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EU4 - Development Diary - 7th of May 2019

Hi there and welcome to another dev diary for EU4. I am Pierre, I’ve been part of the EU4 Content Design team since December, and I feel honoured to be able to give you your first peeks at the new content we are making for the big European update and expansion we have planned for the end of the year.

This is the first of several dev diaries that will focus on the map changes we have made, giving large parts of the European map a much-needed revamp. I’ll be starting with Germany (which for purely arbitrary reasons shall for today include Switzerland and Bohemia, but not Austria). As @neondt stated in an earlier dev diary, our aim was not to recreate Voltaire’s Nightmare or to populate the entire HRE map with OPMs (this would have been eminently possible) but rather to create more depth and more interesting gameplay situations within it, righting various wrongs and finding ways to better represent the various dynamics of the empire’s territories along the way.

As with previous patches, all map changes shown here will be part of the free patch. In previous map previews, we have often revealed the idea groups of the new tags, and rest assured we will be adding new ideas to replace the generic German ones. However, the work to do so still lies in the future, so in the meantime I’d just like to give a shoutout to this thread – if you want to know what we are looking for in terms of threads suggesting new idea groups, look no further.

So without further ado…

South Germany

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The lack of primogeniture in Bavaria until the 1500s led to several splits of the Duchy in the 14th century before its reunification in 1503. At game start, Wittelsbach Bavaria is divided between Munich, Landshut and Ingolstadt, who will have to fight it out for the duchy (or hope they inherit it). However, Bavaria can console itself with the fact that, once united, it will have considerably more resources at its disposal than in 1.28, with new provinces in Innbaiern (modern Innviertel, ceded to Austria in 1779; capital: Braunau), Freising, Rosenheim and Donauwörth (which has Swabian culture and is a releasable tag). We hope for Bavaria to become a strong power within the HRE in the next patch. To make this more likely, we will be adding DHEs such as this one to the Bavarian sub-duchies:

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Also new to Bavaria is the inclusion of Regensburg as a Free City and Passau as a Bishopric. At present, the latter is a vassal under Munich, since historically Munich’s territories more or less surrounded Passau and we do not wish the latter to be easy food for Bohemia or Austria. Finally, Salzburg (already in the Bavarian geographic area) now has Bavarian culture, which more correctly represents its situation in 1444 – it was part of the Bavarian Circle and was only annexed by Austria as late as 1805.

Moving south, the large province of Tirol has been split in several pieces, with the independent County of Bregenz (currently Austrian culture) to the west representing one of the more challenging starting positions in the HRE (they have 5 development and an heir with low legitimacy). The main province has been further split between Inntal (capital: Innsbruck) and Etschtal (capital: Meran).

Switzerland, too, has seen a makeover. The Swiss Confederacy was a growing power in the 15th century but was not yet close to controlling all of what would become Switzerland. Whilst we elected not to start with individual independent Swiss Cantons (this would simply make them easy prey for Austria, Milan, Savoy and Burgundy), we did split off the largest independent force, the Three Leagues. In the process, Graubünden was split to become Illanz and Chur, and Fribourg/Freiburg was added west of Bern.

Finally, Swabia has seen considerable changes. Firstly, Austria’s holdings in Swabia (or “Further Austria” are better represented, with Breisgau now being ruled by Austria, as it was in history. Baden has been compensated with the addition of Durlach (which would later become Karlsruhe) to its north. Wurttemberg, which was the largest territorial state in Swabia but somehow is an OPM with 6 development in EU4, now has a new province in the form of Urach (capital: Reutlingen) and a substantial buff in terms of development. Additionally, Ravensburg has been swapped for the Free City of Konstanz, Alsace is now the Bishopric of Strasbourg, the new tag of Mulhouse has been added to represent the Decapolis in southern Alsace, and Ulm is no longer wildly mislocated.

To add a bit more interest to the area, states of Swabian culture will now be able to form Swabia.

