EU4 - Development Diary - 28th January 2016

[123e55]

Serbs, Bosnians and Croats are basically the same people split by different religions. It's like brothers arguing over who owns the room they sleep in.



Transylvania has always been too multicultural to be a true successor to anybody, but yeah it should be able to form both countries with a culture switch, so if you form Hungary culture switches to Hungarian, for Romania you get Romanian.

That would be simply too complicated for a player. Keep in mind that gameplay is also important.
They should be able to form both countries, and when they form for example Hungary, they would switch to hungarian by the decision. Simple.

 

[Prometheus_1]

Hello .... Here is My sugestion for Italy correction , not all of Central Italy was under Papal Control , and thats the reason of the Borgia's wars ... This is how I propose to change it a little mod I did , not perfect but it shows a better historically correct subdivisiona and political situation of Italy in 1444 .

Link to Mod

I would really love if you coul dtake into consideration those modifications , it will make Italy gameplay more interesting and historicaly correct , Among some things that I didn't tocuh as I yet not sure how to do is that :
Sicily shoudl be a union under Aragon but as Kingdom of Sicily .
Istria should have Italian Istriote culture so as Gorz that is called Gorizia
Dalmatia shoudl have venetian
as well as the vescovades of Trento and Bressanone.
Savoje is Savoia in ITalian and Nice is Nizza, Montferrat is Monferrato etc...

 

[War_lord]

Wiz has already said that they aren't going to go down the tiny unclickable provinces route.

 

[DarkImpaler]

Wiz has already said that they aren't going to go down the tiny unclickable provinces route.

That's a shame because, frankly, that Italy up there makes much more sense than the chaos there is now in the game

 

[War_lord]

Gameplay concerns beat historical accuracy arguments.

 

[Martin_Mortyry]

Silesia was germanised in late XVIII and XIX. Upper Silesia (represented as Ratibor province in game) was never fully germanised.

The process of German colonisation in Polish duchies started as soon as XIII century*. I'm pretty sure that they already were majority in some villages and cities back in 1444. Maybe not enough to change culture in Glogau and Breslau to Saxon, but the settlement was still pretty massive even in XV c.
About Ratibor you're right. Again, I don't propose changing culture in Silesia, it would be awful for gameplay.

*Yeah, yeah, "Wikipedia is not a reliable source" etc. etc. Well sorry, but that's the first image presenting Ostsiedlung I've found, and I'm lazy!

 

[DarkImpaler]

Gameplay concerns beat historical accuracy arguments.

Indeed, can't argue with that it's just a shame

 

[War_lord]

Maybe in EU 5 the map will be higher resolution and thus more provinces.

 

[Oldpara]

The process of German colonisation in Polish duchies started as soon as XIII century*. I'm pretty sure that they already were majority in some villages and cities back in 1444. Maybe not enough to change culture in Glogau and Breslau to Saxon, but the settlement was still pretty massive even in XV c.
About Ratibor you're right. Again, I don't propose changing culture in Silesia, it would be awful for gameplay.

*Yeah, yeah, "Wikipedia is not a reliable source" etc. etc. Well sorry, but that's the first image presenting Ostsiedlung I've found, and I'm lazy!

Sure, cities were germanised much faster, but not inhabitants of rural areas and nobles. Tbh even Krakow was highly germanised at this time of history as Poles (Nobles) highly praised living in small palaces (dworki) in rural areas. Being a burgher in Poland wasn't something influencial and desired, so it was left to foreginers - mostly Germans and Jews.

 

[ChildeR]

Maybe in EU 5 the map will be higher resolution and thus more provinces.

A higher resolution wouldn't fix the issues. The convenient province size is currently limited by how small an area you can target with your mouse, which is mostly unrelated to both screen resolution or map resolution. And zoom is not a real solution, since it just means you have to scroll more, which is also inconvenient.

I think the only change that would justify having much smaller provinces would be if you didn't have to interact with them. I.e. they were mostly just for movement and all the interesting stuff (buildings, recruitment, etc. and thus also computations) happened one level higher in something like the current "areas".

 

[Rikissa]

Loving the Ireland changes! I hope you will also look at other regions in the future to better represent their historical wealth

I agree that the West Slavic group now occupies a bit of a weird spot, although I wouldn't want Polish to end up in its own culture group under the current culture mechanics (I guess there is no need to group it with Lithuanian since you can form the Commonwealth ingame and the Commonwealth may also never arise)

I wonder if there would be a way to bring Slovenian culture in the game - historically the area was bilingual but with a Slovene majority, on the other hand it always seemed strange to me that another bilingual region, South Tyrol (as it is in the game), was Venetian culture and Austria would get full penalties there

 

[DanubianCossak]

A higher resolution wouldn't fix the issues. The convenient province size is currently limited by how small an area you can target with your mouse, which is mostly unrelated to both screen resolution or map resolution. And zoom is not a real solution, since it just means you have to scroll more, which is also inconvenient.

