Europa Universalis IV - Development Diary 21st of February 2023 - Spain

[NarcomancerPL]

When are we going to able to switch color of country?

The Spain is very much luminescent. It is actually blinding in the long run hence just because of this I may not and will not prefer to play it.

Is it actually too hard to implement this option to the game?

Note: I am not programmer so I am not able to do it myself.

You don't need to be a programmer to do it. It's basic modding. If you want to know how to do it dm I can explain it to you it should be even Ironman combatibile

 

[Hermerico]

They were superpower mainly because of their colonies

That's kind of the problem innit?
I have never seen G.B conquering all of India in a playthrough, unlike they did irl (best i saw was France conquering half of it).

I'm not saying G.B should always do it, afterall it was kind of bizzare lucky move that they did it irl, but even if they don't at least they should reliably dominate Indonesia (which to be fair, they often do).

 

[isnaa]

What about culture converting in new world? ai seems to not converting at all, so you cant simply put holy orders, it also breaks the immersion when in 1800s are full nahuatl aztec and mayan mexico and totemist ''culture gore'' north america

 

[EUnderhill]

What about culture converting in new world? ai seems to not converting at all, so you cant simply put holy orders, it also breaks the immersion when in 1800s are full nahuatl aztec and mayan mexico and totemist ''culture gore'' north america

I'm not sure even by 2023 the culture conversion has completed...one of the challenges we face at the food pantry is many of our recent arrivals from Mexico and Guatemala don't speak Spanish. Having the countryside convert religiously, but not culturally, seems quite period-appropriate.

 

[morlin]

When are we going to able to switch color of country?

The Spain is very much luminescent. It is actually blinding in the long run hence just because of this I may not and will not prefer to play it.

Is it actually too hard to implement this option to the game?

Note: I am not programmer so I am not able to do it myself.

Good idea

i'd like to see custom names upon reaching empire level aswell a la CK2

Same tag, same mission tree and ideas just different name. Purely cosmetic

Since its already possible upon creating a client state and colonial nation it shouldnt be too hard to implement

 

[NarcomancerPL]

What about culture converting in new world? ai seems to not converting at all, so you cant simply put holy orders, it also breaks the immersion when in 1800s are full nahuatl aztec and mayan mexico and totemist ''culture gore'' north america

Maybe EU IV should introduce something similar to how cultures work in CK3?
I mean it's borderline unrealistic for CK, but it would be actually pretty good fit for EU and it would make colonised Mexico as England and colonised Mexico as Spain something completely different

 

[Hermerico]

Maybe EU IV should introduce something similar to how cultures work in CK3?
I mean it's borderline unrealistic for CK, but it would be actually pretty good fit for EU and it would make colonised Mexico as England and colonised Mexico as Spain something completely different

It should belong to a dynamic culture group.
Mexican would spawn in Mexico, regardless of the colonizer's culture, however, if it is colonised by the English it would become part of the British culture group, if by the French, then on the French culture group.

Some places could have dynamic names too, like French in Canada becoming Quebecois

 

[NarcomancerPL]

It should belong to a dynamic culture group.
Mexican would spawn in Mexico, regardless of the colonizer's culture, however, if it is colonised by the English it would become part of the British culture group, if by the French, then on the French culture group.

Some places could have dynamic names too, like French in Canada becoming Quebecois

That's also a good idea. I think they can definietely do it. There are mechanics like that in the game already

 

[isnaa]

It should belong to a dynamic culture group.
Mexican would spawn in Mexico, regardless of the colonizer's culture, however, if it is colonised by the English it would become part of the British culture group, if by the French, then on the French culture group.

Some places could have dynamic names too, like French in Canada becoming Quebecois

its weird when mexico remains castillian but canada become mexican

 

[Hermerico]

its weird when mexico remains castillian but canada become mexican

It makes no sense for Mexican to be anywhere other than Mexico.

Mexican doesn't mean "Spanish speaking in America" it is actually a local endonym from Náhuatl, so it really should only spawn in Mexico, regardless of who colonizes it.
"American" on the other hand could indeed have spawned anywhere the British colonized since it fits all of the American continent.

 

[klingonadmiral]

Why exactly do Golden Century owners have to pay a second time?

 

[Lightwell]

I have never seen G.B conquering all of India in a playthrough, unlike they did irl (best i saw was France conquering half of it).

EU4 doesn't have the mechanics necessary to replicate the Bengal War, and neither players nor AI are weak enough for it to happen in that portion of the game. The only option left is drowning the country in marines and mercenaries.