Central Germany and Bohemia

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Saxony has been given several new provinces but has also been split in two. Like Bavaria, Saxony did not have primogeniture; unlike Bavaria, Saxony never fully resolved this issue. As a result, in the 15th century, it was split several times, with the end result being the Treaty of Leipzig in 1485, where Saxony was split between the two brothers Ernest and Albert on lines similar to those displayed on the map above, except that both continued calling themselves Saxony and Ernest (Thuringia) gained Wittenberg and the Electorate. Thuringia/Ernestine Saxony later lost the Electorate to (Albertine) Saxony and split into many, many pieces. This all lies in the future in 1444 (via several planned DHEs), so the current division is based on that in 1445 between the brothers Friedrich and Wilhelm. Thuringia starts under PU by Saxony, but there will be several events which will make it a difficult subject to keep quiet for Saxony. New provinces are Zwickau in Saxony and three in Thuringia (previously one province with low development), which is now much better represented by Erfurt (Mainz has a core on this province to represent certain historical complexities), Weimar and Coburg (Franconian culture).

Franconia has seen a few more provinces and tags added. Most importantly, Franconia itself is now a formable tag if you manage to unite the Franconian lands. This is however easier said than done as Franconia now includes two Free Cities and lands owned by strong neighbours (i.e. Coburg by Thuringia). Würzburg, the titular holders of the duchy, remain the strongest power, with a new province in Fulda (Rhenish i.e. Hessian culture) and vassal in Bamberg. Their main rivals, Ansbach, now have Bayreuth as their junior partners in PU. They are now also bordered on the west by Rothenburg, another new Free City. Finally, the large province of Mainz has been split and the new Franconian culture province of Aschaffenburg has been added.

Moving West, @Ofaloaf did some pyrotechnics to the lower Rhineland map to make space to squeeze in Jülich (owned by Berg). The Palatinate has a new province in Zweibrücken, and although Hessen has no new provinces, its provinces have been renamed to Oberhessen and Niederhessen, with Niederhessen (Kassel) now the capital and more affluent province.

Finally, Bohemia, like other regions, has gained some new provinces. Lusatia has been split in three (with Oberlausitz split between Bautzen and Görlitz). This has allowed us to make Lusatia an area and releasable tag, with the provinces now having Sorbian culture. Silesia, as you can see, has been split in two between Glogau and Opole. Silesia the tag still exists and can be formed by a Silesian country that owns all of Silesia and is not a subject. Bohemia and Moravia have seen three more provinces added, with space being made for Jindrichuv Hradec, Pardubice and Ostrava. Although this is quite a few new provinces, we split the development of existing provinces to make room for them, so Bohemian starting development is not noticeably higher; we will of course be paying attention to the balance side of things to avoid Bohemia becoming the Ottomans of Europe.

Northern Germany

upload_2019-5-6_13-46-21.png


We restrained ourselves from adding too many provinces to Brandenburg, mainly because this was not a very densely inhabited area and in 1444 few would have predicted that it would later rise to power. However, they did gain a new province in Brandenburg (the city) and are stronger than most of their neighbours, so if they can secure the alliances needed to keep the likes of Bohemia away, they are still well-placed to expand – especially since the sale of Neumark will now also grant them Dramburg.

Pomerania had a bit of a situation with their lack of primogeniture too (I seem to be repeating myself here). In fact, they split many, many times and were united much more seldom than they were divided. We went for a fairly conservative split and made them into Wolgast in the west and Stettin in the east, with new provinces in Wolgast and Rügen. A united Pomerania will of course be able to form Pomerania. Also, Rügen is a releasable tag that, in homage to Klaus Störtebecker and the hotbed of piracy that was the Baltic, will have the opportunity of going pirate if you own Golden Century.

The smaller states to the west of Brandenburg have each gained provinces, with Mecklenburg now correctly owning Stargard, Lüneburg’s significance better represented by the addition of Celle, and Magdeburg now owning the bishop’s summer residence of Halle. Braunschweig (previously one of the largest provinces of the HRE) has had the city of Göttingen split off it to the south (still owned by the Brunswick tag though) and is bordered to the east by the new Free City of Goslar, and the tag Verden now also owns a province called Verden as well as Stade.

Further west, Cologne too has an extra province in Paderborn (which is a releasable tag) and Berg is our new bordergore galore tag, owning Bielefeld as well as Berg and Jülich. Last but not least, Dortmund has also been added as a Free City.

