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Europa Universalis IV - Development Diary 17th of January 2023 - Emperor of China

Hey everyone, happy new year and I hope 2023 grants you health, growth and lots of love. Let’s take a look at the new content we have prepared for China! We started thinking about this one year ago, while working on the 1.33 update, but now the time has come for it!

Before we begin, the content you will see here is by no means finalized, as always your feedback is greatly appreciated and cherished!

Playing Europa Universalis is all about building up your nation, growing and expanding your borders. It’s all about the struggles and the thrills of each conquest, fighting at the edge of bankruptcy or measuring your moves carefully. However, Ming does not really suffer from these issues at the hands of a player due to the fact that it starts as the nation with the highest development and strongest economy in 1444 and until 1.35 it was regarded as a fairly relaxing experience for most players. Surely there are some minor obstacles early on, but in general the playthrough was not at all challenging and thus many players steered away from playing the Great Ming, despite it having a not-insubstantial amount of flavor in the form of events, factions and later the Mandate of Heaven mechanic, the latter of which ended up being a bit of a pain to manage. All this unrealized potential is what we seek to tackle by giving the Ming, its offshoot Chinese Warlords as well as the Jurchen tribes and the Qing lots of new missions, events and more!

The Ming will see many new additions, mechanics and cool-stuff-in-general with 1.35:
  • A brand new, fully-fleshed out mission tree
  • Accompanied by a new Estate - the Eunuchs
  • New tough challenges as you struggle to curb the influence of the Eunuchs and prevent your (historical) collapse
  • Over a dozen new Reforms that interact with and are complemented by various missions (yes we tweaked the gain and loss of Mandate)
  • New Decrees that interact with and are complemented by various missions
  • New Flavor events integrated in the mission tree - as well as independent from it
  • Deep modability and new functions added to the Mandate mechanic
  • A new great project that spans several provinces

So let’s take a look at the tree!


mingtreefull.png

(Note; Icons are a WIP!)​

The Ming historically were rulers of unprecedented magnanimity, wealth and the ambition to match their huge domain. However, in 1444 the starting ruler sadly fell short to live up to his predecessor’s abilities, represented in the game as a 1/1/1. The Great Ming Empire lies stretched and continuously tormented by hordes in the North and West, waning influence with its tributaries in the South and no say in the affairs of Japan. During the game, you may also suffer from floods and earthquakes which historically kickstarted (and ended) the Ming Dynasty and will rapidly corrode the growth of the Mandate. Their impact can be alleviated by constructing certain buildings and completing a couple relevant missions.

The starting situation of the Great Ming is represented and explained in a start-up event:
startingmingevent.png

Note; missions, art and descriptions are not final!​
Autonomy in the provinces of the Empire will increase, at a minimum of +25%. This autonomy will persist and you will have the ability to reduce and eventually eradicate it, as you reign in the various external and internal elements that threaten the Empire. This will not be an easy task.

The second obstacle, and arguably the one that gave my colleagues the biggest pain to deal with, is the Eunuchs Estate. A powerful body of advisors near the Emperor who will gain and lose power depending on the state of internal affairs as well as the abilities of the Emperor himself.


Eunuchs will offer a vast array of very powerful Estate privileges, most of which will scale with their internal power in the form of crown land controlled as shown below:

eunuchs1.png

Note; Yes, they will start with nearly 60% crown land while you will start with only 15% to better represent the grip of power between the starting ruler of the Ming and his Eunuchs.

eunuchprivileges.png

Note; Icons are a work in progress!
You won’t be able to reform your country anywhere near as fast if you do it by crushing the influence of the Eunuchs, BUT if you do lean on them too much, the accumulated cost of fighting their inevitable corruption will become overbearing, difficult to manage and you will collapse. It is up to the player to strike the perfect balance between manipulating this double-edged sword.