 

[TheArche]

One question i have @Pavía , will you be adding new missions for Granada/Andalucia as well? Reason, with all the new modifiers Aragon and Castille are geting it would almost be imposible to counter them. Also since new Holy Orders are coming for Catholic Iberians what about Muslim Iberians?

And lastly one suggestion for Jerusalem/Crusader states. Would it be possible to add Holly Orders for them or at least if Jerusalem is formed?

Can at the very least they also get additional holy orders? Would feel weird if the christians can choose between 10+ of them, while the muslims still have only the 3.

I also think that some more holy orders for muslim iberians would be great. But even more important would be the following addition to the existing muslim holy orders, typically only used by Andalusia:

trigger = {
culture_group = iberian
religion_group = muslim
}

I was unpleasantly surprised when I lost access to holy orders after changing my primary culture from Andalusian to Mexican, as a former colonial nation in NA. I would really enjoy this feature if made accessible to all (muslim) Iberians, or at least for Mexican, Brazilian etc.

Also thanks for the dev diaries! I'm always excited to hear the news about the new DLC which sounds pretty awesome so far.

 

[klingonadmiral]

And speaking of the Spanish ideas, we are currently having a debate in the team about what to do with the Artillery Fire modifier, if to keep them as they are in the different idea sets, or replace them with something else. On this topic, we would like to hear out the opinion of the community, as this might be somewhat of a controversial issue (so, please, be civic while debating it!)

Artillery Fire is like the one reason to pick the otherwise average Spanish idea set.

 

[Wendigo514]

I also think that some more holy orders for muslim iberians would be great. But even more important would be the following addition to the existing muslim holy orders, typically only used by Andalusia:

trigger = {
culture_group = iberian
religion_group = muslim
}

I was unpleasantly surprised when I lost access to holy orders after changing my primary culture from Andalusian to Mexican, as a former colonial nation in NA. I would really enjoy this feature if made accessible to all (muslim) Iberians, or at least for Mexican, Brazilian etc.

Also thanks for the dev diaries! I'm always excited to hear the news about the new DLC which sounds pretty awesome so far.

While we are at it, I'd like Muslim Holy Orders enabled at least to Maghrebi culture group too, since Golden Century focused on Maghreb, and maybe others according to their description.

 

[Voxtant]

Imho the culture coversion on colonies should be a must in this update.

Also some colonization missions' rewards should be changed.

 

[EUnderhill]

Imho the culture coversion on colonies should be a must in this update.

Also the colonization missions' rewards should be changed.

I'd be more interested in an ability to destroy buildings in my subjects (subject to a loyalty hit if not replaced immediately with something of equal or greater cost.)

 

[Hermerico]

Artillery Fire is like the one reason to pick the otherwise average Spanish idea set.

+15% Morale and +5 Discipline is average
Only Prussia and Poland have better modifiers than this, France used to too, but got reworked last DD.

Naval-wise it's decent, could be better tbh, it doesnt come close to Britain, Norway or Denmark and up untill Trafalgar it was arguably on pair with Britain, but it's above average nevertheless.
This is why i believe they should replace the +1 Artillery fire to an exclusively naval bonus, yes they were competent on land too but they are already top 3, and even without the +1 Fire they remain a solid top 5, expecially considering they also get very strong (possibly the strongest so far) unique units and +25% land morale rewards for easy peasy missons in their tree.

+1 Diplo policy is a nice versatile idea, it essentially allows you to "pick your own idea" from the diplo policy list.

Colonially it's the undisputed best (as it should ofc)

 

[BurningEGO]

Green suits better only for republican period, or Estado Novo, like in HOI series.

Blue is much better for monarchy.

I may agree that the metallic-blue tint may not be the best choice (I prefer Dahomey's colour personally), but green isn't suitable for the era, where Portugal is monarchy. Especially seeing that historical Portugal's troops colour is blue, and devs made it already before changing the country's colour.

Sure, you may become a republic (even a revolutionary one) by choice, but, unlike HOI4, your colour wouldn't change - for good or ill.

P.S. What's the basis for Red Portugal though?

Green is suited for Republican Portugal, but it should be used for this time too, because what the House of Avis added was green to the existing coat of arms. The order of Avis itself has a big Green Cross as its coat of arms.

Blue was only used, as I stated, during absolutism/past spanish reign. You will not be seeing the half blue - half white flag until later on, during Victoria III's timeframe, 1830 more exactly. Only in there, would it make sense to have a blue Portugal.

Even in the 1640's war for independence, troops widely used a flag with green background and a red/white cross on top of it.