Another change that we made in the north is in the cultures. There have been many calls for a “Lower Saxon” culture, and we have heeded these calls by splitting the Westphalian culture. Conveniently, this allows us to make the Kingdom of Hannover into the formable for the Lower Saxons and Westphalia into that for the Westphalians and Rhenish peoples.

upload_2019-5-6_14-54-18.png


As a final note, I’d add that our focus on the Holy Roman Empire gives us a good opportunity to add flavour events for the tags populating it. I’ve been loving reading through the suggestions in threads such as this one. Please keep them coming, and if there is any interesting historical event you would like to see in the game, feel free to ping me (I can also read German and French, so you can send me links in those languages too).

That’s it for now. Next week, I’ll be presenting a few of the German mission trees we have prepared so far.
 
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Why would they do that instead of adding a new province tho?
Because Groningen was in the Frisian sphere of influence mostly. Part of the Frisian Freedom. Drenthe wasn't a part of the Frisian Freedom, even though some parts of Drenthe were under Groningen's influence.
 
idk i somehow feal underwhealmed so far did expect that there would be more Depth given to germanic Region since ist EUROPA universalis i mean india got over 100 provinces added, i also hope greece and southern italy get renewed .I mean all critisism for Imperator aside there u see what would be possible mapwhise dont get why we cant have that in eu4.since ive been lately playing a lot of HOI4 i i didnt get the national Focus tree out of my mind wouldnt it be great to have the outdated national ideas revreshed with a national Focus tree simular to the Mission tree but u go down a path to get the ideas which suits ur playstyle or Situation.
 
The map changes are really great. But I think it would be even better to develop the structure of the HRE itself.

One of the problems I've felt about playing a nation in the HRE is that there is no real incentive, unless you are the emperor, to consider the whole HRE as a coherent political body. It feels more like a room full of people chaotically fighting each other for land, with a single referee yelling to be heard above the noise.

In reality, the HRE, although heavily decentralized, does have the trappings of a unified realm, with laws and rulings. And the legitimacy these kinds of rulings conferred was important in politics. The only inkling we have of this in the game is the unlawful territory penalty and the aggressive expansion amplifier.

I think implementing an Imperial Diet would do a lot to make nations in the HRE feel more like members of an actual political union; that is, to care about the HRE as a whole. Members of the diet could propose rulings, seek allies to support their proposals, intervene in internal wars, discuss taxes and manpower contributions to the emperor, and so on.

In particular, things like unlawful territory should probably be decided in a diet rather than by the fiat of the emperor. Emperors can call diets on certain occasions, when they are seeking support, and diets might otherwise meet every four years or so (the period changing as the HRE becomes more or less centralized). Having the support of the Imperial Diet might grant the emperor bonuses when fighting an external foe, much like a crusade.

Being able to influence members to support their proposals in a diet would, I think, be the right way for an emperor to demonstrate their power and enact centralization reforms, rather than waiting for mystical points to accumulate over time. Nations would naturally resist things like giving money or manpower to the emperor unless they really like the emperor. To achieve this, the impetus is on the emperor to make the majority of the HRE feel happy and protected. Rather than just running out the clock for reforms to happen, emperors would have to be pro-active in getting their agenda passed to make unifying the HRE a reality.

In general, diplomatic power is modeled well by exerting influence over a deliberative body, so it makes sense to do it for the HRE, where diplomacy is a big part of the game. It would also be nice if the HRE felt like more than just an interface with a bunch of nice bonuses for the emperor.
 
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Hmmm, after some good looks, I'm not that disappointed. There are some rough things I would like to see changed (couple of them mentioned here) and I don't agree with some design-decisions, but it ain't bad. I like some parts, dislike others.
 
- Given that formable Franconia and Swabia are now being introduced, could they replace Ansbach and Wurttemberg respectively as their cultures' primary nations?

- Could Saxony be made a reformable tag for countries of Saxon culture? Given that all other stem-duchies can now be formed (with the exception of Lotharingia, but that might be covered in a future DD about Burgundy), it'd be nice if there's an option to reform the duchy of Saxony as a minor Saxon nation, if one wishes to do so. Perhaps there could even be distinction between the stem-duchy of Saxony and the electorate of Saxony, giving the option for Saxony itself to form a new tag after reclaiming its former territories?

- Does Austria’s holdings in Swabia have releasable nations? Say, the county of Ferrette for Sundgau and the county of Freiburg for Breisgau.