Moreover, I took the liberty to give this new Estate a unique disaster, unlike other Estates’ similar predicaments. This one will hurt a lot more and its solution is considerably harsher than other Estate Disasters. When other Estate Disasters require you to lower influence and enact a national decision in order to end the disaster, the Eunuch disaster will have its decision fundamentally altered. Much like other estates, it will end when the reigning estate’s influence falls low enough. However, every time you enact the national decision available during the disaster, Eunuchs will:
  • Lose 1 random privilege so as to lower their influence
  • Spawn a special large stack of rebels, every province this stack of rebels sieges will lower your mandate considerably
  • cost you stability (which is required to enact this decision)

1673866312777.png



This loop continues until the estate’s influence is either low enough or they have no privileges, so you best steer clear from the disaster!
You will also be able to interact with the estate via missions and events, unlock new privileges (that do not cost yearly corruption) etc.
Before we move on, be aware that the AI is instructed as to how it will utilize and play around with the Yearly Corruption but Ming still explodes relatively frequently as it used to!
Let’s take a look at some of the new missions, their requirements and more importantly, their rewards!

1673866375979.png

The idea behind Ming, given that it starts at the size it does, is that every single external mission (without exceptions) will offer a diplomatic path / solution. You are already plenty big and if you don’t want to conquer directly (or even indirectly in most cases) you will not be forced to do so!

Something I wanted to implement based on feedback from 1.34 is this new “Event Insight”, a small summary of what the event is about and what its reward alludes to so as to give you some info before clicking it.
Before we move away from this mission tree, I should note that the second half of it, while largely inspired and based on the labors of Ming Emperors, is available to any Chinese Warlord who takes up the Mandate of Heaven, more details on that further down.
As mentioned earlier, 1.35 will introduce vast changes to the Mandate, so let’s tackle some of the biggest ones here:

1673866503220.png

(Note; W I P)
The Mandate now houses over 10 new Reforms inspired and heavily based upon actual reforms between the 15th and 19th century that the game covers.

  • Most of the new reforms can be completed at random order
  • Some are unlocked via the mission tree (that is common with the Chinese Warlords)
  • 2 of them are mutually exclusive with each other
  • Some may require a certain number of reforms passed (yay modability!)
  • Some require the country to move in a certain direction ( idea groups having been picked with alternative requirement, certain missions completed etc )
  • (Nearly) Every reform now impacts both the Emperor and their subjects, both tributaries and non-tributaries.
  • To account for the heightened number of reforms (and decrees) we increased the rate of Mandate growth and decay


We wanted to explore interesting rewards with the Mandate so we took the liberty and added new and interesting bonuses to some of the reforms, such as the ability to grant New Coordinator Offices, which work much like Holy Orders: The Buzhengshi, Anchasi and Du Si:

1673866699567.png

(Note; WIP)
Moving on, new Decrees were also added as we can see in the picture above.
Some of my favorites:
decree1.png

1673866740672.png
decree2.png


As with reforms, I wanted decrees to play an integral part in the gameplay around missions and events. So, decrees:
  • May now be required to be active by some missions
  • Will have their bonuses altered or increased by some missions
  • May themselves be requirements for certain reforms and vice versa

All these new additions are fully scripted and we very much look forward to seeing what you come up with!

1673866842346.png

As I mentioned before, the Chinese Warlords, Jurchen tribes, Manchu and Qing will receive new content.

The various new Chinese trees for Qing-related tags are split into 3 branches

  • The unique content of a nation which varies between Ming- |Qing/Jurchen/Manchu|-Chinese Warlords
  • The Emperor of China branch which deals with internal matters and administrating China
  • A third branch unique to the Qing only



The Chinese Warlords, meaning the releasables of Ming will also have their own little mission tree which will help them unite the Chinese lands and take up the Mandate of Heaven, which will then unlock the ‘Emperor of China mid-section of their tree (the bottom second part of the Ming tree):
Warlord tree.png

The missions are partially dynamic in terms of their requirements/rewards based on your capital's location

warlordreward2.png
warlordreward1.png


The Jurchen / Manchu will have access to newly redesigned missions that will follow the historical path of the Jianzhou but will be available to all regional tribes:


Screenshot_9.png

From subjugating neighbouring hordes, to knocking on the gates of the Great Ming by publishing the Seven Grievances. Along the way, powerful flavored bonuses, new cool rewards and historical immersion amount to a fun playthrough:

Every choice will have a different impact at the ‘Reforms of Nurhaci’ event later in the game! Nurhaci’s stats are random but heavily weighted to be really really good across the board. As a general he will serve as a 3/6/5/3 with a special new unique General trait inspired by his real life title of ‘Dragon-Tiger’ granting +10% Movement Speed and +10% Cav Combat Ability (more about new traits in a future DD). Lastly, as an advisor, he’s a level 3 Discipline Advisor at -90% of the cost and will also offer a flat 100 Mil Power.

1673867139493.png
laterJINmission.png


Upon taking the Mandate of Heaven you will unlock the Emperor of China part of your mission tree which is common between all of the tags (Ming, releasables etc) upon taking up the Mandate.

Forming Qing will offer brand new and freshly reworked missions. The first branch will be inherited by your tribal days. The second branch is the common ‘Emperor of China’ part and finally the third branch contains missions exclusively available to Qing:

QINGTREE.png

Many of these missions will feature very interesting rewards as shown below:

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Some cool rewards of the Emperor of China Branch available to either Ming, Qing or any Warlord with the Mandate:

1673867434598.png

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Thank you so much for taking the time to read through 2023’s first Dev Diary! I hope you are just as excited to delve into the new content as we were while making it! We will be back next week to talk about the new content we have created for… The Ottomans! Cheers!

PS: Special thanks to the Chinese modding community for valuable research sources!

chapel_Ming_DD.png
 

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Is there going to an event for this encyclopedia? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tiangong_Kaiwu

So I recently won some GAMIVO funds through World of Warships and ordered Steam codes for some more EU4 expansions through them. Specifically Mare Nostrum (for map theft), Rights of Man (for general/admiral traits), Rule Britannia (for innovativeness) and Leviathan for monuments (I play 90+% Ming which means money is not a problem). So back to EU4 for a moment, and... What is this?

For monuments, I noticed they put in Dujiangyan... good... and yet there is still no GRAND CANAL which is about 10x more important and valuable for trade than the Kiel Canal ever was. Here's hoping that's a 3-province monument apparently mentioned somewhere.

I also saw the Buddha statues on the wiki... um... there are a LOT more monuments to be had in or near China then.

1. How about this then? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leshan_Giant_Buddha That's the one that never really got forgotten for obvious reasons of VISIBILITY.

2. Dunhuang would also be a Buddhist site for those hordes that are Buddhist or Tengri, because as Wikipedia puts it:
"construction of new caves ceased entirely after the Yuan Dynasty. By then Islam had conquered much of Central Asia, and the Silk Road declined in importance when trading via sea-routes began to dominate Chinese trade with the outside world. During the Ming Dynasty, the Silk Road was finally officially abandoned, and Dunhuang slowly became depopulated and largely forgotten by the outside world. Most of the Mogao caves were abandoned; the site, however, was still a place of pilgrimage and was used as a place of worship by local people at the beginning of the twentieth century when there was renewed interest in the site."
Sounds like a Level 0 to me with a penalty if Ming tries to excavate it (i.e. build it up).

3. A third major Buddhist site relevant in Ming times: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Longmen_Grottoes "During the period of 1368 to 1912, when two dynasties ruled in China, namely the Ming dynasty from 1368 to 1644, and the Qing dynasty from 1644 to 1912, there was cultural revival and the Longmen Grottoes received recognition both at the national and international level."
National and International Level sounds like you gain global bonuses at Tier 2 and 3.

4. Any one of these sites listed here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dengfeng Probably Shaolin Temple, Songyang Academy or Gaocheng Astronomical Observatory... so in other words which one has more effect depends on the Idea Groups taken.

5. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tian_Shan Should be some sort of prestige bonus for Steppes Hordes or Chinese nations that control the full mountain range (remember in the "colour in controlled wastelands" option? That's what this is good for! A monument on a wasteland! Hold up thatmeans we can add the Uluru to the game, haha).