You can check for yourself in Wiki. Not the best article, but it gives an idea. I wouldn't really like to see red for Portugal, but since the cross of St George and the cross of the order of Christ are red (and this last one was used widely across navies and armies), it would make more sense than Blue, honestly. That or white. Blue would look good probably, but thats that.

Seriously? Spain (Hispania) was the name for all of Iberia since Roman times, and many Visigoth kings styled themselves Kings of Hispania. All Iberian monarchies prior to the formation of the polity of Spain were Spanish. What the Spanish (erstwhile Castillian) monarchs did was appropriate a term that meant all of Iberia for their own realm, which I believe the Portuguese monarchy complained about.

In an alt-history scenario where Portugal unites Iberia, the word Spain wouldn't have its OTL modern political meanings, and I'm sure they would use it for their new greater kingdom.

Only the Castilian Kings (during this time at least, and in the example we are speaking of) actually claimed to be the direct heirs of the Visigothic Kingdom. The Portuguese never had such pretension. The Portuguese King did, and had in fact, more legitimate claims to the Castilian throne than the pretender ruling it (more than once), but that was that. We never wanted to claim/conquer Aragon or land owned by Navarra.

Almost all of Portugal (and good part of Galicia) was actually settled by the Suebi back then, so all of the Visigothic non-sense ruling other Iberian realms never actually occured in here. And I will repeat what I said in another example: If Poland conquered Russia, Poland wouldn't want to form Russia, since the Polish would be the clear superiors of the slavic family. Russia is composed of Muscovites and others, just like in the Iberian/Spanish case (Castilians, Catalans, etc). Portugal wouldn't want to form Spain, just like Poland would have no urge to form Russia. It is a non sense to even hear these things in an alt-history scenario, because of the grudges always involved and the rivalries between peoples. Not to mention, differences, that evolved and kept existing across ages. Or the simple loss of power involved in many cases, since you would have to elevate others as your equals for instance.

The times of unity were actually few, and usually, turbulent, and there was always a clear distinction between other Celt-Iberian/Iberian peoples and the Lusitanian, if we want to go as far as possible. I mean, even back on the pre-roman times, the barbarians of (almost) all of Spain were pretty identical, except for the Lusitanian, which were the last to be conquered and used weapons / armour / tactics (and lived differently, culturally and even religiously) than others on the peninsula. The Suebi were also pretty different than the Visigoths, and so the Portuguese continued the tradition of being different and unique on this peninsula.

Would Poland form Russia if it conquered/united all of the people's of Russia? I say Poland because Poland belongs to the big Slavic family, but I could go state the same for Serbia and others. The answer is pretty obvious to me. Portugal is in the same position. Novgorod (Novgorodian?) and others (East Slavic group) can form Russia, but Poland/Serbia cannot, despite all of them being Slavic. The difference between these peoples (West and East Slavic) are/were huge, despite all of them being Slavic. Paradox cannot understand that the same difference existed between Portugal and the other people's of Iberia.

The only ones that were somewhat related to the Portuguese, were the Galicians, because we were tied in the close past in more than one ocasion and in many regards, but the Galician similarities/identity were largely destroyed by the Castilians later on because that was usually a source of weakness in their realm that the Portuguese usually used very well against their enemies. The Galicians themselves hated their Castilian overlords more than loved them, and that usually spoke for itself.

We can try to be historically accurate, or try to be historically accurate, or we can go into the realms of fantasy and try to believe everyone on the Peninsula were just "hermanos" (brothers). That is a modern fantasy, that only truly works for politicians when they want to gain something from it. Russians only saw their slavic breathren as "brothers" when they wanted to impose their own Russian law-sovereignty over them, and not to create a new Slavic order on the world. Similarly, the Portuguese would never want to create an Hispanian/Spanish new order by creating Spain in an alt-history scenario. Castilians did "create (modern/in-game) Spain", because they wanted to gain legitimacy from that idea, just like the Muscovites "created modern/in-game Russia". I mean, both notions existed before either Castilians or Muscovites decided to gain something from it, and both results are different ideas than what they were originally.

 

[brifbates]

+15% Morale and +5 Discipline is average
Only Prussia and Poland have better modifiers than this, France used to too, but got reworked last DD.

Those two statements don't really equate. More specifically, +15% morale is NOT average, in fact it is very good, especially having it from the start of the game while most nations have no morale boost at all. The +5% discipline is standard for most of the stronger nations (with the notable exception of Muscovy/Russia whose military ideas are and always have been lacking),