- While it is understandable that not all Silesian duchies could be added, why wasn't the Duchy of Troppau AKA Principality of Opava included? Given that the principality was ruled by the last surviving branch of the Premyslid dynasty (the first and the longest-lasting dynasty of Bohemia), it would've made an interesting challenge for a vassal to overthrow their liege and seize their former dynastic lands in order to re-establish Premyslid rule over the Crown of Bohemia.
 
@Caligula Caesar Will we see a bit from another region next week besides the mission trees? Or do we have to wait a bit longer for that?
 
Provence and Lorraine are redacted, but appear to still be there. Hmm, what could that mean?

idk i somehow feal underwhealmed so far did expect that there would be more Depth given to germanic Region since ist EUROPA universalis i mean india got over 100 provinces added, i also hope greece and southern italy get renewed .I mean all critisism for Imperator aside there u see what would be possible mapwhise dont get why we cant have that in eu4.since ive been lately playing a lot of HOI4 i i didnt get the national Focus tree out of my mind wouldnt it be great to have the outdated national ideas revreshed with a national Focus tree simular to the Mission tree but u go down a path to get the ideas which suits ur playstyle or Situation.

India was a huge region that was neglected in terms of provinces for a long time. The HRE's provinces have mostly been the "right" size for a while now.

Besides, why does EUROPA matter? Making the game richer by improving the entire map is obviously the better approach. Same with CK2.
 
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Sounds like there are going to be a couple of new interesting HRE starts when you are done :)



Bit of a concern: With so many medium tags splintered, how often are we really going to see a strong AI Baveria (or the other formable tags) before they get eaten by their big neighbours? Is there something like reduced AE in the mission tree, when you fight within your own dutchy or something?
 
How about the ability to re-establish countries in the HRE whose cores have run out due to being unactive for over 50 years?
With AI being so aggressive and landgrabing as it is, you might end up with a very slim HRE if your not starting as an early emperor.
 
With all these new formables, will the standard HRE restrictions be lifted for them? Or are they all still going to require you being free from the HRE or an elector?
@neondt
 
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Could Saxony be made a reformable tag for countries of Saxon culture? Given that all other stem-duchies can now be formed (with the exception of Lotharingia, but that might be covered in a future DD about Burgundy), it'd be nice if there's an option to reform the duchy of Saxony as a minor Saxon nation, if one wishes to do so. Perhaps there could even be distinction between the stem-duchy of Saxony and the electorate of Saxony, giving the option for Saxony itself to form a new tag after reclaiming its former territories?

I mean, Lorraine is right there. I'd rather see Lotharingia be represented by a permanent bonus at the end of a Lorrainian mission tree rather than a formable.

Likewise, I'd represent the Stem Duchy of Saxony by giving Saxony missions to reclaim the lost territories.
 
These map changes are a solid foundation! I'm just a little bit concerned by Switzerland's lack of split (Geneva!!), but everything left is a good step in the right direction.
Good job. :)
 
As everyone i do hope that this (nice) change, will not be the update for HRE. There is plenty of things to Rework, and the provinces are the least of it. Though, new Bavaria with its little vassal swarm will be a pain in the lower part of the back of Austria. Good.
 
all I want is an HRE that doesn't become 4 or 5 big blobs by the 1800s, if that can happen little else matters to me

also Austrian centralization in the 1500s needs to be represented too thanks
 
Some provinces more or less won't improve the game at all.

Hopefully this wont turn into another Dharma which was mostly inconsequential map changes and missions but lacked any actual improvements.

For now I assume you start with map changes and next week mission trees because they are easy to do and already finished and not because they will be your main content like in Dharma.
Hopefully I wont be disappointed.

In a pattern pretty much established over the time for each patch or DLC, early dev diaries tends to concentrate on map changes before they are ready to be talking about new mechanics or any changes to existing mechanics. Since they said the upcoming DLC is not due for a release until the end of this year, I think this time-frame suggests that it is premature to be talking about new mechanics or changes to existing mechanics that is still being fleshed out right now as we are speaking. I suspect there will be several more DDs about map changes before we get there.

I also personally disagree that having more provinces won't improve the game at all as I feel they do add to the game as does the mechanics. I think they CAN do both adding more provinces and reworking existing mechanics / adding new mechanics. Given that the upcoming DLC is not due for a release until the end of this year, I think they have plenty of time for both.
 
I’m excited for new provinces as much as the next guy but... in exchange for detail they add to the clickfest, and I really hope to see some new ‘intertagtional’ mechanics.