I think the only change that would justify having much smaller provinces would be if you didn't have to interact with them. I.e. they were mostly just for movement and all the interesting stuff (buildings, recruitment, etc. and thus also computations) happened one level higher in something like the current "areas".

The convenient province size is limited by the position of camera and resolution of the map. So higher resolution map would allow for "smaller" provinces to be added and be clickable.

 

[ChildeR]

The convenient province size is limited by the position of camera and resolution of the map.

Which "resolution of the map"? The number of pixels on screen or the resolution of provinces.bmp? The latter matters very little and the former is much less important than the *area* on screen.

 

[DanubianCossak]

Which "resolution of the map"? The number of pixels on screen or the resolution of provinces.bmp? The latter matters very little and the former is much less important than the *area* on screen.

Resolution of provinces.bmp combined with changing the maximum zoom level of point of camera. So higher resolution provinces.bmp (for example doubling the number of pixels) and allowing you to zoom in closer would let you add smaller provinces (camera would change the area on screen).

 

[ChildeR]

Resolution of provinces.bmp combined with changing the maximum zoom level of point of camera. So higher resolution provinces.bmp (for example doubling the number of pixels) and allowing you to zoom in closer would let you add smaller provinces.

Yes, but like I said that means more time zooming or scrolling. So also inconvenient.

 

[DanubianCossak]

Yes, but like I said that means more time zooming or scrolling. So also inconvenient.

Im almost 100% sure that EU4 map has higher resolution than EU3 map - do you spend more time scrolling? Nope. You play on "basic" zoomlevel most of the time. If that basic level was adjusted the right way, you wouldnt even notice. (if youre anything like me, your eyes are used to certain point of reference, for example the size of unit 3d model, the size of city 3d model etc, all of those objects have a scale level in a file that can be adjusted, they can be made 3x "bigger" or 3x "smaller" in 2 seconds, if the on map points of reference change you cant even tell that the resolution of map is changed, no?)

For example check out how much bigger the city models (sprawl) i use in my mod compared to vanilla:

Spoiler

 

[ChildeR]

Im almost 100% sure that EU4 map has higher resolution than EU3 map - do you spend more time scrolling? Nope. You play on "basic" zoomlevel most of the time. If that basic level was adjusted the right way, you wouldnt even notice.

Yes, I spend most time on ~one zoom. However, I spend a lot of time scrolling around the map. If I set my "default" zoom closer in, I spend more time scrolling around and see less of what is going on at the same time.

 

[Ri0Rdian]

You answered your own question, they were a loyal part of the Kingdom of Hungary for about 918 years. Culture grouping in EU4 isn't about language anymore, it's about political culture.

Jeez, "loyal".


I despise nationalism, but this kind of attitude is making me more nationalist slowly, but steadily. People that have no idea what they are talking about should remain silent or risk looking stupid.

I would say let those that are involved voice their opinion, cause there's a small chance it will be at least partially true.

Edit:
Political culture... well, we have Bohemia, Slovakia, Austria, Hungary, Slovenia, parts of Italy, Serbia, Croatia, Bosnia, Transylvania and even parts of Poland as a part of common state for most of the time period this game represents. The only true multinational kingdom in Europe. Dump them down into one group and see what happens. Adjust as needed.

 

[Heinrich de Medlich]

I appreciate that you work on the european cultures and the proposed provinces for hungary are better than the current ones but still not historically correct.
First of all, Pozsony (also known as Preßburg) was until 1918-1920 a hungarian city with a large german-austrian minority. During the otoman expansion in eastern hungary it was even the hungarian capital!
It makes absolutely no sense defining a "slovak" culture for this province because the slovak dominance in this city started not earlier than 1918 when they integrated this territory into the new checoslovak republic, gave it the new name "Bratislava" and started to expell the hungarian and german population.

To handle this better, there should be created a new province called "Nitra" with slovak culture (however in 1444 they where called "Nitranians" and the term slovak didn't existed yet) in the north of the current province Pozsony and Pozsony reduced to region near the danube river and extendend a bit to the south.

Slovak culture if you really want to implement (it is imho debatable if it existed in the games time periode) is part of the western slavic culture group and it makes no sense to put it in the same group as hungarian culture.

 

[Girroj]

I do agree that the Slovack Culture should be in the Czech and polish group. But if that happens then they are really just Czech.

I don't think so. Slovak language is much closer to Polish than to Czech. (I speak Polish and understand the Slovaks, but not the Czechs.) Historically, they never belonged to the same country during the EU4 period. They'd rather qualify as Hungarian than as Czech. In my opinion, the "Carpathian" culture is just an arbitrary grouping of leftover cultures that don't fit elsewhere. You could also put Polish, Czech and Silesian as "Carpathian".
I think, Hungarian should be isolated, since it was different from all others. I assume that the decision was made for gameplay reasons.