6. Something for Great Yu who controlled the floods in the Chinese civilization's flood myth. Perhaps https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yuwangtai_District "It is named after a shrine dedicated to Yu the Great, a legendary ruler in ancient China famed for his introduction of flood control. The temple was built in 1523 during the Ming Dynasty amid frequent flooding by the Yellow River."

I wonder when they'll finally add enough monuments in East Asia to be realistic to the start point description ("still the center of the world" I think it says if you choose the Asian 1444 bookmark)? Yeah, sure, most will be in China... but that's like saying most European monuments will be in ancient Roman lands. It's called the Sinosphere for a reason.
 
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Hey everyone, wanted to pop in and read through the last few pages I missed yesterday. I wanted to tackle some interesting points raised as well as a couple of concerns c:

(Not sure if you know this but I will type it up because I find it interesting) Interestingly, the Spanish Empire - which at the time controlled Potosi, supplied the silver for Ming demands, which was used to enact tax-related reforms (they were not successful and silver lost its value in China if memory serves right) this is reflected in the game.

Yes! Although I would love to see people try to cheese around that :p

This is incredible feedback and I am very thankful for this. I will try to look into it once we get to fixing bugs and ironing out these quirks, thank you so much!

1. This would have been a nice addition but unfortunately no. Ideas take time to make, get right and need a lot of localization.
2. Thank you for bringing this to my attention, I will take a crack at it when / if I have the time :)
As for your edit, that sounds cool but it was not in my plans!

The mission tree is not the only way to showcase progress and story-telling in the game, please do not go into the new content thinking it will include every aspect of the history of an Empire that spanned nearly 3 centuries!

Unfortunately no :/

In our nightlies they are most often united by a Warlord :D

Qing goes only as far as Tibet if memory serves right

Given that this is the Ming dev diary, I will say this: I chose to respect the -1000 malus *in most cases* I do not want to spoil the surprise but there is a mission for Ming that will put them against some very powerful would-be tributaries, with which Ming does not border!

Unfortunately no but as a player I like this idea and I firmly believe that these interesting paths are what gives the game such replayability

I believe the current maluses for Mandate are fairly well done. However, we may take another look at them to at least make sure we are happy with their current state. We got this!!
I'm glad people like my idea for a Republic of China route. And yeah I totally meant like as a player. Giving a mission/event for example that allows the Warlord to chose their path. Your choice then determines your mission Tree. Choices could be claiming the Mandate and trying to become the Emperor of China, or Republic of China, where you try to unite the region into a unified Republic. I also think Taiwan should have unique flavor and a unique mission tree.
 
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You might as well expect Li Zicheng to establish a peasant republic. At least he is a peasant uprising.
I'm glad people like my idea for a Republic of China route. And yeah I totally meant like as a player. Giving a mission/event for example that allows the Warlord to chose their path. Your choice then determines your mission Tree. Choices could be claiming the Mandate and trying to become the Emperor of China, or Republic of China, where you try to unite the region into a unified Republic. I also think Taiwan should have unique flavor and a unique mission tree.
 
I suggest that when you set up the Qing Dynasty, you automatically get the core of all China, rather than relying on the mission tree。The Ottomans had an exclusive CB to conquer the Mamluks, so why shouldn't the Qing have one too?This CB will allow the Qing to conquer the provinces in the China region with significantly fewer points needed and a lower level of notoriety
 
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Can Ming get access to the banner special unit after completing their missions? It seems all the mayor power get their special units only the power house in the 15th and 16th centuries does not.
 
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The Mandate now houses over 10 new Reforms inspired and heavily based upon actual reforms between the 15th and 19th century that the game covers.​

  • Most of the new reforms can be completed at random order
  • Some are unlocked via the mission tree (that is common with the Chinese Warlords)
  • 2 of them are mutually exclusive with each other
  • Some may require a certain number of reforms passed (yay modability!
Could you add the same moddability to the regular HRE reforms to allow us to create different “reform trees” and pass reforms in a different order ?
 
