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HOI4 Dev Diary - Chain of Command

Hi everyone and welcome back to regular dev diaries. This and upcoming diaries will be covering stuff happening in the 1.5 "Cornflakes" update as well as the unannounced expansion that will come out together with it. One of the main focuses of those can be summarized as "making players care more about armies, leaders and troops" (our DLCs tend to have 1-3 main focuses or missions). The first feature that touches on this, and the topic of today's dev diary is adding a military chain of command to the game.

After Hearts of Iron III, where something like organizing the soviet chain of command could take about an hour of the players time we decided that we wanted something that was a lot less effort to work with for HOI4. We basically settled on a flat level with field marshals with no restriction on commanded divisions, and generals with a limit on division count but with a different set of traits. Over time we felt that we lost a bit too much of the WW2 military flavor with this abstraction, so we started thinking about how to do it in a more interesting way.

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What we have done now for 1.5 is that field marshals are now leading an Army Group, which is a certain number of Armies (what we had before) led by Generals. There are then places in theaters as before. Theaters are like before just a geographical organizational tool for the player and don't have a commander or the like to keep them as flexible as possible. This means that we have a Theaters->Army Groups->Armies->Divisions structure now.
While the Generals still come with a soft cap for how many divisions they can efficiently command, the field marshals will now have a number of armies they can efficiently command.

I also want to make sure to point out that this is still very early on in development, so stuff is very likely to change, and some stuff aren't completely working as it should yet. So we are showing you this in progress rather than showing a completely finished feature, and as always any numbers you see are extremely subject to change ;) Also I very sneekily hid the topbar for now ;)
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When it comes to controlling your troops the new system introduces some changes to the battle planner. You can either do a plan for each army in the army group, or have a central plan for the whole Army Group where each army has a part of the frontline assigned as its responsibility. You can also do a mix, in which case an Army will finish its plan and then fall back to executing the Army Group's plan. We are still iteration on this stuff though but I figured you all wanted to know how it would work in practice.

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Something that does not really come across in the images is that we are working on ways to streamline the process for setting up fronts using the new army groups. This should make at least the basic cases feel smooth to set up, even with one more command level and more armies without a ton of extra clicking.

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The sharp eyed reader will also notice that we have removed the skill level for generals. This is now replaced with separate skills of different kinds. Attack, Defense, Planning and Logistics. Attack and Defense do what you expect while Planning improves planning speed and Logistics lowers supply consumption. Field marshal stats apply together with army general stats at a reduced capacity, so you will always want to have a chain of command for best efficiency.

The chain of command feature is going to be part of the free update, although there is some cool DLC features that tie into it we will be revealing in later diaries. Also expect to read more details about the system itself like how things in combat are affected etc.

See you next week when we will be taking a look at national unity...
 
Would it be possible to add something similar to the naval command structure? Like you assign ships to divisions, which you then in turn assign to fleets, because the way the interface works right now it's really annyoing to make a new fleet when you want to help out your troops on land by doing shore bombardment or using carrier airwings while keeping the sea area patrolled at the same time, since it dumps the ship you seperate at random points if you don't place a hold order beforehand. It would be nice, if I could just pick a BatDiv or a CarDiv with a DesDiv or two out of the fleet while the remaining ships continue their mission.

I would think it would make sense to have a different two-level structure:
- rename the current fleets as Task Forces (for when you want a unit in a particular place for a particular purpose, such as surface combat or shore bombardment)
- but have a Fleet level above them for tasks which are spread over a number of strategic areas, such as convoy escort or commerce raiding.

So your "Atlantic Fleet" has many units spread across the North Atlantic, assigned to convoy escort. On the map, they flow from area to area without any player intervention. Then when you get a pop-up saying there's a sub attack in the Denmark Strait, you can either leave it to the local forces (whichever of the Atlantic Fleet's forces happen to be in the relevant area at the time), or create a "Task Force" subsidiary to the fleet, which summons the specific ships that you want to throw in to the particular battle.

You could then have two levels of Admiral and Commodore or Admiral and Rear-Admiral, so that PDX can just copy across the code and data structures for Field Marshals and Generals.
 
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they have to be field marshals to do it. independent armies still work, but generally you will want to have a full chain for the bonuses
What are the seperate skill levels capped at?

Is it level 10? If so, I don't think it is wise to give the Germans max level logistics as they historically had a lot of problems on the eastern front.

Perhaps you could tie logistics to an overall army motorization level which could be modeled by the amount of motorized you have in your stockpile.

