, or a new policy (economic+maritime?) and another modifier for embracing industrialization (representing Railroads).

Also, goverment reforms that reduce goverment capacity (Aka: Tall Nations) should also come with discounts to infrastructure to compensate the fact they'll have a lot less goverment capacity to spend on this new feature (despite being a tall feature tailored for them).

Also, if this is supposed to be a mostly a mid-late game feature, and economy is usually no longer much of an issue by then, then i would also suggest adding a couple more non-economic related modifiers to the province, such as recruitment speed, building speed, supply limit, or movement speed.

And finally, and this is merely an "asthetic issue" but can you make it so that this is not a magical button that you click and *poof* now infrastructure is magically better?
Please make it so its a gradual process where you click the button and the province starts gaining +1 goverment capacity cost a day untill it reaches its full cost (200) and finally unlocks the extra slot. And also, the province's maintaince should be increased by 200% (representing the actual infrastructure being built) for the duration of this expansion. Infrastructure in real life is always an investment, not a quick buck.
 
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Please : Balance your idea : 200 governing (non reductible) for +1 Buildings capacity (it's not +2 : it's +1 wich can be a second manufacture)

This is of course useless at the start of a game
Lot too much at the middle, when we are over our governing capacity
Useless at the end of the game when we own 50% of the world (or more)

The good cost should be 10-20 governing cost at most (non reductible) OR (+25% governing cost)
 
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wkscrombie said:
They’ve already reworked the mission tree once since the old missions were reformatted with Rule Britannia, and it does already have the Tsardom reform. I’m always happy for more flavor and Muscovy->Russia is probably my favorite tag to play as, but I’m pretty happy with how it is now.
Click to expand...
I thought perhaps to expand their missions to encourage player to go and conquer Caucasus and Central Asia. Its a head of time but it makes it more fun. For example i played one time as England/GB and i conquerd Egypt via ''Secure Alexandria and Egyptian Authority''. And i must say it was fun.
 
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HeyIAmInfinity said:
The 200 gc feature instead of removing the micro by making courthouses free building slots really shows me where the priorities are for eu4 future.

As most have said, 200 is in the area of I will never touch this and it’s worthless, even 50 would be way too expensive.
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Being able to build a courthouse in every single state without it even being a question wouldn't be very interesting gameplay imo. Might as well just make a level of admin tech that reduces all province GC costs by the amount a courthouse would at that point.
 
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lungzatar said:
Please : Balance your idea : 200 governing (non reductible) for +1 Buildings capacity (it's not +2 : it's +1 wich can be a second manufacture)

This is of course useless at the start of a game
Lot too much at the middle, when we are over our governing capacity
Useless at the end of the game when we own 50% of the world (or more)

The good cost should be 10-20 governing cost at most (non reductible) OR (+25% governing cost)
Click to expand...
From what I can tell this is specifically designed to be impossible to use when you're blobbing all over the world, so I don't see what the problem really is for assessment of it for late game. This suggestion goes well outside the intent, from a one-off bonus for one specific place to some economic bonus you just put in good provinces all over the map late game. It's specifically designed for players who aren't blobbing to stay at least in the remote ballpark of economically competitive. It obviously won't amount to all that much, but the intent isn't to be for standard blob all over the map behavior.
 
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lungzatar said:
Please : Balance your idea : 200 governing (non reductible) for +1 Buildings capacity (it's not +2 : it's +1 wich can be a second manufacture)

This is of course useless at the start of a game
Lot too much at the middle, when we are over our governing capacity
Useless at the end of the game when we own 50% of the world (or more)

The good cost should be 10-20 governing cost at most (non reductible) OR (+25% governing cost)
Click to expand...
It designed for "tall players" witch not conqure lot lands. like "I form netherland and not expand anymore exept some colony" but being 10-15 province country at 1700 year with that "improving" is not any better then now exept - you can burn out all your GC
 
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