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Now that we're at China getting updates, i would really really like it if some older mechanics were better used. China didnt seek to expand much historically, so it would be nice to build into this. A GREAT way of doing this would be by removing the government capacity from the mandate of heaven government reform, as the mallices from being over government capacity ties well into limiting the usage of aggression. That would also make it more interesting for the player to work towards balancing their game early and mid game.

In other words, a bonus to development cost could be given instead of the gov capacity, which would immitate how China through its different dynasites, refrained from foreign conquest and relied on inward development.
 
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You might as well expect Li Zicheng to establish a peasant republic. At least he is a peasant uprising.
Obviously, this requires some imagination.
But this route is not impossible. At the end of the Ming Dynasty, some scholars put forward the view of questioning the monarchy.
However, the influence of these early enlighteners is very limited.
When the French Revolution broke out, the Chinese emperor Qianlong, who had close ties with the French royal family, expressed serious concern and took action to ban illegal underground organizations. This is also an important reason for China to further move towards conservative and closed.

Therefore, if we design this mission, we should set a prerequisite: there is a revolution in Europe. This can be extended to diplomatic missions with France (or other European powers),because the two sides at that time had common interests in confronting Britain and Russia.
However, it is regrettable that the latest French mission has no such content.
 
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Obviously, this requires some imagination.
But this route is not impossible. At the end of the Ming Dynasty, some scholars put forward the view of questioning the monarchy.
However, the influence of these early enlighteners is very limited.
When the French Revolution broke out, the Chinese emperor Qianlong, who had close ties with the French royal family, expressed serious concern and took action to ban illegal underground organizations. This is also an important reason for China to further move towards conservative and closed.

Therefore, if we design this mission, we should set a prerequisite: there is a revolution in Europe. This can be extended to diplomatic missions with France (or other European powers),because the two sides at that time had common interests in confronting Britain and Russia.
However, it is regrettable that the latest French mission has no such content.
Gu yanwu?In fact, the theory that the people are more important than the monarch has been around for a long time in China, such as “Confucius and Mencius”.The Mencius school of Confucianism, for example.
However, Zhu Yuanzhang himself did not like Mencius.
The great ideological change in the late Ming and early Qing dynasties was largely caused by the incompetence of the Ming Dynasty, the failure of the Shun Dynasty and the brutality of the Qing Dynasty. Wang Fuzhi said that China would rather give up China to Chinese thieves than to Manchuria. Republic if you really want to do, in fact, zheng chenggong to consider, in a similar Dutch dual system, the rare sea power and commercial power in Chinese history. Loyal to the Ming Dynasty but not a Zhu family, suitable to be Lord Protector.
 
Gu yanwu?In fact, the theory that the people are more important than the monarch has been around for a long time in China, such as “Confucius and Mencius”.The Mencius school of Confucianism, for example.
However, Zhu Yuanzhang himself did not like Mencius.
The great ideological change in the late Ming and early Qing dynasties was largely caused by the incompetence of the Ming Dynasty, the failure of the Shun Dynasty and the brutality of the Qing Dynasty. Wang Fuzhi said that China would rather give up China to Chinese thieves than to Manchuria. Republic if you really want to do, in fact, zheng chenggong to consider, in a similar Dutch dual system, the rare sea power and commercial power in Chinese history. Loyal to the Ming Dynasty but not a Zhu family, suitable to be Lord Protector.
It is difficult for Zheng Chenggong to hope for republicanism, because the restoration of the Ming Dynasty is obviously more appealing politically. It is difficult for ordinary people under the influence of absolutism to have political consciousness in a short time. The dynasty is bound to the family. Once the ruling family changes, the name of the Ming will become meaningless.

I don't like to place my hope on several historical figures.
The mission of republicanism should meet multiple conditions : A strong enough burghers estates, a large number of universities, a poorly performing government , and the exemplary role of other countries.
China's monarchy collapsed like sand in 1911. The autocratic monarchy completely exhausted its vitality, a series of setbacks and failed reforms have made people realize that the royal family's greed for power has reached the point of extreme selfishness and shamelessness.
Considering this fact, China's republicanism in the game should only be realized through revolution.
 
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