And on that note, why are we not able to CONVERT motorized to motorized rocket artillery. (or even to primitive mechanized in that regard)

Towed artillery that uses both motorized and the respective artillery brigade (aa, at, and art)

I would consider reducing the amount of army xp required to change up templates to 1( for all brigades, heck maybe even 0) as keeping the way it is in the present creates the tedious meta of deleting all but one division to train for army xp. This could somewhat alleviate the problem of cookie cutter division designs that nations are forced to use due to limited army xp.

You could alternatively change the land doctrines to maybe alter combat width of brigades (or the entire battlefield) to encourage variability in design. Maybe removing the soft attack bonuses from SF and lowering the combat width of artillery, lowering the combat width (and production cost) of tanks and mot/mech for deep battle (move the infantry combat width reduction to the first branching tech as it creates problems if you want to switch doctrine mid war and for that matter why does the reduction not apply to special forces?). Grand battle plan could increase the amount of support battalions able to be carried in a division and give bonuses to attacking fortifications/naval invasions. Mobile warfare can remain unchanged as +60% breakthrough for tanks is HUGE.
 
There will be limitiations about range, but we havent implemented a solution as of yet. We'll talk about it when we have the followup diary with more details in the future



yes
will we be able to refit naval vessels and que up entire fleet compositions?

Will subs be actually useful in killing convoys and trade? right now you can just reset the trade deal and efficiency is back to 100%
 
Does this apply to navies as well?

Will we never be able to go down the the corps level? I feel that that is a better place to stop than armies. I can see myself keeping one corp as a permanent unit and moving them around to different theaters like we did in HoI II than a whole army.

I guess that begs the question as to whether it will be modifiable to create different "command levels".
 
I'm not a fan of HoI4 or PDX, but this is obviously a step in the right direction.
 
The sharp eyed reader will also notice that we have removed the skill level for generals. This is now replaced with separate skills of different kinds. Attack, Defense, Planning and Logistics. Attack and Defense do what you expect while Planning improves planning speed and Logistics lowers supply consumption.

Cool ! I remember making a suggestion or two like that in one thread or another. Replacing the "skill" single statistic with some other ones, which is a bit more like crusader kings 2.
 
This is great and all, but I would prefer a reasonable resource system where resources actually matter. Right now your ability to run an infinite number of super heavy tanks or super battleships on any economy is just ludicrous.
 
Will this include divisional commanders in the future?
 
A welcome addition of a bit more depth to the CoC. I personally would enjoy seeing corps introduced in some form but I'm happy to give this a good play when it hits the game!

Is there any coordination between Army groups so that front lines don't expand into another groups territory? Actually is there any plans to do this for all front lines in general?

Will the leaders skills in attack, defence, planning and logistics change (up or down) with game play?
I would don't know how it would work exactly but I would love a system for this, about the worst quality of life feature for me in HOI4 is the front lines overlapping all the time.
 
they have to be field marshals to do it. independent armies still work, but generally you will want to have a full chain for the bonuses
This sounds familiar to HoI 3, I assume the AI will be thought to use the boni too? Otherwise it will become the same problem we had in HoI 3 were players will have an advantage over the AI because it doesn't understand how to get the boni from the CoC.
 
I know you guys have put a lot of work into the battle planner, but it just does not work for the things I try to do. I have given up on it and just take the penalty for not planning. I think it could be a viable tool if you put more functionality into it, or if there was a mode where the player could take more control of executing the plan. Here are some specific things that cause me problems:
1 I set the divisions where I want them to dig in, then when I create a front the AI starts moving them around instead of digging in
2 I want to encircle and destroy the enemy, so I want a large line to hold position, and in some places pin the enemy, then in specific key places my armor units force a breach and encircle, then reinforcement infantry follow armor into the breach to hold the encirclement. Trying to use the battle planner to accomplish this is nearly impossible.
3 Getting the AI to close an encirclement or to move a line forward without opening breaches in the line is difficult.

What I am asking is to either make the battle planner a more functional tool where you can create more complex plans, or to make it more optional. With this dev diary it looks like you are making it more integral to the game without fixing the deficiencies.

I know it sounds like I am being a Debbie Downer today, but as is, I find the battle planner a very frustrating aspect of the game.
 
Will it be possible to send a full army--complete with general--to another player as an expeditionary force, which the receiving player can then slot into an army group under his own field marshal?

That would make EFs feel a lot cleaner and more immersive.
 
I'm not perfect but damn is this thread a testament to people refusing to read the dev diary before asking questions that have already been answered.